What can Fosun do now?

[Squeak]

If due diligence was done I’d accept it but it absolutely wasn’t on both.
Anybody of any football knowledge would know full well it wasn’t going to work, many on here were saying don’t do it.
I’m not perfect far from it but I am objective.
I’ve applauded Fosun for their work from 2017-2020 after that it’s been poor.

And just how do you know what was done or wasn't done?
It's complete bollocks to say anybody with football knowledge would know it wasn't going to work.
Football people were involved and reality is that sometimes transfers don't work out for whatever reason.

On the Guedes transfer, I think we can safely say that he was reluctant to come and when he did, he never settled. However, none of us were present at the talks, none of us could judge his state of mind and none of us could know if he would work out until we saw him play. However, Fosun were prepared to fund the transfer and I dare say that part of our transfer policy now is because we learned from the mistakes of the Guedes move.

Sorry, just far too easy to criticise a club or an owner for signing a player who doesn't work out. That applies to any club and owner, not just ours.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

Dead easy to criticise after the event. How about Raul? Hardly anyone had heard of him. Widely recognised as a failed player, then we signed him.

Not even close to comparable and no way a "failure".

Guedes has scored more than 5 goals in a season ONCE. He is fucking shit. What the hell were we thinking.

I'm not painting Fosun as owners who've got absolutely everything wrong. They've got far more wrong than right in the last four years though.

 

[Squeak]

Also, Fosun’s “normal” mistakes wouldn’t be hounded so badly if they weren’t also gaslighting the supporters.

They’ve made this bed themselves. People aren’t hating them just for funsies.

Perhaps so... but from their point of view, they appear to have achieved their goal of selling out our season tickets at a higher price. Game over. Hate all you want.

 

[Alan]

Perhaps so... but from their point of view, they appear to have achieved their goal of selling out our season tickets at a higher price. Game over. Hate all you want.

I don’t give a fuck about their point of view, I care about my friends here who won’t be going to Molineux next season.

 

[jd1981]

And just how do you know what was done or wasn't done?
It's complete bollocks to say anybody with football knowledge would know it wasn't going to work.
Football people were involved and reality is that sometimes transfers don't work out for whatever reason.

On the Guedes transfer, I think we can safely say that he was reluctant to come and when he did, he never settled. However, none of us were present at the talks, none of us could judge his state of mind and none of us could know if he would work out until we saw him play. However, Fosun were prepared to fund the transfer and I dare say that part of our transfer policy now is because we learned from the mistakes of the Guedes move.

Sorry, just far too easy to criticise a club or an owner for signing a player who doesn't work out. That applies to any club and owner, not just ours.

You absolutely can when they’ve not got the right people in place making football decisions, as DW says it was blatantly obvious that Guedes wasn’t going to work.

 

[Squeak]

Not even close to comparable and no way a "failure".

Guedes has scored more than 5 goals in a season ONCE. He is fucking shit. What the hell were we thinking.

I'm not painting Fosun as owners who've got absolutely everything wrong. They've got far more wrong than right in the last four years though.

That's a matter of personal opinion and I'm fine with that. I tend to agree with your overall assessment but I'm just not going down a blind alley of criticising everything they have done without trying to understand why.

As regards "failure" in general, this is how people learn. Mistakes from the past can mean better results in the future as experience and knowledge is gained. Not saying if Fosun / Shi will learn or not but we'll see over time.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

they appear to have achieved their goal of selling out our season tickets at a higher price.

Hmmm...maybe.

Except the availability 24 hours ago was pretty plentiful and it's a reach to say they sold them all today.

And they haven't released any numbers, or put up an actual story on the website like they have every other year, just a tweet saying we aren't selling any more.

And they already sent out an obviously fake renewal number to the E&S, who dutifully printed it without question.

If they conclusively say they've sold 22,000+ season tickets then ok. But they haven't and I suspect they won't.

 

[Squeak]

I don’t give a fuck about their point of view, I care about my friends here who won’t be going to Molineux next season.

Have at it.

 

[Mel Evo]

Perhaps so... but from their point of view, they appear to have achieved their goal of selling out our season tickets at a higher price. Game over. Hate all you want.

But it’s black and white not ‘all over’ even if your game is about short-term (12 month) revenue. Literally no one will know that until you’ve seen true gate numbers across the season (the basis for the £3m). So while the jury might be out (to be balanced), it’s evidently not all over.

 

[Squeak]

Hmmm...maybe.

Except the availability 24 hours ago was pretty plentiful and it's a reach to say they sold them all today.

And they haven't released any numbers, or put up an actual story on the website like they have every other year, just a tweet saying we aren't selling any more.

And they already sent out an obviously fake renewal number to the E&S, who dutifully printed it without question.

If they conclusively say they've sold 22,000+ season tickets then ok. But they haven't and I suspect they won't.

That's why I said "appear."

 

[Squeak]

But it’s black and white not ‘all over’ even if your game is about short-term (12 month) revenue. Literally no one will know that until you’ve seen true gate numbers across the season (the basis for the £3m). So while the jury might be out (to be balanced), it’s evidently not all over.

We'll see the effect when the actual accounts are released in a future year. I've no idea if it will be £3m or not. That was something I picked up from someone else's post. All I said is that £3m is still £3m and important to us. However, until that happens, it is game over for now.

 

[Squeak]

You absolutely can when they’ve not got the right people in place making football decisions, as DW says it was blatantly obvious that Guedes wasn’t going to work.

So, in effect, you are saying every transfer will work out if you have the right people in place. If only life was like that.

 

[Mel Evo]

We'll see the effect when the actual accounts are released in a future year. I've no idea if it will be £3m or not. That was something I picked up from someone else's post. All I said is that £3m is still £3m and important to us. However, until that happens, it is game over for now.

It’s not game over for now. No. You just admitted even you don’t know if they have sold the target STs (seems unlikely they have), and it does all hinge on the full year attendances. So game on.

Think we can all agree they’ve destroyed a lot of loyalty in the customer base and associated recurring revenue from ancillary spend. Game over on that one perhaps.

 

[The Bear]

There was me thinking we had a Head Coach, coaching and recruitment staff. Even with that, mistakes will happen at every club and sometimes they aren't even mistakes... just that things don't work out for either party for one reason or another. Football is littered with failed transfers. You never made a mistake?

It kind of gets a bit more scrutiny when you spend £35m and a club record transfer fee on a completely unknown teenager who hadn't started a single game at first team level.

Porto must have laughed themselves silly when we accepted their demands for him. Which were that high probably to stop us buying him.

 

[jd1981]

So, in effect, you are saying every transfer will work out if you have the right people in place. If only life was like that.

I’ll refer you back to the point about due diligence, not having in place leaves the door wide open to risk and failure. Both Fabio and Guedes were what you call “high risk” signings for the purchase price we agreed.
Notice I’ve not included Collins in this he could easily have been a lot hard to get of the books. He didn’t work but looked a “low risk” and had no problem with the signing.

 

[prawnking]

So, in effect, you are saying every transfer will work out if you have the right people in place. If only life was like that.

You're posting quite a lot for someone who was 'interested in everyone else's opinion'

 

[Squeak]

It kind of gets a bit more scrutiny when you spend £35m and a club record transfer fee on a completely unknown teenager who hadn't started a single game at first team level.

Porto must have laughed themselves silly when we accepted their demands for him. Which were that high probably to stop us buying him.

I quite agree. However, as we all know, a striker always commands higher transfer fees and Fabio was widely touted as the best player in the world in his position at that time. Or at least that is the spiel we were led to believe. It was something of a gamble. It works out and the player appreciates in value and everyone benefits. As we know, it hasn't worked out for him here...so then it looks a disaster.

Football has changed since he joined us. He joined in September 2020 and at that time, we didn't know what would become of covid or the issues FFP would present.

The other comment I'll make is that lessons have been learned from his purchase. Fans love to go back and use it as a weapon to criticise but what matters is how we ensure we take less gambles of this nature in future and what we learn in structuring future deals. The other factor is what can be learned from the way a player might feel about a move.

Perhaps, I'd suggest, this deal was important in guiding the future for us as I think we have been much better in our player recruitment over the last 18 months.

 

[Squeak]

You're posting quite a lot for someone who was 'interested in everyone else's opinion'

I'm responding to draw more of their opinion out.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

Fabio was widely touted as the best player in the world in his position at that time

He absolutely was not

 

[Kenny]

He absolutely was not

He was.



Just by Jeff Shi though....