Norwich (A) 31/10 Build-Up Thread #bogeyteam #mayaswellnotbother

[Deutsch Wolf]

The difference is that a year ago Coady wasn't really worth his place in the team, he was a really shit midfielder even by the standards of what we had. Lee Evans and Dave Edwards genuinely were far better options.

 

[Elephant Pyjamas]

The difference is that a year ago Coady wasn't really worth his place in the team, he was a really shit midfielder even by the standards of what we had. Lee Evans and Dave Edwards genuinely were far better options.

And no one considered him a leader did they, but now they do, as i say it's only since it's been made obvious to us that we know.

None of us have any idea how much of an influence Batth has on the training pitch, socially or in the dressing room pre and post game.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

Ok, well Langers brought up the example of Sam Ricketts earlier - I don't think we should have dropped him as it was weird to do it right on the eve of the season (Ricketts even played the final pre-season friendly) and the alternative was Doherty, who as a standalone RB is as bad as it gets at this level - he was club and team captain, quite obviously a massive influence on the field in L1, the manager decided he wasn't our best option any more and did it affect anything? No, we had the only good season we've had in this division in this decade (before this one).

Batth is not an organiser, never has been and never will be. Remember when Williamson came in, the stark difference in us actually having a back four being marshalled through a game. Whenever that's being directed on pitch, it's not Danny doing it. That's not a slight on him at all, it just isn't his game.

 

[Elephant Pyjamas]

Ok, well Langers brought up the example of Sam Ricketts earlier - I don't think we should have dropped him as it was weird to do it right on the eve of the season (Ricketts even played the final pre-season friendly) and the alternative was Doherty, who as a standalone RB is as bad as it gets at this level - he was club and team captain, quite obviously a massive influence on the field in L1, the manager decided he wasn't our best option any more and did it affect anything? No, we had the only good season we've had in this division in this decade (before this one).

Batth is not an organiser, never has been and never will be. Remember when Williamson came in, the stark difference in us actually having a back four being marshalled through a game. Whenever that's being directed on pitch, it's not Danny doing it. That's not a slight on him at all, it just isn't his game.

Who's to say we wouldn't have had an even better season had Ricketts been playing? How do you know it didn't have any effect either short term or long term? It may well have caused issues.

I'll say it again, i think people saying it should have NO part to play in the decision making process are wrong.

All of this aside, Batth put in possibly his best ever performance less than a week ago.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

Given we picked up 78 points with Richard Stearman, Matt Doherty, Scott Golbourne, Dave Edwards, James Henry, Carl Ikeme and Jack Price playing fairly large roles, I'd say we couldn't have done much better than that.

 

[Deleted Cyber]

You're entitled to your opinion but you seem to have trouble respecting others. I don't underestimate team spirit but judging you by your posts I would say you are massively overestimating the effects of a fabric armband.

Danny Batth's influence wasn't needed for the first three games of the season nor has it been especially important to our performances since then. It's not as if he's a John Terry/ Tony Adams character that can dominate players with their sheer presence.

Nuno is picking his best team as his system demands based on the evidence so far. I don't think Batth will be in our best XI when Boly, Hause, Miranda, Coady and Batth are fit. Nothing to do with captaincy, just ability.

Sorry, on reading this I just spat my cup of tea all over the floor. Pot, kettle and all that lol ( take this in the jovial spirit its meant )

 

[Stan Hullis]

Just got my ticket for this...don't know why I put myself through this torture constantly.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

Sorry, on reading this I just spat my cup of tea all over the floor.

Now you know how we felt on Saturday night...

As for your post this morning...yeah, I'm a bit apprehensive about this one too. But because Norwich are half decent with a handful of decent players and we've just turned in successive league performances that weren't very good. Not because we lost to them in 2002 in a playoff campaign that was always doomed (we could have played Stockport over two legs and lost, we were mentally and physically done) or because Ikeme and Stearman totally lost the plot in 2008. That has nothing to do with anything.

 

[Alan]

I find this discussion pretty ironic because if there's one thing we've learned whilst Batth has been captain it's that he isn't a good captain.

The armband should offer no more protection from the bench than is already afforded every other player. Lead by example or you will be dropped. Simples.

 

[Elephant Pyjamas]

I find this discussion pretty ironic because if there's one thing we've learned whilst Batth has been captain it's that he isn't a good captain.

.

How do you know that? Do you train with the players? Do you have an ear on what they think of Danny? Can you hear what he says during games?

You can be a good captain without waving your arms about and frothing at the mouth like say....Paul Ince.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

How do you know that? Do you train with the players? Do you have an ear on what they think of Danny? Can you hear what he says during games?

You can be a good captain without waving your arms about and frothing at the mouth like say....Paul Ince.

How are Man Utd doing without club captain Michael Carrick, he of 0 minutes in the league all season?

Did Chelsea not win the league last season with John Terry parked on the bench?

 

[Elephant Pyjamas]

Is that a response to me Dan, because it doesn't make sense if it is? Because that isn't the point i'm making is it.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

I'm struggling to find what your point is tbh.

There are many examples of properly influential captains being dropped by massive teams and it having no impact. They got dropped because they were no longer part of the best team. John Terry for instance - whatever you think of him personally, he's clearly a huge personality and was the epitome of an on-pitch leader. It would be a serious stretch to compare Danny Batth to him in that respect. Notwithstanding that Batth wasn't even in our team for a whole month at the start of the season. Did it impact on Chelsea last season, no, they won the league quite comfortably with the centre halves that they rightly assessed were better.

If Nuno thinks that Miranda-Coady-Boly is our best back three for tomorrow's game then he should go for it. Whether Danny Batth is captain or not doesn't even come close to being a factor.

 

[Alan]

How do you know that? Do you train with the players? Do you have an ear on what they think of Danny? Can you hear what he says during games?

You can be a good captain without waving your arms about and frothing at the mouth like say....Paul Ince.

The lack of on-the-field leadership before this season has been painful. You can't honestly tell me that you saw anything over the past two seasons to suggest that Batth was galvanizing the team to perform better.

He's a decent CB for this level (even if I don't think he's close to our best trio) but a leader he is not, and he's proven that over the past two years on the field.

 

[Elephant Pyjamas]

Well i've clarified it a couple of times, but i'll do it once again.

As Batth is captain, and if Nuno is looking at dropping him, him being captain should play some part in the thought process.

 

[Elephant Pyjamas]

The lack of on-the-field leadership before this season has been painful. You can't honestly tell me that you saw anything over the past two seasons to suggest that Batth was galvanizing the team to perform better.

He's a decent CB for this level (even if I don't think he's close to our best trio) but a leader he is not, and he's proven that over the past two years on the field.

The lack of performance over the last couple of seasons wasn't anything to do with leadership, it was because the quality of the players and management was poor.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

Well i've clarified it a couple of times, but i'll do it once again.

As Batth is captain, and if Nuno is looking at dropping him, him being captain should play some part in the thought process.

As I'm sure it did in August. And he did it anyway.

Which players in the current starting XI do you feel would be put out by Danny Batth being dropped?

 

[Keef]

Well i've clarified it a couple of times, but i'll do it once again.

As Batth is captain, and if Nuno is looking at dropping him, him being captain should play some part in the thought process.

Nah,captain or not,if there's a better player to come in(which there is) who was part of an excellent defence until he got injured,he gets dropped,being captain is incidental

 

[Elephant Pyjamas]

The lack of on-the-field leadership before this season has been painful. You can't honestly tell me that you saw anything over the past two seasons to suggest that Batth was galvanizing the team to perform better.

He's a decent CB for this level (even if I don't think he's close to our best trio) but a leader he is not, and he's proven that over the past two years on the field.

So, by your thinking as we have been poor for a couple of seasons with Batth as captain and thus he deserves criticism, but lets say (and hope) we go up as Champions with Batth as captain he also wouldn't deserve any credit? Interesting.

 

[Alan]

The lack of performance over the last couple of seasons wasn't anything to do with leadership, it was because the quality of the players and management was poor.

Really? You don't think that a lack of leadership played a part in the drop of quality between the FA Cup and league fixtures last year? You don't think that a lack of leadership helped lead to the number of last-minute goals we gave away?

Yes, the management from the top was poor, but if we'd had a leader on the pitch we could have been better than we were. Even with the mediocrity we had at the club, we shouldn't have been in the relegation fight we were, and IMO a glaring lack of pitchside leadership played a huge role in that.