Wolves 2-2 Newcastle Utd: Verdict Thread

[prawnking]

Christ, are we actually going to run off the one consistently accurate ITK we have?

All the sniping is so tiresome.

I mean, in the interests of accuracy, it was the ITK who started the sniping (or at least ran with Bev's)?

 

[Quirkafleeg]

I do actually like GFFH's input that much I've got him on series link...

 

[Alan]

I mean, in the interests of accuracy, it was the ITK who started the sniping (or at least ran with Bev's)?

I’d consider today to be a continuation rather than novel. It’s not the first time GFFH has defended GO and gotten pelted for it.

Given their history of mostly accurate information (going back years!) I think they have earned more grace than has been given, especially when the “crime” is offering an opinion (something they’ve mostly avoided here…)

There’s no right or wrong here at the moment and so the continued treatment of folks defending GO as mentally deficient (not from you, PK, at least not that I’ve seen) is pretty uncalled for.

GO discussions seem to have devolved into potshots at other posters more than any real discussion of GO himself.

 

[Derby Wolf]

You don’t enjoy life very much do you Johnny75?
Sad little man getting all angry on the internet

 

[Johnny75]

Saint Burchnall joined on Sept 4th so he presumably also deserves credit for losing to Liverpool, drawing at Luton and getting knocked out of the Carabao Cup.

That's really disrespectful to a member of our coaching staff

 

[GoldFlagFlyingHigh]

View attachment 8652

I mean feel free to check out posters history and see who’s the most angry, I swear it’s like a cult at times on here

 

[Alan]

One of us, one of us…

 

[GoldFlagFlyingHigh]

I do actually like GFFH's input that much I've got him on series link...

Didn’t realise who he meant but seems you’re another poster who isn’t a fan
Apologies my information isn’t always accurate enough for you.

 

[Quirkafleeg]

Bring back Saint Luke from MM.

Didn’t realise who he meant but seems you’re another poster who isn’t a fan
Apologies my information isn’t always accurate enough for you.

I have nothing against you mate. Keep up the good work xx

 

[Lupo]

I’d consider today to be a continuation rather than novel. It’s not the first time GFFH has defended GO and gotten pelted for it.

Given their history of mostly accurate information (going back years!) I think they have earned more grace than has been given, especially when the “crime” is offering an opinion (something they’ve mostly avoided here…)

There’s no right or wrong here at the moment and so the continued treatment of folks defending GO as mentally deficient (not from you, PK, at least not that I’ve seen) is pretty uncalled for.

GO discussions seem to have devolved into potshots at other posters more than any real discussion of GO himself.

I think its the same though with those who always supported GO jumping on those who had the temerity to question what we had done on the evidence of the first 5 or 6 games where we generally looked pretty awful and mismanaged as if they were right all along.

The reality is we don't know long term if GO is more what we saw early season or if what we are seeing now is more like him, hopefully the latter.

The PE teacher jibes were premature and unfair but too early to tell yet if he's the next Pep. What's important is he now has the majority, players and fans, onside and will have realised that at Molineux last night as the crowd loudly sang his name

 

[GoldFlagFlyingHigh]

Who knows how well he’ll do here but the fact many on here wrote him off after 4 or 5 games (along with the tough circumstances that came with the beginning of the job) was a joke and I’ll stand by that.

 

[PuntsWolf]

I think its the same though with those who always supported GO jumping on those who had the temerity to question what we had done on the evidence of the first 5 or 6 games where we generally looked pretty awful and mismanaged as if they were right all along.

The reality is we don't know long term if GO is more what we saw early season or if what we are seeing now is more like him, hopefully the latter.

The PE teacher jibes were premature and unfair but too early to tell yet if he's the next Pep. What's important is he now has the majority, players and fans, onside and will have realised that at Molineux last night as the crowd loudly sang his name

There was no real opportunity for discussion because of the back and forth with WSwolf killed it.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

Who knows how well he’ll do here but the fact many on here wrote him off after 4 or 5 games (along with the tough circumstances that came with the beginning of the job) was a joke and I’ll stand by that.

Thing is he's come in with a half page CV, same as Lage, and we know how that went. Plus on the day Lopetegui was clearly walking, you could have asked anyone for 20 realistic names and vanishingly few would have put O'Neil on their list.

We then totally emptied midfield vs Brighton and collapsed, did a bad Colin Lee impression vs Palace once it went 1-1 and lost in entirely predictable fashion, squandered a great opportunity vs Liverpool and then were objectively awful vs Luton who everyone expects to go down. Then got knocked out of the cup having been 2-0 up against a lower division team, though I don't care too much about that as I'm in the camp of wanting the League Cup to be binned.

At that point we had one league win and two very tough home games to come. You could see it all coming to an end very quickly had we got a couple of batterings.

The scepticism was understandable, in the heat of the moment it can go too far (I'm sure I am guilty of this at times, but it's only because I'm invested and I care) and I would agree hoping we lose a game so he goes is only the territory for the likes of Saunders/Lage who were both dreadful managers and appalling personalities. That wasn't fair or understandable to throw at O'Neil.

 

[YoungWolf]

Thing is he's come in with a half page CV, same as Lage, and we know how that went. Plus on the day Lopetegui was clearly walking, you could have asked anyone for 20 realistic names and vanishingly few would have put O'Neil on their list.

We then totally emptied midfield vs Brighton and collapsed, did a bad Colin Lee impression vs Palace once it went 1-1 and lost in entirely predictable fashion, squandered a great opportunity vs Liverpool and then were objectively awful vs Luton who everyone expects to go down. Then got knocked out of the cup having been 2-0 down to a lower division team, though I don't care too much about that as I'm in the camp of wanting the League Cup to be binned.

At that point we had one league win and two very tough home games to come. You could see it all coming to an end very quickly had we got a couple of batterings.

The scepticism was understandable, in the heat of the moment it can go too far (I'm sure I am guilty of this at times, but it's only because I'm invested and I care) and I would agree hoping we lose a game so he goes is only the territory for the likes of Saunders/Lage who were both dreadful managers and appalling personalities. That wasn't fair or understandable to throw at O'Neil.

This

 

[leedswolf]

I mean feel free to check out posters history and see who’s the most angry, I swear it’s like a cult at times on here

You need to engage spell check

 

[GoldFlagFlyingHigh]

Thing is he's come in with a half page CV, same as Lage, and we know how that went. Plus on the day Lopetegui was clearly walking, you could have asked anyone for 20 realistic names and vanishingly few would have put O'Neil on their list.

We then totally emptied midfield vs Brighton and collapsed, did a bad Colin Lee impression vs Palace once it went 1-1 and lost in entirely predictable fashion, squandered a great opportunity vs Liverpool and then were objectively awful vs Luton who everyone expects to go down. Then got knocked out of the cup having been 2-0 down to a lower division team, though I don't care too much about that as I'm in the camp of wanting the League Cup to be binned.

At that point we had one league win and two very tough home games to come. You could see it all coming to an end very quickly had we got a couple of batterings.

The scepticism was understandable, in the heat of the moment it can go too far (I'm sure I am guilty of this at times, but it's only because I'm invested and I care) and I would agree hoping we lose a game so he goes is only the territory for the likes of Saunders/Lage who were both dreadful managers and appalling personalities. That wasn't fair or understandable to throw at O'Neil.

I could argue he kept up a side that had no right to stay up last season, in his first spell as a first team manager. Very decent achievement.
Guilty of being too aggressive early on at times but still getting to know the squad and the team was clearly flagging after 60/70 mins in those opening games.
We might have looked fit in pre season for a Lopetegui approach to the PL but wanting to play with more intensity we were struggling initially.

He’s made a good start so far. Nothing more.
Lots of good signs though but those were there in the early weeks too, just not as often and consistent as we all would’ve ideally wanted.

 

[Alan]

On a completely unrelated and mildly stupid note, “sceptic” will never not be a bizarre spelling to me.

 

[PuntsWolf]

Thing is he's come in with a half page CV, same as Lage, and we know how that went. Plus on the day Lopetegui was clearly walking, you could have asked anyone for 20 realistic names and vanishingly few would have put O'Neil on their list.

But we as football fans don’t actually have that much knowledge. Whereas I think most of us would say Hobbs seems like he is (or at least talks a good game) so maybe with him having the option to actually speak to him and interview him he might actually have a better idea?

Half a page or not, we’ve all got to start somewhere and in his first job he’s done a very good job, way above expectations. I don’t think that’s comparable to Bruno Lage winning a league with Benfica and then being awful, and being a massive twat, where all the players hate him. GON doesn’t appear to be any of those things from when he first spoke.

We then totally emptied midfield vs Brighton and collapsed, did a bad Colin Lee impression vs Palace once it went 1-1 and lost in entirely predictable fashion, squandered a great opportunity vs Liverpool and then were objectively awful vs Luton who everyone expects to go down. Then got knocked out of the cup having been 2-0 up against a lower division team, though I don't care too much about that as I'm in the camp of wanting the League Cup to be binned.

But also I think your explanations are harsh and I could easily have it the other way or certainly offer mitigation, but that is where biases lead opinions either way. I think O’Neil was impressed with how we played against United (he’s also said that high press front foot would be his ideal way) so wanted to go toe to toe with Brighton. And tbh I think it worked, we gave away a shit goal (or moment of brilliance) and were the better team for me and were well in it against a very well coached team. The second goal is shit from Kilman, Sa and then Nunes. Nothing tactical, just abysmal play from all 3 of them one after the other. That kills the game, particularly when our players are alledgedly not fit enough (undercooked/asking too much of them? Again depends on your bias). As GFFH says though, he was still finding out about his players.

The palace game wasn’t a good look and was shit. But it doesn’t help when two of your forwards are Fabio and Sarabia. Who pretty much don’t feature now as he’s worked out they are shit. We were still well in that game and Palace weren’t exactly better. Shutting up shop in hindsight was a bad call, but he’s not the first and certainly not the last who will do that. Lopetegui did it regularly and was an almost 50/50 split whether it worked or not.

Luton was shit and he owned it. But we’d have probably come away with 3 points without a stupid red and/or a harsh penalty.

At that point we had one league win and two very tough home games to come. You could see it all coming to an end very quickly had we got a couple of batterings.

Which would be completely fair if he was actually a “PE teacher” or whatever. But Hobbs clearly didn’t think he was and could see the Green shoots, as he said as much in the interview and felt we were on the wrong side of fine margins.

The scepticism was understandable, in the heat of the moment it can go too far (I'm sure I am guilty of this at times, but it's only because I'm invested and I care) and I would agree hoping we lose a game so he goes is only the territory for the likes of Saunders/Lage who were both dreadful managers and appalling personalities. That wasn't fair or understandable to throw at O'Neil.

It was understandable. But it’s moreso fuelled as people have already made their mind up to an extent. So falling foul of fine margins and bad luck was “no he’s just shit, look he’s lost again” rather than benefit of the doubt which is what someone of other side of the argument would have given in same situation.

 

[HanDoJin]

Lopetegui entire* plan was sneak an equaliser and hang on at all costs, regardless of minutes left.


*Alright, 85% of the time

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

Which would be completely fair if he was actually a “PE teacher” or whatever. But Hobbs clearly didn’t think he was and could see the Green shoots, as he said as much in the interview and felt we were on the wrong side of fine margins.

But again you surely understand the scepticism here. We all knew Lage was a Mendes plant but the club made out he really impressed at interview (what interview). And going way back, the golf club Saunders appointment. The haste at which (at least on the face of it, before we knew what we know now) we went from Europa League winner, former Spain and Real Madrid manager* to someone who 12 months previously had managed 0 first team games sets alarm bells ringing, especially when results are not good, no matter what caveats you employ.

I don't think that I was personally *that* harsh on him (I didn't go in for the abuse angle, I did with Lage because he deserves it, as he was a cunt) but you can only judge what's there, and we live in a world where opinions are voiced all the time, not once a week on WM phone-ins and once a month in ALOB. Which on the whole is better, but people can change their minds.

*For the record I don't think Lopetegui is as elite as his CV suggests either, not now anyway