Fulham 1-1 Wolves: Boxing Day Verdict Thread

[Dire Wolf]

Yes, we are 10th. Excellent.

I'm saying it's very entitled to expect to rock up to an away Premier League game and walk away with the points.

You never answered my question, we have won 6 of the 10 games against teams below us, you presumably expect us to be winning 8 or 9, yes?

Again that, in my opinion, is a load of bullshit.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

We have had decent results against bottom half teams. If of course you include the ones that apparently don't count.

Again that, in my opinion, is a load of bullshit.

You're a real charmer, Toon.

 

[Tredman]

Nuno's way is to take each game on its own merit. By that method I would imagine he would be disappointed with yesterday. As another poster also said recently we should follow his view and not pay much attention to the table atm

 

[Dire Wolf]

So you don't agree we underperformed against Huddersfield, Cardiff and Fulham, and that if we'd played anything close to how we are capable of playing then we would have won those games? That's not entitlement at all. It's just expecting the best, and being disappointed at less than that.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

Excellent then, we should have won 10 out of 10.

Good to know. Not entitled at all.

 

[Siggy]

The points tally is excellent and I don't think there are many that are unhappy with where we sit in the league table but there is a clear difference in teams that open up and attack and those that sit back. If we are constructively pointing out where performances could improve then it is against those sides that sit and ask us to break them down, it is one of our weaknesses.

Yesterday for example on several occasions lacked the tempo to get the ball in the right areas early enough in favor of ball retention. Whilst we passed it around at the back Fulham got everyone back and it made our task that little bit harder. I am not suggesting we "gerrrit forward" like the old days but I think we do need to consider how we move the ball and when is the right time to try the slightly trickier pass rather than holding on to it.

Nuno left Traore in as he did reasonably well against Liverpool and its very easy for us to say in hindsight that it was wrong to do that but it was, Cav can operate in tight areas and doesn't rely on pace to get the job done.

We also need a plan B for Mitrovic!!

 

[Dire Wolf]

Excellent then, we should have won 10 out of 10.

Good to know. Not entitled at all.

Sarcastic bullshit. Make a sensible argument.

 

[Keef]

Not bumping an old thread but I would argue that its nothing like entitlement. Its as expected. Almost 60% went top 10. Given who we had signed, who we had and how we had played the optimism was rightly high. It still is , but that doesnt mean we cant and wont whinge when things are not right.

https://screenshots.firefox.com/F700m4V4xi2Wi4PY/www.wolvesforum.co.uk

And while I was there I looked at what I expected us to get of each team or rather would be happy with.

I was asked what I would say was ok for wolves to expect this season and I told the person about this thread. He wanted more depth so I went through the league. Would I be happy if we took the following points off the league? Yep.
Arsenal 1pt
Bournemouth 4pts
Brighton 3pts
Burnley 3pts
Cardiff 4 pts
Chelsea 1pt
Crystal Palace 3pts
Everton 3 pts
Fulham 3 pts
Huddersfield 4 pts
Leciester 3pts
Liverpool 1pt
Man City 1 pt
Man Utd 1pt
Newcastle 3 pts
Southampton 4 pts
Spurs 1 pt
Watford 4pts
West ham 4 pts

That would give us 51 points.


Those in green we have achieved or exceeded. Those in Yellow we could achieve. Those in red we cant now achieve. I cant say thats entitled.

Thanks for putting it up in red/green, I'm colourblind it all looks the same on a moniter

 

[Johnny75]

So you don't agree we underperformed against Huddersfield, Cardiff and Fulham, and that if we'd played anything close to how we are capable of playing then we would have won those games? That's not entitlement at all. It's just expecting the best, and being disappointed at less than that.

I'd have taken the win over Chelsea rather than a win against any of the sides you've listed.

With your and others logic you'd have been happy to have been humped against Chelsea but win against the perceived lower teams. Or would you expect both?

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

Sarcastic bullshit. Make a sensible argument.

You might find this amazing, but it actually isn't much fun talking to you with that kind of tone, so I'll pass.

 

[HanDoJin]

Worth remembering that the bottom 4-5 in the PL would still whip the top half of the Championship much, much more often than not. Look at our games against Swansea last season, and they were deservedly relegated. Fulham romped home in the end last season but are exactly where they deserve to be right now.

We've played like shit a couple of times and been deservedly beaten, but our points tally and overall play up to this point have been excellent given the standard of opposition, and the novelty of all bar one of our players in this division. Cheer up kids

Sent from my SM-G960W using Tapatalk

 

[Deleted Cyber]

Thanks for putting it up in red/green, I'm colourblind it all looks the same on a moniter

Watford Huddersfield Cardiff are red
Arsenal Burnley Chelsea Palace Man City Man Utd and Newcastle are green. The rest are yellow.

The only side we have overperfromed from this initial lot is chelsea.

And yes Johnny 75- Great as it is to beat chelsea I would have prefrered to have beaten Huddersfield at home because as a newly promoted side you start the season expecting 12 losses against the big six and any points there are a bonus. You hope not to lose at home but any away points are a real treat to so Man Utd at old Trafford is a great point. Its only wonderful if we now dont lose at home to them. IMHO

I dont get some on here. Its ok for some to critique but not others? Of course we are pleased to be where we are and generally chuffed to fuck to have 26 points but how we got those 26 points and where we got those 26 points has been quite varied and inconsistent. So, surely its right to highlight it? Debate it? Disagree or find compromise?

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

No-one's saying that we're immune from criticism, we weren't good yesterday (we weren't bad either IMO).

There is however a growing delusion that we're entitled to just waltz into away games and stroll away with the points. Who exactly do you think we are?

 

[Deleted Cyber]

No-one's saying that we're immune from criticism, we weren't good yesterday (we weren't bad either IMO).

There is however a growing delusion that we're entitled to just waltz into away games and stroll away with the points. Who exactly do you think we are?

There seems to be a bit of you reading this when its not the case, particularly on here. I am struggling to find any comments that display what you have paraphrased.

I have found plenty of posts that- paraprase- could do betters, should do betters, didnt play wells, poor first halves, poor second halves, poor finishing , poor defending from set pieces, poor goalkeeping and then great defending , great saves, clinical finish , great break and great moves but no post that says we deserve to win by turning up. Not one.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

Well as I've asked you twice (and I'll ask again until I get an answer) - we have got six wins from our 10 games against the bottom half, you seem to feel this is unacceptable, so how many should we be winning?

And the point develops from there.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

Oh and the matchday threads on here are ridiculously negative, every single game. Go back and read them if you like. Every single time they're basically 90% posts just slagging us off. And not even all of them are Jinky's posts.

 

[Siggy]

I agree on the Matchday thread being very negative but I think I have mentioned before the Wolves anxiety effect and I am fairly certain I am not the only one that suffers from this. It's a good job my old man doesn't post his thoughts on here during match they are almost exclusively negative.

That said I do think Cyber and others have a point about our performances maybe not so much the results. We have performed better against better sides and I fully believe it is because we are a very good counter attacking team.

It is only natural that expectations rise as the club grows, as long as they are reasonable and criticism is constructive I think it's a healthy thing to have.

Since Fosun took over it's been fabulous and I am enjoying it immensely but if we are to achieve their ambitions certain aspects of our play will have to improve.

 

[Deleted Cyber]

Well as I've asked you twice (and I'll ask again until I get an answer) - we have got six wins from our 10 games against the bottom half, you seem to feel this is unacceptable, so how many should we be winning?

And the point develops from there.

No your assumption is that is unacceptable.

My point , was , is , and has been that defeats at home to Huddersfield away to Cardiff and a draw against Fulham were all poor perfromances and we did not perform to the level and standard that we have in other matches against opposition higher in the table. I even went to the trouble of showing how the teams around us have faired against those teams I mentioned. Just to give a realistic comparison. However until we play both home and away The point is moot. We are only half way through. If that turns into 12 wins then happy days. I will however, still be just as pissed off if we win 12 of those against the bottom ten and contrive to lose to Huddersfield twice and Cardiff twice. Because they are both crap. And one or even both will be in the championship next year.(probably)

Lets take any sport. Lets go cricket. England beat Austrailia in the ashes at home, then lose to bangladesh away. Or even worse beat australia away then lose to Bangladesh at home. England are not the best team in the world but if they lose to a team near the bottom of the cricket league would you be happy?

If you cannot see the frustration that comes when your team is beating or holding the acknowledged best teams yet gets out played, out thought and ultimately beaten by a team acknowledged statistically to be significantly worse then youre very lucky! Cause it grips my shit.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

I treat everything on its merits. We deserved to beat Chelsea, we deserved to lose to Huddersfield. I don't care where they were in the league.

 

[darlowolf64]

Or, lets take international football...

England play a high ranked Spain (for example) who play their own game and attack. England win 3-2 because the way Spain have played has allowed England to play their own style.
England play against a "minnow" who pack their defence and the England game plan no longer works because the little team have set up to use spoil tactics. It is a nod to how good England can be that they do this*



*See Wolves