Wolves 5 v 1 Horwich Wanderers: The Verdict Thread

[Lycan]

Two wrongs doesn't make a right (I almost feel sick typing that level of cliche).

I don't want our players fouling in retaliation to a previous foul.

He's not a fucking saint. He's a 20 year old footballer.

 

[Alan]

He's not a $#@!ing saint. He's a 20 year old footballer.

And? That doesn't mean I'm okay with him or any of our players laying down a cynical tackle.

 

[Kenny]

And? That doesn't mean I'm okay with him or any of our players laying down a cynical tackle.

Maybe football isn't for you....

 

[NE66Wolf]

At my age I don't kick anyone - they are likely to have a harder kick than I can deliver

I can relate to that!

 

[Lycan]

And? That doesn't mean I'm okay with him or any of our players laying down a cynical tackle.

Name me one team in world football that doesn't do that. One.

 

[Del Woppio]

:icon_lol: bloody hell Alan.

I love that Jota puts himself about a bit. He's a strong little fucker too.

 

[Alan]

Name me one team in world football that doesn't do that. One.

There probably aren't any. Doesn't mean I think it should be championed. Just like I find fighting in hockey childish. It's part of the game but certainly something I don't like or think is commendable.

None of this means that I don't like Jota or think he's not a great player, mind. But if he's legitimately fouling guys for no other reason than they fouled him first, that's not something I can get behind.

 

[Langers]

:icon_lol:

He should use eloquent vocabulary and offer to end any disagreements with a firm handshake.

 

[Alan]

He should just get on with the game! He's more than good enough to make the opposition pay without breaking the rules.

Fucking hell, I'm really surprised that my stance here is apparently so beyond the pale.

 

[Langers]

He should just get on with the game!

Fucking hell, I'm really surprised that my stance here is apparently so beyond the pale.

It's part and parcel of the game though, mate. That's the point. You win your personal battles.

 

[Alan]

It's part and parcel of the game though, mate. That's the point. You win your personal battles.

And what happens when someone like Wheater doesn't take the first response lying down? What if Wheater had seriously done harm to Jota last night?

Retaliating is asking for more retaliation. Jota's putting himself in harm's way with that stuff. If you get fouled like that, turn your man, skin him on the wing, anything. You don't need to put him on the ground with your shoulder to make some point about how big a man you are.

 

[The Bear]

If someone is dishing out rough treatment you try and give as good as you get. Otherwise they think they can do it all the time and bully you off your game.

 

[Langers]

And what happens when someone like Wheater doesn't take the first response lying down? What if Wheater had seriously done harm to Jota last night?

Retaliating is asking for more retaliation. Jota's putting himself in harm's way with that stuff. If you get fouled like that, turn your man, skin him on the wing, anything. You don't need to put him on the ground with your shoulder to make some point about how big a man you are.

People are going to - and indeed have - target Jota as he's one of our star players. Plenty of managers will give their clogger of choice the instruction to nail him as soon as they can, to stamp their authority on him etc. It's not like they're only going to be riled when he gives a bit back.

What's he supposed to do? Take the kicking, use puppy dog eyes and hope they don't do it again?

 

[Del Woppio]

Alan, if he hadn't given him some back, he'd probably get even worse treatment.

Even from a pure footballing/tactical point of view, a demonstration of strength can affect how you get marked/tracked.

 

[Alan]

I'm holding my hands up on this one as clearly I'm the only one here who has a problem with it.

Personally I don't think committing a retaliatory foul does anybody any good, but it's not like I have Jota's number to tell him so.

 

[Trips]

I'm holding my hands up on this one as clearly I'm the only one here who has a problem with it.

Personally I don't think committing a retaliatory foul does anybody any good, but it's not like I have Jota's number to tell him so.

If he'd gone through Wheater like he got hit, then I would understand your point. A shoulder barge to show the defender you won't be bullied is fine, no way Wheater could justify his tackle based on that shoulder barge

 

[Alan]

If he'd gone through Wheater like he got hit, then I would understand your point. A shoulder barge to show the defender you won't be bullied is fine, no way Wheater could justify his tackle based on that shoulder barge

To be clear, I didn't mean to imply Wheater was justified. But I don't necessarily trust that there won't be players at this level, marking Jota, who won't get pissed off and think that kind of challenge is justified.

 

[Del Woppio]

Surprised at the victim blaming tbh

 

[MARKakaJIM]

I can see Alan's point.

If a player is looking to put himself about and get physical to stop his opponent then chances are they're going to get more riled up if there's a response in kind. If the original retaliates rather than just shrugging it off then they're only increasing the chances of things ended badly for them, either as the physicality increasing potentially causing an injury or by being reprimanded by the referee. You don't have to 'fight back' to show your resistance to that sort of treatment, you can just carry on regardless showing that you won't be deterred from playing your game in spite of that treatment.

I've seen Messi be on the receiving end of some horrible challenges but more often than not he just sits there, shrugs it off and then wrecks face next time he's got the ball. Let the football do the talking.

I do think it's a bit of a double standard to complain about the nature of the Wheater challenge he whilst at the same time celebrating and encouraging Jota to stand toe to toe with players employing that strategy.

 

[Boozad]

I'm holding my hands up on this one as clearly I'm the only one here who has a problem with it.

Personally I don't think committing a retaliatory foul does anybody any good, but it's not like I have Jota's number to tell him so.

He doesn't commit retaliatory fouls though, he goes in hard and fair to let people know he's not a fucking pushover. It does feel like you're being contrary for the sake of it here.