Coronavirus

[Elephant Pyjamas]

The Conservatives could not find a single magic money tree during the 2015 general election. Now we are lost in a forest! Magic money trees around the world are being felled to save capitalism from itself.

The Tories now realise they can borrow at extremely low rates and pass the cash directly to its own citizens. This comes after we have watched for a decade as the benefits regime has been sadistic, homelessness has more than doubled, schools are falling apart, hospitals cannot afford staff, and more and more old people die in cold impoverished loneliness.

The electorate just didn’t believe Labour could fund its manifesto - but look at all the cash now available as soon as capitalism itself is made vulnerable.

The UK government stress tested the health service to see how it would cope with a pandemic flu crisis. Exercise Cygnus took place back in October 2016 to see how the country could cope. It established there was a chronic shortage of equipment, including “inadequate ventilation”, or a lack of ventilation machines for those who would have found it difficult to breath.

Without austerity, with proper funding, we could have been prepared. The same is true across Europe. The Italian health services could have had hundreds more ventilators and beds, and doctors would not have had to choose who would die from this new flu.

So yes Johnny you can claim that Socialists are criticising without having answers, but you are wrong, the answer has been there for over 10 years! Austerity was an unnecessary, ideological sham, without which we would be in a far less precarious state now.

 

[Alan]

You're american, your version of socialism is somewhere very slightly to the left of General Pinochet.

By American standards I'm practically a Chairman Mao.

 

[Dublin Drummer Wolf]

Gary Neville speaking really well on Sky News right now.

He's just gone in on Johnson for delivering mixed messages and contradicting himself, whereas Sunak spoke with clarity.

He has opened up his 2 hotels in Manchester for NHS staff to stay in for free. Tremendous gesture. Top man.

 

[Dublin Drummer Wolf]

It's all related. Hopefully, we won't get into situation where Dr's are forced to choose between a 60 year old who needs a ventilator, and 30 year old. But that's not a situation that should be relying on hope.

You can find whitepapers and reports on the threat of this happening going back years. It is not, as Donald Trump is fond of saying ' something that no-one saw coming, no-one.'

Indeed. Look up Event 201 - link

Back in October Bill Gates ran a simulation to map out Global response to a pandemic and created 7 learnings from it, some of which are incredibly relevant right now, such as: Industry, national governments, and international organizations should work together to enhance internationally held stockpiles of medical countermeasures (MCMs) to enable rapid and equitable distribution during a severe pandemic.

and this - Governments should provide more resources and support for the development and surge manufacturing of vaccines, therapeutics, and diagnostics that will be needed during a severe pandemic.

 

[Johnny75]

We have reservists in the army, navy, RAF all ready to go if we go to war, yet we don't/didn't now have "reservist" NHS staff ready to go in case something like this happened.

It would have been so simple too.

I would think that will happen now and nobody had thought about it before.

You're alright Jack, eh? So fuck everyone else. Arseholes are just like opinions. Some of them quite shitty

That literally makes no sense in response to the content of my post. Thanks for your contribution though, well worth it.

You must be furious Johnny, the only way to attempt to save the capitalist economy in this country as result of this, is to adopt Socialist strategies!

You see, this is where Socialists only see their own dogma. I'm happy to see a combination of all policies and given time and place policies should reflect that. Socialists as proved on this very thread hate the government because they wear a blue rosette.

Did a socialist pinch your teddy bear as a child?

Arthur Scargill was one of the first Socialists I can remember. Grade A cunt but not a teddy bear thief as far as I know. Respect to him to standing up to Thatcher too.

 

[Johnny75]

The Conservatives could not find a single magic money tree during the 2015 general election. Now we are lost in a forest! Magic money trees around the world are being felled to save capitalism from itself.

The Tories now realise they can borrow at extremely low rates and pass the cash directly to its own citizens. This comes after we have watched for a decade as the benefits regime has been sadistic, homelessness has more than doubled, schools are falling apart, hospitals cannot afford staff, and more and more old people die in cold impoverished loneliness.

The electorate just didn’t believe Labour could fund its manifesto - but look at all the cash now available as soon as capitalism itself is made vulnerable.

The UK government stress tested the health service to see how it would cope with a pandemic flu crisis. Exercise Cygnus took place back in October 2016 to see how the country could cope. It established there was a chronic shortage of equipment, including “inadequate ventilation”, or a lack of ventilation machines for those who would have found it difficult to breath.

Without austerity, with proper funding, we could have been prepared. The same is true across Europe. The Italian health services could have had hundreds more ventilators and beds, and doctors would not have had to choose who would die from this new flu.

So yes Johnny you can claim that Socialists are criticising without having answers, but you are wrong, the answer has been there for over 10 years! Austerity was an unnecessary, ideological sham, without which we would be in a far less precarious state now.

A good bit of sixth form politics there. I feel like ruffling your hair...

 

[Elephant Pyjamas]

You see, this is where Socialists only see their own dogma. I'm happy to see a combination of all policies and given time and place policies should reflect that. Socialists as proved on this very thread hate the government because they wear a blue rosette.

I agree with this, a combination of the two would be fine by me, it certainly doesn't have to be one or the other, Scandinavian countries seem to have the balance right.

I don't like the Tories because i don't think they have the interests of anyone other than the top echelons of society at heart, there is plenty of evidence out there to back that up too.

I certainly don't think Labour are perfect by any measure either, far from it, but they align more with how i think we should function as a country than the current lot do, and Boris as PM makes me sick.

 

[Elephant Pyjamas]

A good bit of sixth form politics there. I feel like ruffling your hair...

If only i had some to ruffle.

What is there to argue with though?

Did we know this could happen? Yes.

Could we have planned better? Yes.

If we hadn't adopted 10 years of austerity would we be in better shape to deal with this? Yes.

 

[darlowolf64]

The Conservatives could not find a single magic money tree during the 2015 general election. Now we are lost in a forest! Magic money trees around the world are being felled to save capitalism from itself.

The Tories now realise they can borrow at extremely low rates and pass the cash directly to its own citizens. This comes after we have watched for a decade as the benefits regime has been sadistic, homelessness has more than doubled, schools are falling apart, hospitals cannot afford staff, and more and more old people die in cold impoverished loneliness.

The electorate just didn’t believe Labour could fund its manifesto - but look at all the cash now available as soon as capitalism itself is made vulnerable.

The UK government stress tested the health service to see how it would cope with a pandemic flu crisis. Exercise Cygnus took place back in October 2016 to see how the country could cope. It established there was a chronic shortage of equipment, including “inadequate ventilation”, or a lack of ventilation machines for those who would have found it difficult to breath.

Without austerity, with proper funding, we could have been prepared. The same is true across Europe. The Italian health services could have had hundreds more ventilators and beds, and doctors would not have had to choose who would die from this new flu.

So yes Johnny you can claim that Socialists are criticising without having answers, but you are wrong, the answer has been there for over 10 years! Austerity was an unnecessary, ideological sham, without which we would be in a far less precarious state now.

Plus Corbyn didn't have a load of zingy "Catchphrases" that the dumb could lap up

 

[Johnny75]

Indeed. Look up Event 201 - link

Back in October Bill Gates ran a simulation to map out Global response to a pandemic and created 7 learnings from it, some of which are incredibly relevant right now, such as: Industry, national governments, and international organizations should work together to enhance internationally held stockpiles of medical countermeasures (MCMs) to enable rapid and equitable distribution during a severe pandemic.

and this - Governments should provide more resources and support for the development and surge manufacturing of vaccines, therapeutics, and diagnostics that will be needed during a severe pandemic.

OK, say all governments had sunk money into medical counter measures, how should these be kept up to date? Where are they stored? What do you do with the old unused equipment/ medication? Where does the resource to make new ones come from?

It's all very well and good running models but that's just theory, the practicalities are very different.

 

[Tyrannosaurus Dan]

Think the supermarket situation is settling down. Just gone to my local Asda to pick up some essentials for the Mother in Law. Shelves not so empty and got everything she requested. I even managed to find some self control and not attempt to buy everything I saw...go me.

My wife got pasta AND toilet roll in our local ASDA yesterday!

 

[Johnny75]

Plus Corbyn didn't have a load of zingy "Catchphrases" that the dumb could lap up

Only the dumb didn't vote Socialist?

I had you as better than that Darlo.

 

[darlowolf64]

The thing that I believe the Tories are doing wrong is the same as they did with Brexit... Instead of a cross-party initiative to sort the issue, they are banging forwards, blindly hoping that something works

 

[Johnny75]

I agree with this, a combination of the two would be fine by me, it certainly doesn't have to be one or the other, Scandinavian countries seem to have the balance right.

I don't like the Tories because i don't think they have the interests of anyone other than the top echelons of society at heart, there is plenty of evidence out there to back that up too.

I certainly don't think Labour are perfect by any measure either, far from it, but they align more with how i think we should function as a country than the current lot do, and Boris as PM makes me sick.

I think we're in agreement here (I like the Danish model personally). Only Johnson doesn't make me sick, in fact the one good thing from all this is showing that he and Cummings will be gone sooner than they thought as they have been exposed for their vapid and insane natures respectively.

 

[Johnny75]

The thing that I believe the Tories are doing wrong is the same as they did with Brexit... Instead of a cross-party initiative to sort the issue, they are banging forwards, blindly hoping that something works

Do you think the Labour Party would be any different?

 

[darlowolf64]

Only the dumb didn't vote Socialist?

I had you as better than that Darlo.

A lot of dumb people were suckered by the usual tory lies and will pay for it in the long run...
Even you know that the last 10 years of Conservative government has been a complete and utter disgrace of self serving, looking after #1, fuckwitery. You are better than THAT Johnny

 

[darlowolf64]

Do you think the Labour Party would be any different?

No, read what I've written. In both cases there should have/should be a CROSS-PARTY initiative. They should be working TOGETHER for the good of the Country but the Tories just wont...
People keep spouting the "we're at war with the virus" so have a unified approach to combating it

And if the Labour Party was in Government I would expect the same cross-party effort. This isn't a time for bumbling along on your own, merry way

 

[Rui_CostCo]

That literally makes no sense in response to the content of my post. Thanks for your contribution though, well worth it.

Hopefully, once you climb down off that high horse, your family will still be in tact.

 

[Johnny75]

Hopefully, once you climb down off that high horse, your family will still be in tact.

What does that mean?

Are you insinuating my family is at deaths door?

And you've still not answered any point in my post. Do you want to have a go at that or continue the passive aggressive insults?

 

[Johnny75]

No, read what I've written. In both cases there should have/should be a CROSS-PARTY initiative. They should be working TOGETHER for the good of the Country but the Tories just wont...
People keep spouting the "we're at war with the virus" so have a unified approach to combating it

And if the Labour Party was in Government I would expect the same cross-party effort. This isn't a time for bumbling along on your own, merry way

No chance the Labour Party invites the Tories in to deal with this crisis along with them. Definitely not under the current regime.

A lot of dumb people were suckered by the usual tory lies and will pay for it in the long run...
Even you know that the last 10 years of Conservative government has been a complete and utter disgrace of self serving, looking after #1, fuckwitery.

I don't disagree with that as I've said on the last page.