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[EdgeOfTheAlps]

I don't think we have less incorrect decisions and we have just introduced delays.

I also think football is at its best when it's fast flowing, which isn't achievable with minutes wasted to still get a decision wrong.

I think the stats are 2-3% more correct decisions......but one flip side you have an incorrect on field decision backed up by an incorrect VAR decision backed up by an apology. It's not bloody worth it.

Bin the fucking shit off once and for all and have *one* incorrect decision not layers of them, and the overall shit VAR "experience"

 

[Aikiwolf]

I think the stats are 2-3% more correct decisions......but one flip side you have an incorrect on field decision backed up by an incorrect VAR decision backed up by an apology. It's not bloody worth it.

Bin the fucking shit off once and for all and have *one* incorrect decision not layers of them, and the overall shit VAR "experience"

2-3% is a pretty small figure, especially when calls such as the pen v Luton are classed as "correct".

So, the question is, has the game become more enjoyable with a 3% improvement in decisions and the introduction of delays for a VAR review?

 

[AndyWolves]

AI still need a the output reviewed by a skilled professional so it's a none starter

Joking aside, AI isn't yet in a position that it can run and provide consistently accurate responses without a human reviewing and monitoring the output.

Agreed, it's this and the training of the model that would be the problem.

 

[jd1981]

The most annoying thing about Jones is how he struts around with such arrogance after the decision waving players away etc

 

[Jolemai]

Someone has made a compilation over on Twitter:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1721103718521696603

 

[Johnny75]

2-3% is a pretty small figure, especially when calls such as the pen v Luton are classed as "correct".

So, the question is, has the game become more enjoyable with a 3% improvement in decisions and the introduction of delays for a VAR review?

If only it wasn't complete bullshit.

https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/02640414.2020.1809163

TLdr; VAR has raised correct decision making from 91% to 98%. That figure is beyond statistical significance btw.

Not Howard Webb's stats as a frequently incorrect poster on this subject asserted yesterday.

What hasn't been quantified is the changes in behaviour, less diving, less offsides, less off the ball shenanigans, less dirty fouls and dangerous tackles.

Throwing it all in the bin because somebody thinks (wrongly) it was better in the old days is batshit to me. Just improve the people using it and more importantly the people on the pitch.

 

[fansagainstvar]

If only it wasn't complete bullshit.

https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/02640414.2020.1809163

TLdr; VAR has raised correct decision making from 91% to 98%. That figure is beyond statistical significance btw.

Not Howard Webb's stats as a frequently incorrect poster on this subject asserted yesterday.

What hasn't been quantified is the changes in behaviour, less diving, less offsides, less off the ball shenanigans, less dirty fouls and dangerous tackles.

Throwing it all in the bin because somebody thinks (wrongly) it was better in the old days is batshit to me. Just improve the people using it and more importantly the people on the pitch.

There is a certain pot-kettleness about you calling anyone out on bullshit, as I'm pretty sure it was you who said VAR was "a Premier League problem".

There is no way your second sentence isn't bullshit, because a "correct decision" is subjective. The laws have always been there for the interpretation of referees.

Even if I believed your second sentence, which I don't for one second, it's interesting you are happy to see the spirit of the game destroyed over a subjective 7% increase in correct decisions.

It's interesting the long delays with VAR decisions don't bother you at all, or the fact when a goal is scored you will always have in the back of your mind it may be ruled out for some bullshit. Maybe I'm a luddite, but football was special before VAR. You have fallen right into the trap PGMOL want you to, which is funny as you hate them.

 

[Johnny75]

There is a certain pot-kettleness about you calling anyone out on bullshit, as I'm pretty sure it was you who said VAR was "a Premier League problem".

There is no way your second sentence isn't bullshit, because a "correct decision" is subjective. The laws have always been there for the interpretation of referees.

It's interesting the long delays with VAR decisions don't bother you at all, or the fact when a goal is scored you will always have in the back of your mind it may be ruled out for some bullshit. Maybe I'm a luddite, but football was special before VAR. You have fallen right into the trap PGMOL want you to, which is funny as you hate them.

It's a peer reviewed study, not subjective opinion.

Read it before embarrassing yourself further.

 

[fansagainstvar]

It's a peer reviewed study, not subjective opinion.

Read it before embarrassing yourself further.

Blimey, you're not the brightest spark are you? Or at least you have never worked in academia. Peer-reviewed studies are often debated and even disproven within the world of academia.

I'm not worried about embarrassing myself at all, you have happily embarrassed yourself throughout this entire thread. Gave me a fantastic laugh by thinking VAR was "a Premier League problem", probably one of the most stupid and lazy opinions I have ever encountered in my life.

 

[Elephant Pyjamas]

This guy has made the effort.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1721103718521696603

 

[prawnking]

Blimey, you're not the brightest spark are you? Or at least you have never worked in academia. Peer-reviewed studies are often debated and even disproven within the world of academia.

I'm not worried about embarrassing myself at all, you have happily embarrassed yourself throughout this entire thread. Gave me a fantastic laugh by thinking VAR was "a Premier League problem", probably one of the most stupid and lazy opinions I have ever encountered in my life.

Something tells me this approach is guaranteed to bring even the most pro-VAR fan over to your corner.

You should try it on more fan's forums, winning hearts and minds and all that

 

[Quirkafleeg]

This battle could be even bigger then DW v Pablo..

 

[fansagainstvar]

Something tells me this approach is guaranteed to bring even the most pro-VAR fan over to your corner.

You should try it on more fan's forums, winning hearts and minds and all that

There's no point trying on a forum really. Most fans who wanted VAR are too bloody-minded to admit they might have been wrong and the game was more fun without it.

Like everything in life, positions become entrenched. If we have to keep VAR, the bare minimum should be a "Margin or error" (Umpires call) on offside. The whole thing is pointless in a subjective game though, a black and white technology in a game with a million shades of grey is ludicrous.

I will have a civil conversation with anyone, but Johnny's misinformed nonsense doesn't deserve serious replies.

Edit: Campaign is growing in size every day, with the support of this forum or not many of you guys actually agree and I'm thankful for that.

 

[Carsy]

We definitely have less incorrect decisions, that is a fact.

Everything else that comes with it though, well that's the problem.

Whilst factual we do have less incorrect decisions, I’d potentially argue it causes some refs not to make decisions, knowing that is it’s ‘clear and obvious’ they’ll be bailed out. Whereas without the tech, they’re forced into a decision.

Obviously there’s not study that can be done to say either way, and ironically yesterday the opposites happened. But the Doherty vs Villa and United game the refs have just bottled making a decision so late in the game, and likely thought. ‘Well if I’m wrong then il be sent to the screen’

 

[Johnny75]

Blimey, you're not the brightest spark are you? Or at least you have never worked in academia. Peer-reviewed studies are often debated and even disproven within the world of academia.

I'm not worried about embarrassing myself at all, you have happily embarrassed yourself throughout this entire thread. Gave me a fantastic laugh by thinking VAR was "a Premier League problem", probably one of the most stupid and lazy opinions I have ever encountered in my life.

2 things)

1) I haven't said it's a 'Premier League problem'
2) Ignoring the facts of that study over your own opinion is hilarious.

Tarra petal.

 

[fansagainstvar]

Whilst factual we do have less incorrect decisions, I’d potentially argue it causes some refs not to make decisions, knowing that is it’s ‘clear and obvious’ they’ll be bailed out. Whereas without the tech, they’re forced into a decision.

Obviously there’s not study that can be done to say either way, and ironically yesterday the opposites happened. But the Doherty vs Villa and United game the refs have just bottled making a decision so late in the game, and likely thought. ‘Well if I’m wrong then il be sent to the screen’

100%. Refs don't want to make big decisions thinking VAR will clear it up, but VAR wants to back the ref.

 

[fansagainstvar]

2 things)

1) I haven't said it's a 'Premier League problem'
2) Ignoring the facts of that study over your own opinion is hilarious.

Tarra petal.

You have done this continually my friend. How can you be oblivious to that?

 

[Johnny75]

You have done this continually my friend. How can you be oblivious to that?

Continually proved wrong and you're still going.

Just take the L.

 

[Carsy]

100%. Refs don't want to make big decisions thinking VAR will clear it up, but VAR wants to back the ref.

As I’ve said, that’s just a personal opinion.

I’m not dead set against VAR, I’m just becoming more and more disillusioned with it. I think in certain circumstances it’s really effective, but in others, not so much.

Maybe the PGMOL need to sit down and do a ‘pro’s and cons’ list

 

[The Bear]

There's no point trying on a forum really. Most fans who wanted VAR are too bloody-minded to admit they might have been wrong and the game was more fun without it.

The game was most definitely NOT more fun without it.

Sitting there frustrated while replays showed they've fucked up a decision either for a clear offside or penalty, and there was nothing you could do about it but sit there fuming and accept it. That wasn't in the slightest bit fun.

At least with VAR there's now a chance they sort it out and come to the right decision. We're getting shit decisions still because of the protocols they have in place to govern where and when they use it, and of course the incompetence and arrogance of the current lot of PL referees.

People still celebrate goals. I've never sat there and heard muttering and silence when the ball hits the back of the net and never will.