The Manager Sacked/Hired Thread 2017/18

[Deutsch Wolf]

McGregor was weird down here. A couple of good saves but some crazy moments where he looked like a glitch in a video game.

Arfield is decent if his fitness is ok, solid player. Dorrans should have been good for them but it looks like injuries have wrecked him.

 

[BillyDee]

How would you seek to replace Mick McCarthy, someone who with a negative net spend of £13m over five and a half years has had Ipswich punching above their financial weight, one of the most seasoned managers at this level you could hope to have?

I know, you'd interview Sol Campbell.

It's because of the Rooney rule. Have to interview someone BAME, might as well be him. Wastes his time, wastes the club's time as he's clearly not good enough, but ticks a box.

 

[YoungWolf]

Yeah but when Joey Barton gets a job because he is mates with the Fleetwood owner (with less coaching experience than Campbell, and a far inferior career) I guess that is fair game. No interview process at all, either, by the way

Campbell's problem now* (same as Michael Johnson as well too) is that he is outspoken on these issues. So anyone who appoints him now also runs being the risk of the person who sacked Sol Campbell, if he does a poor job.

The likelihood is Campbell won't be a good manager (straight away anyway) like most ex-pros, but why shouldn't he get the chance to prove that? The amount of dross in the football league system who get chance after chance despite failing again and again stinks.



*Looking beyond his mental comments about him being a great football mind, but that hasn't stopped other idiots getting jobs (hi Dean).

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

Or his comments about how he should have captained England 60+ times but the FA were too racist to allow that (despite his career overlapping with Tony Adams, David Platt, Paul Ince, Alan Shearer, David Beckham, Gary Neville, Steven Gerrard, Rio Ferdinand, Frank Lampard and John Terry).

Or his "But I am Sol Campbell" incident.

I am fully behind you in terms of getting more BAME candidates into coaching and managerial posts. And definitely with abolishing the churn of the same old awful faces. This season has been appalling for it. But Sol Campbell is a unique case in that he's quite clearly a monumental dickhead. I wouldn't want him within a million miles of my club.

 

[Alan]

If the Rooney Rule was involved and they just picked Campbell to interview to tick the box, that points to a pretty big issue, wouldn't you say?

At least do a little homework and get a decent BAME candidate to "waste time" (which it inherently is not, by the way) interviewing.

Campbell pisses me off in a special way. He is the complete opposite of the right messenger for what he's saying, because even if he has a point (and like YW says, he definitely does), he's never going to be the one to convince anyone about it. He does more harm than good. It's infuriating.

 

[Boozad]

If the Rooney Rule was involved and they just picked Campbell to interview to tick the box, that points to a pretty big issue, wouldn't you say?

At least do a little homework and get a decent BAME candidate to "waste time" (which it inherently is not, by the way) interviewing.

If you only have one BAME candidate apply how do you do that? Phone up loads of black people asking 'fancy a job?'

 

[Alan]

If you only have one BAME candidate apply how do you do that? Phone up loads of black people asking 'fancy a job?'

If you only have one apply then obviously there isn't much you can do. But part and parcel of the Rooney Rule and similar affirmative action policies is proper advertising of the opportunity, attempting to make sure you don't end up with just the one. That would, in this case, likely include reaching out to potential candidates. Get a list of current BAME managers/coaches that look interesting, or pick up a BAME candidate who has just got his coaching badges.

It takes work and time on the part of the club but it's necessary and we've seen that the simple answer is usually "white guy who just failed elsewhere".

 

[Tony Towner]

We interviewed Ince before we gave Lambert the job which was a waste of everyone's time. Like any employment regulation or in our case volentary guideline it has to be treated in the spirit in which it was meant rather than a box ticking exercise.

 

[BillyDee]

When we appointed both Lambert and Nuno, we didn't interview anyone else, we had a specific target in mind both times and they said yes. Should we have interviewed a BAME candidate just to appease the EFL? Which would have wasted both our time and theirs? We got stick for it both times.
The merry go round of failed aged British white guys is boring, and needs to be stopped. Who they are and where they come from I could care less, as long as they are better options. Sol Campbell is not the answer, he's just a dick.

 

[BillyDee]

Ninjad by TT. Appears I'm wrong with the Lambert appointment, but think it was the case with Nuno.

 

[YoungWolf]

Nuno is recognised as a BAME manager...

 

[White Wolf]

Nuno is recognised as a BAME manager...

We were criticised for not following the Rooney Rule anyway though weren't we?

I don't see the benefit of this rule. If a club has a particular target in mind instead of an interview process then why waste everyone's time trying to keep to it?

 

[BillyDee]

Fair enough. TIL that Nuno is from São Tomé and Príncipe, a former Portuguese colonial island in Africa. The second smallest African country after the Seychelles.

 

[MARKakaJIM]

I'm still sceptical of the Rooney rule concept.

If an employer is open minded to BAME candidates then they'll approach them or pursue applications from them without someone telling them to. If an employer is overtly racist then they just approach or interview as many BAME candidates as they need to under the rules, with no intention of ever employing them so that's just a massive waste of time.

So where is it going to actually have an impact? Employers who are subconsciously racist and don't realise, just blindly ignoring BAME candidates for seemingly no reason until they're forced to show a bit more interest and then suddenly they discover some of them might make a decent employee.

I get that something needs to be done to try and address the balance of numbers, or lack of it, but I don't see how this really helps to any great extent.

 

[Alan]

If an employer is open minded to BAME candidates then they'll approach them or pursue applications from them without someone telling them to. If an employer is overtly racist then they just approach or interview as many BAME candidates as they need to under the rules, with no intention of ever employing them so that's just a massive waste of time.

The problem is that these extremes rarely exist in practice. Systems of racism are permeated often unintentionally by otherwise non-racist and non-prejudiced people.

However, it's worth pointing out that in the latter case, there is a chance, however small, that the BAME candidate could blows the doors off the interview in such a way that a mind is changed. Likely? No. But certainly less so if they were never let in the door.

 

[YoungWolf]

The Rooney Rule isn't perfect nor is it the only answer to what is a real problem. For me it is one small step in the right direction. If it gets people who wouldn't usually more interviews, it is a minor victory.

FA bursary schemes are also helping coaches. A friend of mine has benefitted from it greatly, helping him with qualifications which have also helped him find work at Birmingham and now Wolves in the academy system. He's a fantastic coach who maybe wouldn't have got that opportunity.

There are still disparate numbers between the % of qualified coaches from BAME backgrounds and % of coaches in the pro game, and even academies, but hopefully schemes like that will help increase that chances of addressing the imbalance. It's certainly improving from the ground up which is what was needed. It's just slower progress than it could be because the people at the top of the game are so unrepresentative IMO.

 

[Wombat del combate]

He's done some badges and is working towards his Pro Licence. Fair play for that but he's just an incredibly strange man. No way is he cut out for management.

I happened across a programme about millionaires' mansions. One of said wealthy people was showing the crew around her place and there was a fucking mahoosive picture of Sol Campbell in one room. Puzzled, I wondered aloud to my wife who on earth would want a massive picture of Sol Campbell in their house? I then realised it was Sol Campbell's home.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

Coleman has left Sunderland.

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

I'm actually surprised by that. I assume it his choice rather than theirs, because he would have been perfect for helping them back up.

 

[SSB]

I happened across a programme about millionaires' mansions. One of said wealthy people was showing the crew around her place and there was a fucking mahoosive picture of Sol Campbell in one room. Puzzled, I wondered aloud to my wife who on earth would want a massive picture of Sol Campbell in their house? I then realised it was Sol Campbell's home.

Didn’t Brendan Rodgers had the same.