Coronavirus

[Papper]

It is deeply ironic that capitalists have needed socialist ideas to save capitalism from itself, but you can't use this set of circumstances as some sort of simulation for how a socialist government would look in the UK, it just isn't at all the same.

I'm not essentially a Capitalist but the cynic in me suggests large scale cash injections are done to save the integrity of the stock market as much as a genuine need for people to pay bills. The stock market collapses and the mega rich go under. The global economy has been falsified for years. I really do not know how Socialism can be defined but I see it as an obligation to care for the vulnerable and that isn't necessarily valued in monetary terms.

 

[darlowolf64]

Fair point. I suspect the theory will be tested heavily in the coming months.

The current government are NOT socialists and are having to use socialist methods to dig themselves out of the shit they've done over the last ten years.
To tell me I'm a "part time socialist" and will change to a Tory as soon as I have to pay taxes (I pay plenty already thanks) and then to quote Margaret bloody Thatcher to support your accusation is bloody insulting.
Hope that clears up my initial reply

 

[Papper]

What we have going on here is actually a bit different. Massive programme of spending paid for by hugely increasing national debt. And every country is in the same boat. The interesting thing the other side of the crisis will be how quickly countries choose to pay down that debt, or whether we see countries riding with national debt as a higher percentage of GDP for many years, just like after the war.

I agree but there comes a point where consumerism and debt are incompatible. I think we were close to that point prior to the virus. Capitalism does not work.

 

[AndyWolves]

This is starting to feel like a match day thread when we've conceded down Doherty's side re: capitalism Vs socialism

 

[Papper]

The current government are NOT socialists and are having to use socialist methods to dig themselves out of the shit they've done over the last ten years.
To tell me I'm a "part time socialist" and will change to a Tory as soon as I have to pay taxes (I pay plenty already thanks) and then to quote Margaret bloody Thatcher to support your accusation is bloody insulting.
Hope that clears up my initial reply

I didn't tell you that you are a part time socialist - mine was a generalisation. If more tax is needed are you prepared to pay more?

 

[darlowolf64]

I didn't tell you that you are a part time socialist - mine was a generalisation. If more tax is needed are you prepared to pay more?

Yes if the services are improved and supplied properly

 

[Papper]

Yes if the services are improved and supplied properly

Same here. How that is communicated to the general public is another thing.

 

[Papper]

This is starting to feel like a match day thread when we've conceded down Doherty's side re: capitalism Vs socialism

It's Johnny's fault for mentioning the Socialism word.

 

[Dennisons Wrong Foot]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e0-2XxgHIXk

 

[darlowolf64]

It's Johnny's fault.

FIFY...

Love you really Johnny :devilsmile:

 

[Paul]

This is starting to feel like a match day thread when we've conceded down Doherty's side re: capitalism Vs socialism

The most sense on this page, well done Sir

 

[AndyWolves]

No system is perfect, if it was that's what everyone would use

 

[playtheace]

Originally Posted by AndyWolves View Post
I've got a slightly different view. Change is a constant and what this pandemic has done is truly challenged the way we live. The organisations that will do well out of this will be the ones who can adapt to their new environment and thrive. Organisations who can function well with a dispersed workforce will question why they have big, expensive buildings to maintain, employees will question why they spend so much time communicating rather than at home with their families. Obviously not all businesses can operate in this way, but the ones that can will have an advantage

And yet, the waste of space HS2 will still happen.

 

[sycophantia]

Thought the mods declared this thread a politics free zone

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

Everything is about politics to an extent though. Certainly here when politicians are making the decisions and we're also dealing with the ramifications of previous political decisions.

 

[Elephant Pyjamas]

Thought the mods declared this thread a politics free zone

I'm not entirely sure how this topic could ever be a politics free zone, the entirety of the strategy to fight it is being run by the government.

 

[Boozad]

It was specifically meant to keep the discussion away from general political chatter and keep it related to the coronavirus topic. The last few posts haven't been, there's a whole section available for discussing the positives and negatives of socialism and/or capitalism.

 

[Elephant Pyjamas]

It was specifically meant to keep the discussion away from general political chatter and keep it related to the coronavirus topic. The last few posts haven't been, there's a whole section available for discussing the positives and negatives of socialism and/or capitalism.

Well as above, Johnny's fault, he loves throwing a grenade in...

 

[lemonjelly]

If I remember rightly the mortuary will start with a capacity of 1,500 but can be scaled up to 12,000 if required.

No problem at all with planning for worst case scenarios - it would be stupid not to given we're learning every day

The NHS England medical director Prof Stephen Powis says if the death toll in the UK from is kept below 20,000, “we will have done very well”.

Powis insists that it is possible to “get on top of this virus” but that if the UK can keep the number of deaths of people who have had Covid-19 under 20,000, it will be a “good result.”

.

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

For me, I don't actually give a shiny shit about politics, be they socialism or capitalism just at the moment. I give a lot of shiny shits about those in charge getting things as right as they can, and keeping the body count down. When we get through that, we can talk about politics of how you sort the mess that remains out.