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Coronavirus

I think all of us here are understandably concerned, more than anything, with what will ensure that the fewest people die from this - regardless of political affiliation.

It is kind of hilarious to see "socialist!" as the critique of the concerns raised here - c'mon, you know your own views contain multitudes so give other people the benefit of the doubt, yeah? We're all friends here. Play the ball, not the man. We're gonna disagree about things, and we're going to have different reasons for disagreeing, so let's... talk through those differences.

The fact is, the government and its advisors has done some iffy stuff so far - big controversial u-turn on herd immunity, unclear messaging and guidance, slowness to respond to inevitable demand for essential equipment/supplies/tests/etc, and so on - but nobody here's exactly been calling for the reanimated corpse of Che Guevara to be installed in Number 10.
 
I guess the question is, is this more contagious or more deadly than our models predicted it would be?

Nearly 600 deaths in four days here, it's getting worse by the day. The link below tells you all you need to know. Is it peaking or just accelerating? Given that there's an incubation period of seven days I reckon Monday or Tuesday should be very telling.

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/uk/
 
So, I hear this. I do. But there have been 22,000 influenza deaths in the US alone this season.

I understand that the death rate is higher so far with COVID-19 and the infection spread supposedly easier, but when I hear 22,000 vs 97 (both in the US)... It's a struggle not to think that some of the measures being taken are an overreaction. Or, at least to not wonder why we weren't all freaking the fuck out well before COVID-19 was on the scene.

9 days on, and the 97 is now over a thousand, which is a daily increase on 30%. At that rate you'll be on 15000 in another ten days. With the way trump is behaving I think this will hit you harder than anywhere in the western world
 
So nothing about the tests then?

Seems to me a lot of folks need to take their red specs off.

Just to clarify that point.

On Tuesday the 24th of Match, the Health Secretary Matt Hancock was asked a question by Heather Stewart of the Guardian regarding a statement The Prime Minister had made in The House of Commons, where he recieves Parliamentary Privelidge, where he said that the Nation had ordered 3.5 million test kits to discover who had ever had the virus, asking when we could expect when they would arrive and what they would test for.

Mr Hancock stated we had now bought 3.5 million anti body tests that would allow people to see if they had had the virus and that a new testing facility in milton Keynes would soon be coming online that would help ramp up the effort.

On Friday the 27th, Michael Gove and Dr Jennie Harrie were asked a multi part question on Friday night which consisted of
Were the Cabinet now being tested in light of the days announcements regarding the Prime Minister and The Health Secretary testing positive, aimed at Mr Gove, and towards Dr Harries, could she confirm that the 3.5 million tests had actually been ordered and manufactured and if so from from who?

That was probably driven out of concern regarding a statement apparently from Fernando Simón, the director of Spain's health-emergencies coordination center, that said that Spain checked 9,000 tests purchased from the Chinese company Bioeasy and found that their results were not consistent enough ( being as low as 30% sesnitive instead of 80%) and decided to return them. The Chinese Governemnt subsequently responded that the tests had been purchased from a company without licence and had not been on a government sanctioned list of approved suppliers.

Mr Gove answered the first question quite deftly and once again re-itterated the Governments testing policy, outlining the who/when/why quite succinctly, stayed on message and passed the baton to Dr Harries to answer the second part regarding the previously promised 3.5 million test kits.

Dr Harries again re-itterated the Governments policy on testing, re stated the appropriate measures to take if you thought you were infected and the importance of doing so. She then addressed the question regarding the 3.5 million 'have you had it?' test kits.

She responded by saying these were coming from a variety of different manufacturers, and referenced Prof Chris Witty who had earlier in the week said it was critical that these tests had the right level of sensitivity and specificity (how often they pick it up and how often they are accurate) and that each of the diferent types of tests would be evaluated. Simon Stevens then finished by reminding the public of the current strain on the NHS and hammering home the importance of all of us following government guidelines to the best of our ability.

I and most other people realise there is a battle against time that is currently bein waged and the importance of making wise, informed decisions that are in the nations best interest to ensure as many people as possible survive.

But there is a world of difference between saying 'We have begun a product assesment process whereby we are working with multiple UK test kit manufacturers to establish the sensitivity and specificity of their equipment, and once we are sure that those are within acceptable parameters we will be placing an order and purchasing for 3.5 million kits' and ' we have ordered and bought 3.5million test kits' and not just semantically.

THe first infers that the kits have been ordered and paid for and we are in a full sales cycle the second that we are have not left the product testing phase and once that has been completed, we will enter the sales cycle.

Hope this helps.
 
Squeeze's old boss has been in a very bad way. Looked like he wasn't going to make it on Tuesday and into Wednesday. Still fighting though. This is horrible stuff.
 
Nearly 600 deaths in four days here, it's getting worse by the day. The link below tells you all you need to know. Is it peaking or just accelerating? Given that there's an incubation period of seven days I reckon Monday or Tuesday should be very telling.

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/uk/

Is there any stats for how long the deceased have been in hospital, how many found at home etc... Might put some credence to the measures being taken.

Just went for a dogwalk and traffic wise its just like a saturday.... Blokes delivering sheds or pallets and one chap towing a caravan!!
Really need a lockdown with fines for these businesses that seem above government advise.
 
Some prick from Brum was turned around by the Police in Devon as he obviously fancied a few days at the seaside. Helmet.
 
I've got a slightly different view. Change is a constant and what this pandemic has done is truly challenged the way we live. The organisations that will do well out of this will be the ones who can adapt to their new environment and thrive. Organisations who can function well with a dispersed workforce will question why they have big, expensive buildings to maintain, employees will question why they spend so much time communicating rather than at home with their families. Obviously not all businesses can operate in this way, but the ones that can will have an advantage.

It was heading that way. As a society we have become far more insular with our mobile phones and the x-box generation. Shopping online is increasingly popular etc etc. Would be nice if one day the robots do most of the work and people have more time for leisure. How they keep employment in this new dawn is anybody's guess but a resource based economy may be the answer. The new found empathy is quite reassuring - folk aren't all that bad.

There will be a huge bump but I don't think we'll ever go back to normal ( unless lockdown ends in a month).

I do not think the Western economy could survive prolongued lockdown or our minds the current police state. The economy was soon to hit meltdown in any case so the new powers may help quell any revolt.

I hope (naively) that people will consider healthcare and science as being more important than ever and our true protectors rather than politicians. There will be far more research done into zootonic diseases and a good examination into how such diseases cross-over into humans.

Hope so. But as it stands the Kardashians, Beckhams and other assorted fakery appear to be the media fed role-models.
 
Not everyone who disagrees with you is a socialist, sometimes they just might not think you are correct.

Everybody is a Socialist until they are told they must pay more tax. As Thatcher said ' The trouble with Socialism is that you eventally run out of other peoples money '.
 
Everybody is a Socialist until they are told they must pay more tax. As Thatcher said ' The trouble with Socialism is that you eventally run out of other peoples money '.

Utter bullshit
 
Absolutely. Although I have always said the essential services costed by demand and tax raised to meet it - whatever it costs. I am happy to pay more tax.

It is deeply ironic that capitalists have needed socialist ideas to save capitalism from itself, but you can't use this set of circumstances as some sort of simulation for how a socialist government would look in the UK, it just isn't at all the same.
 
But isn't that the whole point of socialism? Everyone pays more in tax but services are better?

Whereas capitalism is there is a chunk of the populace that EARNS more and take themselves out of needing the services, so the services can be reduced.

What we have going on here is actually a bit different. Massive programme of spending paid for by hugely increasing national debt. And every country is in the same boat. The interesting thing the other side of the crisis will be how quickly countries choose to pay down that debt, or whether we see countries riding with national debt as a higher percentage of GDP for many years, just like after the war.
 
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