Wolves 0 - Barnsley 4 verdict thread

[EdgeOfTheAlps]

Yes its a terrible result, a real kick in the bollocks, but I'm inclined to agree with Alan, its far too early to be weeping and wailing, hopefully he will now start to understand what his best team is and the new players get up to speed quickly. If we are still $#@! in 4 or 5 games time then we can worry. Nearly everyone was really optimistic with Zenga and all the new signings and now we have lost one close game and one hammering, everyone is $#@!ting bricks

It's not really the hammering that is the problem though, it's the nature of it and a failure of Zenga's "rotation" which isn't a rotation but a lucky dip to see who makes the matchday squad.

Zenga needs to pick a team (hopefully made up of our new signings for the most part), stick with it generally and change individuals as necessary. Only AFTER that can he know his best 11 and start to "rotate" players in and out.

If he chops and changes 5-7 players after each match he will never find his best 11.

 

[Deano]

Nobody was particularly good but think Oniangue has got off lightly on the reviews i've seen. I've seen him a few times now and he's been terrible each time.

 

[Kenny]

To defend Doherty a little bit on the last 2 goals...at that point he was basically playing with 1 leg as he had done his ankle in. Probably should have gone off and had us finish with 10 men because keeping him on just meant the left back space was left wide open as he couldn't put weight on his foot properly, so any ball knocked beyond him he couldn't turn for.

Staggered he never got booked when he went down injured. His ankle went as he came off the pitch on to the carpet area and he went down in a heap and agony then for some reason he decided to drag himself back on to the pitch to get his treatment!! Odd thing to do as we were 1-0 down and still in the game and he was wasting our time really.

Before the injury, he wasn't that good but certainly not the worst player on the pitch.

Serious issue with how Walter is doing the rotation of the team. Not so much the swapping players around but swapping positions around. After putting in a MOTM performance in DM, Coady was moved back up the midfield and put in a "Coady" performance. Just leave him where he has had a good game. Price did a startling impression of Karl Henry, everything went sideways or backwards (yet he seems to be hero worshiped in some quarters). Worst performance I have seen from Wallace and summed up by one his final contributions - Gets the ball out wide, under zero pressure and a chance to put the ball in the area but his cross managed to hit a Barnsley fan...who was still in fucking Barnsley. Prince was in and out of the game. Felt sorry for Batth on the 1st goal though, seems the rest of the team decided it was his job to stop every shot being fired it.

Special mention to the Assistant Ref on the Steve Bull side of the pitch, who was looking straight at Ikeme when his feet let him down and he let a simple slow ball go out for a corner....did he flag for it? No....he waited until the ref, who was 40 yards away signal a corner before he put his flag up.

 

[Norman Deeley]

Christ, that was a blow. You've got to love Walter, but it's know-how that gets you out of the Champ, not simple passion. But this is what we signed up for: we didn't want it to be boring and it isn't. We're now having more shots at goal than we had in four games last year: if only we had the simple ability to organise a defence

 

[malta mick]

hopefully this Silvio isn't far off the team, which should help. still not happy that we didn't go for a top centre back - not happy with Stearman. then get a settled team with just the odd tweaking here and there

 

[Langers]

It's not really the hammering that is the problem though, it's the nature of it and a failure of Zenga's "rotation" which isn't a rotation but a lucky dip to see who makes the matchday squad.

Zenga needs to pick a team (hopefully made up of our new signings for the most part), stick with it generally and change individuals as necessary. Only AFTER that can he know his best 11 and start to "rotate" players in and out.

If he chops and changes 5-7 players after each match he will never find his best 11.

Not defending him by any means as I agree with you entirely but he has said he's still got no idea about his best XI and that he needs to rotate like this to have some idea of what works best.

But he can't keep doing it if things like last night happen! We need a settled spine to the side at the very least - I was hoping that Saiss-Oniangue-Bodvarsson would have started together by now (and yes, I'm going on what I've heard about Saiss and I've only seen Prince play once) just to give us some form of stability. If players don't perform, fine - switch them out and give someone else a run out.

I hope he has some idea of what works and what doesn't PDQ because we just can't afford another meek surrender. The fans WILL turn if the players give up.

Still far too many question marks over the side for me at the moment, with a lot of players yet to be involved at all.

 

[Wolfman09]

Im not going to give ratings because none of the deserve anything. Just a few observations:

Against Reading our defense and midfield moved forward and backwards as a unit and denied Reading any space and they had to revert to long ball and they looked poor. There was none of that last night

Doherty - was exposed as a right footed left back should not play there again

CBJ - Played well on sat but nowhere to be seen last night - what's that all about ?

Saiss - Expensive defensive midfielder has gone missing !! Don't tell me he's not match fit as the French league started a few weeks ago

John - Gone missing ???

Rotation is ok but you need 7-8 regular starters. WZ needs to decide on his first XI so they can get used to playing together then change only a few if needed.

If that leaves some players out in the cold then they have to impress the manager in training or playing for U23's or leave in January

I like Costa and Cavaliero but to play them both we need a strong midfield 3 with one who will be able to support JDB. The problem is Im not sure Mason has the pace to get up there to support him.

Maybe a central midfield 3 of Saiss, Coady with Prince supporting JDB is the best option ?

Ikeme

Iorfa
Baath
Stearman
CBJ

Coady
Saiss

Coast
Prince
Cavaliero

JDB


Let them play together to gel as a team and only change if needed

 

[Johnny75]

Serious issue with how Walter is doing the rotation of the team. Not so much the swapping players around but swapping positions around. After putting in a MOTM performance in DM, Coady was moved back up the midfield and put in a "Coady" performance. Just leave him where he has had a good game. Price did a startling impression of Karl Henry, everything went sideways or backwards (yet he seems to be hero worshiped in some quarters). Worst performance I have seen from Wallace and summed up by one his final contributions - Gets the ball out wide, under zero pressure and a chance to put the ball in the area but his cross managed to hit a Barnsley fan...who was still in $#@!ing Barnsley. Prince was in and out of the game. Felt sorry for Batth on the 1st goal though, seems the rest of the team decided it was his job to stop every shot being fired it.
.

I think that's a little harsh, I thought he did OK and a couple of balls he sent Wallace down the wing (only for Wallace to fuck it all up). Strangely he looked far better when going forward rather than the pivot of defensive midfield where he doesn't have the mobility. Would've been far better as you suggested to put Coady at DM and Price further forward with Prince and let Price do what he does best.

I agree with you and most on here about Zenga,he needs to pack this rotation crap in. Not just rotation of players and positions but formations. It's a mess of Saunders-esque status but without the horseshit surrounding it. Stick with 1 formation to start and 1 change if that isn't working. Last night we played 4 formations.

Coupled with his lack of full backs getting wide means we play as narrow as possible, if this is Zenga's plan then he can go now as that really isn't ever going to work with these players at this level.

Sadly the one thing we really didn't do this summer is change the backroom staff, analysts, coaches and Kevin Thelwell as this simply isn't working at the moment and it all feels a little Dejavu.

 

[Lord Knows]

Until Walter Zenga knows his players strengths and weaknesses he can't keep exposing whatever his guesswork selection is to an open system. It just exposes players not comfortable playing roles not suited to them. Within that players tend to lose their enthusiasm and hide from the ball compounding the problems.
Zenga has to start with a compact system of play, keep things tight then add flair whenever possible. Not just flair for flairs sake because that just unbalances the whole thing further.
To many square pegs in round holes causing confusion.

 

[Kenny]

Saiss - Expensive defensive midfielder has gone missing !! Don't tell me he's not match fit as the French league started a few weeks ago

and played in non of it as far as I know

 

[arklowolf]

Felt awful and went to bed at 8, just woke up and seen this. A few general points as obviously I cannot comment on the game directly:
Zenga, stop going on about it being pre season it gives excuses and gives out the wrong message.
Pick a first 11 and make changes as and when necessary. You can't have it both ways saying the players have only just joined and then not playing them alongside each other consistently.
Stop over training them and when you do make them train in your favoured formation, first 11 vs second so that they get to know each other, the runs they make and how they like to receive the ball with the odd adjustment throughout. $#@! result so you are coming in tomorrow is old school and I'm not sure this is a group that will respond well to it.
Honeymoon well and truly over. We only drew on Saturday in my view because of some bad managerial calls and it seems tonight he has to take a large lump of the blame. As I have said previously I have no idea if most of our new signings are any good, but the only way to find out is playing them in a settled side. I don't think he'll be here by Xmas.

We'll said.

 

[Johnny75]

Until Walter Zenga knows his players strengths and weaknesses he can't keep exposing whatever his guesswork selection is to an open system. It just exposes players not comfortable playing roles not suited to them. Within that players tend to lose their enthusiasm and hide from the ball compounding the problems.
Zenga has to start with a compact system of play, keep things tight then add flair whenever possible. Not just flair for flairs sake because that just unbalances the whole thing further.
To many square pegs in round holes causing confusion.

I'm not sure if you went to last night's game but there was no flair from Wolves until the 3 portuguese lads came on. It was turgid unenterprising stuff. Keeping it tight did Kenny Jackett no good either.

Not playing your creative players leads to boring, defensive, rubbish football. Playing the attacking players and binning off the average rubbish may lead to more 3-2 scorelines but I'd rather win half the games and end up with 69 points than draw all the games boring everybody to death and get relegated.

The Barnsley manager seems to have his team right and he looks a decent propect, his team played decent enterprising football and that included Adam Hammill. I think he might do a better job with Cav, Tex and Costa than the current incumbent but if the bust up rumours are true no manager is going to want the job with that prick Thelwell sticking his oar in.

 

[Condemned to Rock 'n' Rol]

We poor all night but in the game til the 70 minute mark the goal was inevitable in the space of a few minutes we couldn't clear a thing and literally backed off whenever Barnsley had the ball, The self capitulation in the last 15 minutes was really worrying the players just gave up once the 1st goal went in.

The squad rotation and lack of continuity is definitely a feasible excuse but to give up once the 1st goal went in is excusable and frankly a disgraceful attitude to show the fans in attendance.

 

[Lord Knows]

I'm not sure if you went to last night's game but there was no flair from Wolves until the 3 portuguese lads came on. It was turgid unenterprising stuff. Keeping it tight did Kenny Jackett no good either.

Not playing your creative players leads to boring, defensive, rubbish football. Playing the attacking players and binning off the average rubbish may lead to more 3-2 scorelines but I'd rather win half the games and end up with 69 points than draw all the games boring everybody to death and get relegated.

The Barnsley manager seems to have his team right and he looks a decent propect, his team played decent enterprising football and that included Adam Hammill. I think he might do a better job with Cav, Tex and Costa than the current incumbent but if the bust up rumours are true no manager is going to want the job with that prick Thelwell sticking his oar in.

Yes I was there, I think Walter Zenga keeps repeating past mistake because at no time during this season has he selected a balanced midfield who can both protect the defense while offering consistent links into the striker/strikers.
Until your solid defensively its a continuous struggle so in my opinion Walter Zenga has to provide that framework first.

 

[thehistorymakers]

I went to watch Celtic get trounced at Barca last night, it sounds like Wolves weren't much better. How quickly a manager can go from a hero, to a villain.

 

[thehistorymakers]

but if the bust up rumours are true no manager is going to want the job with that prick Thelwell sticking his oar in.

What are the rumours?

 

[Carrotdude]

The thing is we know that last years players aren't good enough so I want to see the new guys get a run of games. Tex behind Bod with cavaliero and Costa wide. Saiss and Price sitting deep and trying to protect the defence, something like that.

 

[Lycan]

Still can't believe what I watched last night. They just gave up. No fucking bottle at all.

Bodvarsson, Costa, Teixeira and Cavaleiro all looked good (some of them consistently, some only in flashes). They should all start against Newcastle.

Iorfa, Doherty, Stearman, Price, Coady, Mason, Wallace and Oniangue should be fucking ashamed of themselves. Gutless.

 

[pr0sl0]

Someone on the Mix claims Thelwell and Zenga had "a bust-up" (argument? fisticuffs? who knows) over team selection, because Thelwell thinks Zenga keeps picking "the wrong team".

Sounds like bollocks to me, Thelwell's got nothing to do with team selections. Also absolutely astonished at the capacity of some Wolves fans to ignore public statements from Zenga and others about tactical and personnel choices - he has a long record of a) preferring extreme squad rotation, and b) chopping and changing tactics throughout matches, including pushing players into unfamiliar positions. Jackett kept sticking with the same players over and over and over again and we had fans complaining that he was too rigid, now we've got someone who's giving everybody a chance and he's too flexible. Jackett liked wide play and we had people complaining that we were weak in the middle, now we've got a coach who likes a narrower formation it's a lack of width that's our problem. Etc., etc.

This isn't aimed at people on here, btw, more the Mix. I took to checking it regularly for the first time this year during the takeover shenanigans, and now I keep hate-reading it out of morbid curiosity more than anything. Never seen so many kneejerk opinions in one place.

 

[Kenny]

I wouldn't have Price anywhere near protecting our defence. Further up the pitch or on the bench.