Cardiff 2 v Wolves 1 verdict thread

[PuntsWolf]

But he's offside and continues to run offside and at no point ever gets onside. It's awful positional play and awareness from a RB.

 

[darlowolf64]

One of the luxuries of a big squad should be to do some rotation on midweek games. It was fairly obvious that after running his arse off on Saturday, Edwards could have done with being rested.
He's no world beater, but in hindsight a fresh Price would have been a better option.
Let's see what Prince does when he comes back - we could really do with him delivering the goods, though I have my doubts.

Pretty soon we should have a fit again fresh Prince...

 

[MARKakaJIM]

But he's offside and continues to run offside and at no point ever gets onside. It's awful positional play and awareness from a RB.

He's onside when he first makes the run because Stearman is dropping back on the other side too, if Iorfa doesn't go with it then it's a really easy pass down the side of Batth. It's only when the ball comes to Pilkington that Iorfa has slightly overcooked it and ended up deeper than Stearman but that's what happens unless you stop dead on your last man and cross your fingers that the pass hasn't been played yet.

 

[Derby Wolf]

That says as much about Lambert as it does the Board. Villa, Cardiff and Derby have all changed their manager and seen an appreciable improvement in results. If we'd employed Warnock he would have at least drilled the defence and doubled the protection in front of them.

I'm not sure it does. The players in Villas and Derbys squads had no business in the bottom six when Bruce and McClaren came in.

However Ikeme, Edwards, Coady, Price, Doherty, Saville, Wallace and Batth are varying degrees of lower Championship and mid-top end League One in quality. Most are automatic starters so we can't possibly expect anything in terms of a new manager bounce when we're at the exact same level the better players in that list are capable of much less the poorer but still getting games ones.

What I'd love to know is what input Lambert had in extending Edwards contract or if this was done by Thelwell over his head?

 

[slink]

He's onside when he first makes the run because Stearman is dropping back on the other side too, if Iorfa doesn't go with it then it's a really easy pass down the side of Batth. It's only when the ball comes to Pilkington that Iorfa has slightly overcooked it and ended up deeper than Stearman but that's what happens unless you stop dead on your last man and cross your fingers that the pass hasn't been played yet.

Iorfa did the right thing in following his man who was onside as he made the run and it would have been an easy through the ball. The problem after that is the midfield are out of position and Saiss and Edwards are not in a position to follow Pilkington and then Batth going to press forces the pass but he had to press at some point or you run the risk of a clear shot from the edge of the box.

 

[MARKakaJIM]

Iorfa did the right thing in following his man who was onside as he made the run and it would have been an easy through the ball. The problem after that is the midfield are out of position and Saiss and Edwards are not in a position to follow Pilkington and then Batth going to press forces the pass but he had to press at some point or you run the risk of a clear shot from the edge of the box.

Batth doesn't really press though, he literally stands still and waits for the player to come on to him at which point he's so rooted that he can't really do anything to try make life difficult for Cardiff, he's just a stationary obstacle that's easily bypassed.

The three of them needed to stick together, not something they often do admittedly, so it becomes difficult to play the ball between them and the man on the ball has a decision to make, does he wait and hope something opens up but possibly gets caught by one of Wolves midfielders in doing so? Try to force through a pass that's not really on? Take the shot himself from distance? In the end it was easy for him because Batth just broke the backline, he either had the easy pass to Pilkington or the no.33 depending on which one Iorfa went with.

 

[Norman Deeley]

I'm not sure it does. The players in Villas and Derbys squads had no business in the bottom six when Bruce and McClaren came in.

However Ikeme, Edwards, Coady, Price, Doherty, Saville, Wallace and Batth are varying degrees of lower Championship and mid-top end League One in quality. Most are automatic starters so we can't possibly expect anything in terms of a new manager bounce when we're at the exact same level the better players in that list are capable of much less the poorer but still getting games ones.

What I'd love to know is what input Lambert had in extending Edwards contract or if this was done by Thelwell over his head?

I'd be fairly certain that if we put Batth, Edwards and Ikeme up for sale several Championship clubs would be in for them. And re TT's point about Warnock, he may not be anyone's idea of a long term answer, but short term I strongly suspect he would have had a better return than 5pts from 5 games.

 

[Norman Deeley]

Apparently Batth made more headed clearances [21] against Cardiff than any player has in a Championship match this season. So there you are. Everything's alright.

 

[Johnny75]

You said chairmen and CEO's don't change managers to get worse results.

But that is exactly what has happened at Wolves.

The two are not related and I'm sure you know that People do not change managers to get worse results.

The results at Wolves were/ are either a combination of poor coaches and a fixed style that is not working but is 'the plan' or appointing the wrong manager (Dean Saunders).

TT's response sums everything else up perfectly. But I'm sure you know that too.

 

[Derby Wolf]

I'd be fairly certain that if we put Batth, Edwards and Ikeme up for sale several Championship clubs would be in for them. And re TT's point about Warnock, he may not be anyone's idea of a long term answer, but short term I strongly suspect he would have had a better return than 5pts from 5 games.

Would you like to reread my post particularly the 'varying degrees of lower Championship and mid-top end L1' bit? I've acknowledged that if put we some of them up for sale some would invariably garner interest from some lower Championship sides.

 

[GLASGOWOLF]

I'd rather he passed the runner on instead of being dragged all over the pitch.

Passed him on to Who, the keeper?Looking at the still

Doherty, and Iorfa are actually in the right place
It's Batth, and the deeper central player to his left Can't make him out on the still.

Batth should not be in there, the deeper midfielder should have been where Batth was, and Batth and Stears should have been where Iorfa is leaving Iorfa on the right, one could have tracked the runner, and one could have pressed the ball.
As it turns out Iorfa has had to come accross to where both our missing Centre half's should be.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

I don't think Doherty can be in the right place when it's him losing the ball 35 yards from our own goal and he never really becomes a factor after that.

 

[slink]

Batth doesn't really press though, he literally stands still and waits for the player to come on to him at which point he's so rooted that he can't really do anything to try make life difficult for Cardiff, he's just a stationary obstacle that's easily bypassed.

The three of them needed to stick together, not something they often do admittedly, so it becomes difficult to play the ball between them and the man on the ball has a decision to make, does he wait and hope something opens up but possibly gets caught by one of Wolves midfielders in doing so? Try to force through a pass that's not really on? Take the shot himself from distance? In the end it was easy for him because Batth just broke the backline, he either had the easy pass to Pilkington or the no.33 depending on which one Iorfa went with.

By standing still though he actually presses, he needed to back off a little to give his side a chance to reorganise and maybe get back. It's just an example of how poor we are tactically and of how organised we are with poor decision making.

 

[PuntsWolf]

He's onside when he first makes the run because Stearman is dropping back on the other side too, if Iorfa doesn't go with it then it's a really easy pass down the side of Batth. It's only when the ball comes to Pilkington that Iorfa has slightly overcooked it and ended up deeper than Stearman but that's what happens unless you stop dead on your last man and cross your fingers that the pass hasn't been played yet.

I would expect more from a back 4 of professional footballers. If seen better organisations and defensive shape from u16s, not professionals who train and play with each other every day and are actually supposed to be good at football.

 

[Siggy]

More than anything we desperately need a leader on the pitch, someone who has the respect of the rest of the team and can organise us on the pitch. I am hoping in a few weeks it will be Williamson with some better players coming in to support him. The defending for both goals last night was beyond poor and very much avoidable. I just see a bunch of players that have completely lost their confidence, I don't think Iorfa or Batth are that bad but at the moment they have no justification to remain in the side if better options are available (and there is the problem!)

I really can't see us winning a game over Christmas, mainly because I can't see how the hell we will keep a clean sheet with this team forgetting the fact that we don't have a striker that scores goals at the moment.

My worry from there is that we will be deep in a relegation battle as the window opens and noone wants to come, then we are really fucked.

 

[Norman Deeley]

Would you like to reread my post particularly the 'varying degrees of lower Championship and mid-top end L1' bit? I've acknowledged that if put we some of them up for sale some would invariably garner interest from some lower Championship sides.

Sorry, I should have made it clear: I actually think those three players would attract bids from mid to higher Championship sides. We may not have a high opinion of them, but I'm sure the bids would come in from teams well above us

 

[MARKakaJIM]

By standing still though he actually presses, he needed to back off a little to give his side a chance to reorganise and maybe get back. It's just an example of how poor we are tactically and of how organised we are with poor decision making.

I can't agree that he presses, it gives the effect that the gap between he and the ball closes but the player with the ball is still in complete control of that, he's still free to play the ball at his own pace because it's only his movement closing the gap as Batth is rooted.

As soon as Doherty loses out the remainder of the defence is a man down in defending that move so there isn't really an opportunity to press, they've got to get their shape right and do their best to make life difficult, hoping either they can delay long enough for someone to get back and even up the numbers or for the opponent to make the wrong decision. Batth just gets stuck in the middle doing nothing and makes the opponents mind up for him, presenting a very easy pass that completely takes him out of the game.

 

[slink]

I can't agree that he presses, it gives the effect that the gap between he and the ball closes but the player with the ball is still in complete control of that, he's still free to play the ball at his own pace because it's only his movement closing the gap as Batth is rooted.

As soon as Doherty loses out the remainder of the defence is a man down in defending that move so there isn't really an opportunity to press, they've got to get their shape right and do their best to make life difficult, hoping either they can delay long enough for someone to get back and even up the numbers or for the opponent to make the wrong decision. Batth just gets stuck in the middle doing nothing and makes the opponents mind up for him, presenting a very easy pass that completely takes him out of the game.

That's exactly what i mean, by not moving it's almost like he's pressed. As i said in the last comment he needed to back off a little which would have given the Cardiff player a decision to make and give our players time to recover if possible. By not moving at all with the shape of the back 4 it's almost identical as to what would happen in a press (yes i know he doesn't actually press)

 

[Lord Knows]

The verdict has to be we reach Christmas with a continuation of piss poor team selection and a total lack of organisation. I doubt Saville would hold down a starting place at Walsall.

 

[thehistorymakers]

Maybe we will get some more signing from Mendes, for Christmas.