Leo Bonatini

[Paddingtonwolf]

Watching Lemina against West Ham I wouldn't touch him with a barge pole.

 

[b3h]

I don't think we'll sack off both strikers, I think one will stay as we are trying to build a pack of players, getting rid of half of them will break that up too much. Personally would take Bonatini over Afobe. Surely there's way more Afobe type players out there we could get as an upgrade? Whereas minus his pace and bad form, how many Bonatini types are out there? He does have quality, we've seen it. Haven't seen much for Afobe. The ball bounces off him most the time. And although it's easy to see watching on TV or in the ground, he misses chances of cheeky passes and link-up that in-form Bonatini would surely spot. And that's our style. Or at least I think it is!! The second half of the season hasn't gone so swimmingly

 

[MARKakaJIM]

Players from the current bottom 3 I'd take:
Cedric (could play wing back or RCH)
Bertrand
Lemina
Austin (after a bloody good medical)
Butland (out of our reach)
Allen
Rodriguez (as above about the medical)
Dawson (at a push as the right of the back 3)
Shakiri is also a top class player, but he wouldn't fit our system
It's a bit ignorant to say they got relegated so they can't be any good, anyone who wouldn't take Bertrand for instance needs to give their head a wobble.
It's also conveniently forgotten when referring to last time that we signed Fletcher from a relegated side and doubled our money. That version of him would be perfect for our formation now.

On a separate note James Maddison is going to be some player. He's different to Neves as he gets into the box more. In the Championship I think it'd leave us too light in midfield, but in the PL where I think we'll see the wing backs tucking in a bit more it could well work. He's going to cost £15m and will have a number of options, but with us he may start whereas he won't at Spurs or Arsenal

No chance is Cedric playing as a centre half!

Allen would be a good buy I think, good footballing background at Swansea and he's often played a more disciplined role both there and for Wales which would suit the way Wolves have played this season.

Not sure any of the others would be worthwhile other than Butland or Bertrand but I'd consider them unattainable given their international intentions. The likes of Lemina and Shaqiri are far too patchy, Rodriguez and Austin are just broken despite having some talent. The version of Gabbiadini that first arrived on the South coast would be interesting but he looks a shadow of that player now so probably not worth the bother, Steven Davis would've been decent but he's getting on a bit now. Sam McQueen looked good when he was getting games last season, think he'd be a useful LWB, Romeu too could be a solid choice alongside Neves for games when it's backs to the wall but again he might have better offers.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

Extremely generous valuation for a very limited defender who isn't particularly good.

Yet you don't think we'd get the same for one of our best performers this season.

Two things really:

1) Yes, Batth is limited, but he has proven himself over a number of years to be capable for a mid-table team with aspirations for the top six (ie, most of this league). Theoretically at his prime in terms of age, captain for most of the last five seasons, over 150 games at this level, most teams in this division don't really ask their centre halves to play football (look at Cardiff), good for a couple of goals off set pieces a season, Brentford picked up a hefty fee for Harlee Dean who is a much worse version of the same thing and there'll be that nebulous factor of being part of a title winning squad (which he will be). Does it feel odd to be talking about Danny Batth as a £5m player? Yes. Is that the market now? Yes.

2) Matt Doherty - who has not been one of our best performers incidentally, there are at least six players, probably more who have had a better season than him, and we don't have that many regulars - has done a largely good job as a very attacking wingback for us this season (although his return in terms of goals/assists isn't really good enough). Good on him. I admire the fact that he has changed his attitude with respect to workrate and general fitness, there has been some improvement in his defending and he's been important to us (arguably this is partly because we have no replacement for him which is not really a success story on his part, but that's by the by).

However - how many teams play this formation? To make use of him you need him to be operating largely up the pitch. We're able to do that because we're the best team in the league by a fair distance. Most teams still play a back four and he is still going to be absolutely hopeless there. No-one is going to pay £5m for Matt Doherty and park him at right back, because he's not worth a tenth of that playing in that position. We know this, we saw him play there for years. Theoretically someone could come along, planning to copy our exact approach and sign him, and have him do exactly what he's done for us in 2017/18, and then that price tag might be justified. Seems fairly unlikely though. As an orthodox full back or indeed even in a wingback role where he would be expected to be primarily on the back foot, he still does not hold that much value, it's quite obvious where his weaknesses lie and he's too far down the road now for them to ever be fixed.

 

[The Bear]

You're wrong. Doherty is a much better player than Batth and will easily fetch more money. Defensive frailties or not.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

Well, it's a moot point as we will sell Batth but won't sell Doherty, but I do admire your one line rebuttal which is essentially "I am right and you are wrong", I'm glad we had this discussion.

 

[Templeton Peck]

I think Joe Allen would have been viewed as a major coup under the previous ownership. We'll be going for a different level of player now. I think some of us are going to be blown away this summer.

 

[PuntsWolf]

Newcastle spent £5m on Grant Hanley 2 seasons ago. And have since sold him for a decent fee when he was proven to be shit. The market has changed drastically since then and Batth probably holds a higher current stock in the game at the moment. Whether he’s actually a better player or not is irrelevant and difficult to actually assess anyway.

So £5m for Batth is not farfetched at all. If Boro, Cardiff, Derby, Villa stay in the championship, they’d be interested (Terry isn’t getting younger, and they don’t have any fit, good enough replacements in the squad). If Forest, Bristol, Norwich or any of the other lower squads had some money to spend they’d
Want him too.

 

[malta mick]

I think Joe Allen would have been viewed as a major coup under the previous ownership. We'll be going for a different level of player now. I think some of us are going to be blown away this summer.

we'd had enough of Welsh international players for now !

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

Better turn down Bale then...

 

[Norman Deeley]

Deutsch, you really need to take the blinkers off where Doherty is concerned. 1) Managers are vain: they won't logically say he's only suited to Wolves's system. They'll say, "I can make him even better." 2) He has played every game this season except one where he was suspended. That's a huge plus 3) He's 26, absolutely at his peak. 4) Didn't Leeds want him last season?

£5m for Danny Batth - Punts is right on his suitors - and £7m for Doherty

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

I think we will probably be selling both of them this summer. Maybe there is a role here for Doherty as a back-up, but his position is absolutely certain to be one of our main upgrade targets. No way are we playing Batth in the top flight either. I expect one and possibly two more centre backs to be coming in.

We just need to get that P next to our name in the table and let the summer spendathon begin.

 

[Kenny]

Doherty won't be sold. We will listen to offers for Danny B

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

If German Phil exists, and we then bring in, say, an Alex Telles, then Matt rapidly becomes third choice. And with a Championship winners medal in his pocket we might strike while the iron was hot, as it were.

 

[Kenny]

I wouldn't be so sure on Phil being with us next season.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

Deutsch, you really need to take the blinkers off where Doherty is concerned. 1) Managers are vain: they won't logically say he's only suited to Wolves's system. They'll say, "I can make him even better." 2) He has played every game this season except one where he was suspended. That's a huge plus 3) He's 26, absolutely at his peak. 4) Didn't Leeds want him last season?

£5m for Danny Batth - Punts is right on his suitors - and £7m for Doherty

I've said he's done largely well this season...(definitely not one of our best players though)

Of course managers are idiots. It's not beyond the realms of possibility that we'll get a daft fee for Doherty (if we were to sell him, as I say I don't think we will as at least in theory he can cover either side and he isn't on big money), I just don't think it's likely. There's stupid and there's "thinking Doherty is an acceptable full back", and there isn't going to be a sea change in mentality in the second tier whereby everyone starts playing three at the back and pushing the wingbacks right on. Hardly anyone has the players to do that, we are fortunate that we do. They might be blind to many things but these will largely be the same managers who actively targeted him every time we started him at LB/RB, and normally to the point where he fucked up and the opposition scored.

 

[MARKakaJIM]

If German Phil exists, and we then bring in, say, an Alex Telles, then Matt rapidly becomes third choice. And with a Championship winners medal in his pocket we might strike while the iron was hot, as it were.

Be very harsh on him to drop behind a guy who's potentially played no competitive football for an entire year and a bloke who plays a different position over the summer after a very successful season from his point of view.

 

[Tredman]

I think we will see less moving on than we expect, Nuno puts a lot on team togetherness - as much as I think doc is a bit crap, he does seem to be one of the most popular players.

I can see us signing 2 strikers, 2 x CM, a RCB and potentially a RWB (assuming German Phil goes), plus making Boly permanent. The emphasis needs to be on adding real quality, not abandoning the team we have built.

 

[GLASGOWOLF]

I've said he's done largely well this season...(definitely not one of our best players though)

Of course managers are idiots. It's not beyond the realms of possibility that we'll get a daft fee for Doherty (if we were to sell him, as I say I don't think we will as at least in theory he can cover either side and he isn't on big money), I just don't think it's likely. There's stupid and there's "thinking Doherty is an acceptable full back", and there isn't going to be a sea change in mentality in the second tier whereby everyone starts playing three at the back and pushing the wingbacks right on. Hardly anyone has the players to do that, we are fortunate that we do. They might be blind to many things but these will largely be the same managers who actively targeted him every time we started him at LB/RB, and normally to the point where he fucked up and the opposition scored.

The way doc splits the forum reminds me of another defender thats gone on and played a lotbof games for Burnley in the top flight.

 

[Tony Towner]

Newcastle spent £5m on Grant Hanley 2 seasons ago. And have since sold him for a decent fee when he was proven to be $#@!. The market has changed drastically since then and Batth probably holds a higher current stock in the game at the moment. Whether he’s actually a better player or not is irrelevant and difficult to actually assess anyway.

So £5m for Batth is not farfetched at all. If Boro, Cardiff, Derby, Villa stay in the championship, they’d be interested (Terry isn’t getting younger, and they don’t have any fit, good enough replacements in the squad). If Forest, Bristol, Norwich or any of the other lower squads had some money to spend they’d
Want him too.

Unless they sell one of Grealish, Chester or Adomah, Villa won't be spending £5m on anyone. If Batth had played the games Bennett has this season I think we'd get the £5m, for those he has I think it'll be more like 3. Also worth noting we won't price him out of a move either given his stature at the club. I hope we've won the league before the Sheffield Wednesday game and he starts that.