Wolves 2-2 Newcastle Utd: Verdict Thread

[PuntsWolf]

But again you surely understand the scepticism here. We all knew Lage was a Mendes plant but the club made out he really impressed at interview (what interview). And going way back, the golf club Saunders appointment. The haste at which (at least on the face of it, before we knew what we know now) we went from Europa League winner, former Spain and Real Madrid manager* to someone who 12 months previously had managed 0 first team games sets alarm bells ringing, especially when results are not good, no matter what caveats you employ.

Well we all know there was no recruitment process with Lage. It was in the media about a week after the Everton game Nuno announced he was leaving. And he didn’t even succeed in his one job anyway. And yeah Saunders. So I can see the scepticism, but I don’t think (or at least I didnt) this was the same.

The change certainly can set alarm bells ringing but that doesn’t mean default to “he’s shit and shouldn’t be here he needs to go ASAP” from the outset. That just isn’t/wasn’t fair. And there was good things to take from games anyway even if results hadn’t quite landed, but that was ignored and thoughts based solely on results. Hilariously the Everton game is probably still our worst performance by a margin!

And yeah, JL really isn’t as good as he thinks he is. At the end of the day he felt he couldn’t do anything with this squad. Why? We’re not exactly doing badly from a tough set of fixtures and bad luck with a worse squad than he had to work with.

I don't think that I was personally *that* harsh on him (I didn't go in for the abuse angle, I did with Lage because he deserves it, as he was a cunt) but you can only judge what's there, and we live in a world where opinions are voiced all the time, not once a week on WM phone-ins and once a month in ALOB. Which on the whole is better, but people can change their minds.

Which is fair. I’m not really speaking personally about anyone here, just the general narrative. I feel/felt he was harshly judged, and that was to an extent because people had made their mind up before a ball was kicked. Some of which I felt was based on no real evidence. Had everyone really watched loads of Bournemouth? I know I’d watched three games. The two involving wolves and the final day. Not really enough to form any credible opinion (they got results in two of them and thought they were alright against Everton). I doubt the majority had watched much more than that. And the ones who had have got too much time on their hands!

 

[YoungWolf]

Oh and by the way, O’Neil more than had a chance to give me feedback today as his son plays for Wimbledon U10s who I was coaching against today. Scrappy 2-2 draw…

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

I suppose you could say it's short-sighted on my part but the Bournemouth home game definitely did have me thinking this was a bad idea.

They were truly shocking first half but we were in our allergic to shooting phase, pretty much any other team would have put them away before HT. Then their goal was a cross which hit Tavernier and went in. Their only "shot" on target of the entire game. Then they shithoused in a manner that would have embarrassed even the worst Howe-era Bournemouth teams. Again if we had a plan other than crossing it to no-one for half an hour we might have got back into it.

I did not want to watch that week after week, as it turns out I don't have to. But I didn't know that in August.

One of the other Bournemouth games I watched was when they beat Liverpool 1-0 and that was a complete robbery, they were again awful and somehow won.

 

[PuntsWolf]

I suppose you could say it's short-sighted on my part but the Bournemouth home game definitely did have me thinking this was a bad idea.

They were truly shocking first half but we were in our allergic to shooting phase, pretty much any other team would have put them away before HT. Then their goal was a cross which hit Tavernier and went in. Their only "shot" on target of the entire game. Then they shithoused in a manner that would have embarrassed even the worst Howe-era Bournemouth teams. Again if we had a plan other than crossing it to no-one for half an hour we might have got back into it.

I did not want to watch that week after week, as it turns out I don't have to. But I didn't know that in August.

One of the other Bournemouth games I watched was when they beat Liverpool 1-0 and that was a complete robbery, they were again awful and somehow won.

Well as you’ve just said, we were worse! Far better squad, more experienced manager, at home…

And this is what I find odd. Forest away we were embarrassing and scored our one shot. We should have been put to bed way before. We were also shit in pretty much every away game. On the beach or not we embarrassed ourselves in the last few too.

We got the benefit of some fine margins at home and it was largely dull. Needs must maybe, but we can’t be throwing stones from our glass house.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

I don't get that though.

Like Neil Warnock was demonstrably a better manager in the Championship than Glenn Hoddle in 2006 but that doesn't mean I wanted Warnock here. I can have neither.

O'Neil has been better than I expected and than early impressions/previous history suggested. Which I'm fine with admitting. Bet even his strongest defenders weren't expecting 8 points out of Man City, Villa, Bournemouth and Newcastle.

 

[PuntsWolf]

I don't get that though.

Like Neil Warnock was demonstrably a better manager in the Championship than Glenn Hoddle in 2006 but that doesn't mean I wanted Warnock here. I can have neither.

O'Neil has been better than I expected and than early impressions/previous history suggested. Which I'm fine with admitting. Bet even his strongest defenders weren't expecting 8 points out of Man City, Villa, Bournemouth and Newcastle.

No, but we’ve got the benefit of some fine margins in those games. Benefits we weren’t getting before.

 

[Alan]

One does wonder how different the conversation would be if we were on equal points but having lost the matches we were "supposed to" (and, by extension, having done things like beating Luton).

 

[Templeton Peck]

Who knows how well he’ll do here but the fact many on here wrote him off after 4 or 5 games (along with the tough circumstances that came with the beginning of the job) was a joke and I’ll stand by that.

This place is hyperbole central, always has been. Worst this ever, worst that ever etc. Team can never just have an off day or a bit of bad luck. Some of the reactions to Palace and Luton on here were suicide level.

 

[HanDoJin]

Let's have it right, Bournemouth had no business staying up last season. Their entire squad was ass from day 1.

 

[prawnking]

I’d consider today to be a continuation rather than novel. It’s not the first time GFFH has defended GO and gotten pelted for it.

Given their history of mostly accurate information (going back years!) I think they have earned more grace than has been given, especially when the “crime” is offering an opinion (something they’ve mostly avoided here…)

There’s no right or wrong here at the moment and so the continued treatment of folks defending GO as mentally deficient (not from you, PK, at least not that I’ve seen) is pretty uncalled for.

GO discussions seem to have devolved into potshots at other posters more than any real discussion of GO himself.

I don't have an axe to grind with GFFH, it just seemed to me that there were 'scores being settled' out of the blue on a verdict thread (part of the sniping you were railing against?) and they were a major part in originating that. On this thread.

I do wonder why people (and many did) don't just speak up at the time though, rather than save it all up for months later when they feel their position is stronger?

 

[Alan]

I don't have an axe to grind with GFFH, it just seemed to me that there were 'scores being settled' out of the blue on a verdict thread (part of the sniping you were railing against?) and they were a major part in originating that. On this thread.

I do wonder why people (and many did) don't just speak up at the time though, rather than save it all up for months later when they feel their position is stronger?

Don't bring a knife to a gun fight innit

 

[Elephant Pyjamas]

I do wonder why people (and many did) don't just speak up at the time though, rather than save it all up for months later when they feel their position is stronger?

Alternative opinions aren't that welcome on here, I can see why people might hesitate.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

I'm not convinced that is the case though; I've gone early against both Saunders and Lage on here, got a negative reaction on the whole along the way but what do I care? That was my opinion and I don't mind sticking it up there.

I've never felt the need here or anywhere (on or offline) to hold back in case people disagree. Say what you like, back it up preferably with evidence and examples but whatever.

 

[prawnking]

many on here wrote him off after 4 or 5 games

Five games isn't a big sample size, I grant you, but you seem fine with people using the last five games to say how great he is?

 

[prawnking]

Alternative opinions aren't that welcome on here, I can see why people might hesitate.

You don't need to tell me mate, I've had plenty of run-ins over the years (many of them my own fault), I was a Doc and Adama truther and supported Bruno for longer than many, but I still give my opinion, sometimes I look a cock doing it too.

It's just a forum, no need to look any deeper. We all get it right and wrong sometimes, people can silently seethe if they like and save up their take for months, seems futile to me though

 

[Paul]

I do wonder why people (and many did) don't just speak up at the time though, rather than save it all up for months later when they feel their position is stronger?

Yeh, I'm gonna listen to you, an Adama lover...........................Uh yes I see your point

 

[Kenny]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1718661718912758151

 

[Elephant Pyjamas]

Came here to post that, good news.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

Hopefully back for Fulham or Arsenal then.

 

[Carrotdude]

Brilliant news that