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Wolves 0 - Barnsley 4 verdict thread

Iorfa was probAbly our best attacking threat. Yet he takes him off to bring Ivan on and Moves Coady to right back, now that's just stupid.

Coady also then at RB managed to control the ball out of play which ended up leading to the second i think.

That was after he'd taken Price off at half-time, so who was with Prince in midfield?

Costa on for Price, Tex for Wallace and Cav for Iorfa.

Zenga went for it, didn't he, and it failed big style.
 
Our capitulation was down to the complete lack of any protection in front of the defence. At the end we had too many forwards who weren't contributing anything of note defensively and a midfield that went awol. It was like a game of attack v defence and they were clinical while we were woeful.
 
That was after he'd taken Price off at half-time, so who was with Prince in midfield?

Costa on for Price, Tex for Wallace and Cav for Iorfa.

Zenga went for it, didn't he, and it failed big style.

Was Coady and Prince, 442

Then he moved Coady to RB when Ivan came on and it was

Coady Batth Stears Doc







Prince

Costa - Tex - Ivan

Bod - Mason
 
Was Coady and Prince, 442

Then he moved Coady to RB when Ivan came on and it was

Coady Batth Stears Doc







Prince

Costa - Tex - Ivan

Bod - Mason

If you left the big gap deliberately, then you are spot on. This is what Zenga did and they scored in minutes 83, 85 and 92.

Big mistake.
 
Well that was the worst performance i've seen for years, worse than anything last year definitely. I could have taken a bad game and a 1 or 2-0 loss but they gave up after the second goal and that is really worrying. As much as the first few weeks were positive and everything looked like it was on the up tonight kills all that imo, don't want to go over the top but it really was that bad. Zenga got the team wrong and should have changed it before half time but just didn't seem to know what to do. On to the players who now haven't got tomorrow off because they had tonight off.

Ikeme - Not sure he could have done anything about the goals but his distribution is shocking. It's far to slow, misplaced and just doesn't set us up for any meaningful attacks.

Iorfa - Not the Iorfa that we know, out of position, doesn't get forward like he used to or does for Eng under 21's. Did get forward well maybe 3 times but he needs to be doing it more.

Batth - Back to the old Danny, awful and uncomfortable on the ball. Doesn't know how to defend 1 vs 1 and pretty poor in the air. Tbf had no protection from midfield.

Stearman - More comfortable on the ball than Batth but struggled when put under any real pressure defensively. Silly errors but same as Batth with the midfield protection.

Doherty - Back off some more Matt. Didn't have the pace or guile to be effective going forward and stood too far off his man, especially Janko when he came on.

Price - Supposed to be in front of the back four i think because he never seemed to be there or anywhere to do anything.

Coady - No idea what his role was, gave the ball away constantly and didn't provide any cover. Ruined by Hammill when moved to right back.

Prince - Terrible in the first half, improved for 20 minutes in the second half and may have scored if he wasn't pulled back but like the other 2 not good enough.

Wallace - Has to be MOTM despite his end product being poor because his effort and drive was the only positive. No idea why he was taken off.

Mason - Another who reverted to the old Mason, poor touch, rabbit in headlights when he got near the box and just no threat.

Bodvarsson - Tough night for him, should have scored from his one real chance but put it over. Needed help because Roberts and in particular MacDonald had him well marshaled.

SUBS

Costa - Ran at them a but but not with any impact of Wallace.

Teixeira - Awful apart from one sublime pass to Bod who should have scored. Needs to learn that he's not going to get the free kicks and penalties that he would in Portugal. Looks unfit all of a sudden.

Cavaleiro - Did actually try when he came on to do something and put a couple of decent crosses in but no one got near them. Big signing and has to play.

Zenga has a big couple of weeks now because without going overboard tonight was not acceptable and 2 or 3 similar performances will not be tolerated. Saturday is going to be tough and he needs a reaction from himself and his players, he does also need to settle on base of players who play the majority of games whether they are fully fit or not.
 
Regardless of the team. The Hammill goal and the rocket were piss poor defending.
 
Regardless of the team. The Hammill goal and the rocket were piss poor defending.

Yeah they were and so was the 4th, it was horrific. Hammill walked past 3, Doherty just backed off and then Batth got beat to easy and Bradshaw turned Stearman with ease.
 
I know that American football isn't everyone's cup of tea over there, but let me give you an analogy.

In 2007, the University of Alabama hired Nick Saban as its head coach, despite the fact that he had just flopped very hard in the NFL with the Miami Dolphins. In his first season, Saban was not very successful, going 7-6 and losing to Louisiana Monroe (essentially the equivalent of Wycombe beating Arsenal). Many fans wanted Saban gone after that loss, which was also a home game (and Homecoming [basically an annual event in which tons of alumni come back to the school to reminisce and also watch an easy victory for the football team], to boot).

Saban was not fired, and Alabama has lost only 11 games in 9 years since. They have won 4 national titles since and Saban now has an overall 85% win rate.

On the day of the Louisiana Monroe loss, Saban said that sometimes great things are built from great tragedy.

This loss can be the moment from which great things are built with this team. That is, IF (and it is a big if) Zenga and the players have the mettle for it.

Time will tell.

American football isn't a sport so not a good analogy.
 
Well that was the worst performance i've seen for years, worse than anything last year definitely. I could have taken a bad game and a 1 or 2-0 loss but they gave up after the second goal and that is really worrying. As much as the first few weeks were positive and everything looked like it was on the up tonight kills all that imo, don't want to go over the top but it really was that bad. Zenga got the team wrong and should have changed it before half time but just didn't seem to know what to do. On to the players who now haven't got tomorrow off because they had tonight off.

Ikeme - Not sure he could have done anything about the goals but his distribution is shocking. It's far to slow, misplaced and just doesn't set us up for any meaningful attacks.

Iorfa - Not the Iorfa that we know, out of position, doesn't get forward like he used to or does for Eng under 21's. Did get forward well maybe 3 times but he needs to be doing it more.

Batth - Back to the old Danny, awful and uncomfortable on the ball. Doesn't know how to defend 1 vs 1 and pretty poor in the air. Tbf had no protection from midfield.

Stearman - More comfortable on the ball than Batth but struggled when put under any real pressure defensively. Silly errors but same as Batth with the midfield protection.

Doherty - Back off some more Matt. Didn't have the pace or guile to be effective going forward and stood too far off his man, especially Janko when he came on.

Price - Supposed to be in front of the back four i think because he never seemed to be there or anywhere to do anything.

Coady - No idea what his role was, gave the ball away constantly and didn't provide any cover. Ruined by Hammill when moved to right back.

Prince - Terrible in the first half, improved for 20 minutes in the second half and may have scored if he wasn't pulled back but like the other 2 not good enough.

Wallace - Has to be MOTM despite his end product being poor because his effort and drive was the only positive. No idea why he was taken off.

Mason - Another who reverted to the old Mason, poor touch, rabbit in headlights when he got near the box and just no threat.

Bodvarsson - Tough night for him, should have scored from his one real chance but put it over. Needed help because Roberts and in particular MacDonald had him well marshaled.

SUBS

Costa - Ran at them a but but not with any impact of Wallace.

Teixeira - Awful apart from one sublime pass to Bod who should have scored. Needs to learn that he's not going to get the free kicks and penalties that he would in Portugal. Looks unfit all of a sudden.

Cavaleiro - Did actually try when he came on to do something and put a couple of decent crosses in but no one got near them. Big signing and has to play.

Zenga has a big couple of weeks now because without going overboard tonight was not acceptable and 2 or 3 similar performances will not be tolerated. Saturday is going to be tough and he needs a reaction from himself and his players, he does also need to settle on base of players who play the majority of games whether they are fully fit or not.

I agree with all of this. Wallace MOTM for trying Is a low bar. Yes he did try and was involved in some good moves. If his end product had been 3/10 instead of 1/10 we might have scored in the first half and even won the game!

Tex can't play CM. Disgusting performance from him. Can't run, can't tackle, too weak. Way too much of a luxury for CM in the championship.

Prince reminds me of Tongo Doumbia just without the 4 good games.

Was Mason on the pitch!?
 
I agree with all of this. Wallace MOTM for trying Is a low bar. Yes he did try and was involved in some good moves. If his end product had been 3/10 instead of 1/10 we might have scored in the first half and even won the game!

Tex can't play CM. Disgusting performance from him. Can't run, can't tackle, too weak. Way too much of a luxury for CM in the championship.

Prince reminds me of Tongo Doumbia just without the 4 good games.

Was Mason on the pitch!?


Your hatred for JT is absolutely bizarre. Plenty of players to hate on tonight, he wasn't one of them.
 
Iorfa was probAbly our best attacking threat. Yet he takes him off to bring Ivan on and Moves Coady to right back, now that's just stupid.

Coady also then at RB managed to control the ball out of play which ended up leading to the second i think.

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
TSB was pretty much right and I agree with DW, Zenga just doesn't have it or his defence isn't listening. Zenga's tactics are now apparent, he likes his full backs to sit, plays a defensive midfielder and likes to contain rather than press. Nothing wrong with those things as a tactic if you do them well and for 45 minutes we defended very well.

We just didn't create. Anything. At all.

And this seems to be the nub of the issue, tonight we were narrow and with full backs tucked in and not allowed forward we have no width. The one time in each half Iorfa did go forward he put in one good and one bad cross. The same with Doherty, going forward he went outside once, getting to the byline and putting a fairly poor cross in, even when pushed inside Barnsley crowded him out and he lost the ball high up the field.

The big issue was the change to 4-4-1-1 (or 4-4-2 as I know it), taking off Price and putting the midfield of Voady and Price worked at first but Mason was quickly worse than Wallace which was an effort after Wallace's first half. Contrary to what has been written on here the players knew exactly where they should've been and where they were playing. The game became very open and Prince and Coady were getting picked apart by the excellent Hourahan (MotM). Costa is a winger and should be played as such and when the ball went wide he quickly skinned his full back and started scaring Barnsley to death.

But then Barnsley scored and it was shameful defending from Doherty, Stearman and Batth who stood statuesque whilst Barnsley pinged the ball about. Ikeme looked like he should've done better too.

Then Zenga's shit or bust sub. Oh dear, this went wrong very quickly and the defensive 5 of Ikeme, Doherty, Stearman, Batth and Coady proved they are a bottom half Championship defence with Zero leadership and a rickety 'keeper. The goals and capitulation from the 75th minute on were an embarrassment to professional football, capped by Matt Doherty getting megged by a through ball and Hourahan hitting the post which Barnsley would've deserved making it 5-0.

Ikeme - 2 - Not really troubled in the first half. Poor distribution, fumbled crosses and spiller shots before his pretty poor attempts at saving anything. His footwork is just poor. Shame Lonergan is worse.

Doherty - 2 - First half his distribution, quick touches and forward movement was excellent. However, he just can't defend, gave his man oceans of space, and criminally for me, he hid. He tucked himself in and didn't get near anybody with the ball and made no attempt to and this got worse. Even basic defensive technique eluded him. This was the bad old Doherty make no mistake.

Batth - 5 - Headed it, kicked it and his distribution wasn't bad even moving forward with confidence with the ball. When the midfield went over attacking he was one of the few that didn't give up but in the end he just wasn't good enough to make a tackle on Adam fucking Hammill and that's just shite for a central defender.

Stearman - 2 - Hopefully the Stearman as the next coming of Baresi has been put to bed. Simply shit in every dept.

Iorfa - 6 - Restricted unnecessarily and looked frustrated and I don't blame him. Defended well but did little of note apart from one cross.

Prince - 6 - mobile, hard working, lax in possession and unlucky not to win a free kick with one of his driving runs from central midfield. Victim of Zenga's bizarre formation before the break where he played wide left. He is not a defensive midfielder but he is a driving box to box player but he needs to learn the defensive side quickly.

Coady - 6 at CM - 2 at RB - Worked hard and used the ball intelligently, tried to play some intelligent balls forward and won the ball well. Struggled with the quick movement of Hourahan. Simply abysmal at RB getting just about everything wrong and I really felt for him in the end as it seemed to mentally crush him.

Wallace - 4 - Nothing worked for him tonight, too slow when the Barnsley keeper inexplicably passed him the ball and then made numerous wrong decisions with the ball including a simple square ball to Bod which would have cut the keeper and last defender out.

Mason - 4 - Some intelligent touches but essentially anonymous, created little and when central was simply never in the game. Far too slow in his decision making for a deep forward and not quick enough to play out wide. He criminally gave up in the 2nd half.

Bod - 7 - A Bod performance, worked hard, created openings and seemed very, very frustrated. Unfortunately fed on scraps when the final ball should've been better.

Costa - 6 - looks fantastic going forward and scares players to death, unlucky not to win a few free kicks when clearly tugged back. Not sure defending is in his vocab as he didn't do much of it. Should've started.

Tex - 5 - His touch and vision are very good, his decision making frustrating and his defensive abilities are elusive. A real mixed bag and certainly not a central midfielder in a 4-4-2 but that's not his fault. Far, far better when playing behind Bod directly where he can run and skip past players, which he did with ease.

Cav - 6 - A real live wire and looks like he can play anywhere and the 3 Portuguese boys look a handful when they are pinging the ball around between them and Bod.

This result is on Zenga and the back 5 in the main. Shocking from all concerned and I expect all professional footballers to be just that and last seasons players cannot hold their heads up and say they were at any point after the first goal went in.

Zenga looked clueless tonight for the first time.

I'm hoping it was just a bad day at the office.
 
Can't agree with a couple of things there Johnny, mainly your ratings for Batth, Coady and Wallace. Batth did not look comfortable on the ball at any point, he doesn't want it and doesn't know what to do when he gets it. He also did give up, look at his challenge in the build up to the 4th goal. Coady was also very poor, he gave the ball away constantly trying shit passes that were too ambitious or just misplaced. I agree Wallace didn't have much quality but his movement and work rate off the ball help when he isn't having the best game, when Costa came on Hammill started to have a field day.

Couldn't give Bod a 7 either, he wasn't given great but apart from the one chance that Macdonald may have got something on he was in his back pocket. MacDonald was the centre half we haven't got on this performance, quick, strong and good in the air. No idea how he's played before tonight since they signed him from Torquay but he was different class tonight.
 
Fair enough Slink that's your opinion. I thought Wallace was shocking, technically average, yes he ran hard but that doesn't make up for his decision making which wouldn't be out of place on a Sunday league pitch. Nowhere near good enough tonight and guilty of wasting 2 clear cut goal and 3 passing opportunities.

Batth did give up on the last goal looking at the highlights but I think you're wrong on his distribution, other than that I though he did well against Winnall and Armstong. Stearman's distribution was so poor it was only bettered by Ikeme's, highlighted by one knock down header that went straight out of play, comically bad.

I think you're being harsh on Costa as he was clearly told to play on the full back as we changed formation and it was only when Iorfa was taken off that Hammill ran riot against a shocking Coady. Again we'll have to agree to disagree on Coady in the first half, it's not his fault he doesn't have Tex's vision and he can't really play as a creative midfielder.

On Bod, he rinsed MacDonald twice in each half and it was Tex's pass that put him in on goal. He won plenty of headers but Wallace and Mason displayed sloth like thinking and anticipation as to where the 2nd ball would be.
 
Some awful performances Price was the worst of all, Mason was terrible in the main closely followed by Wallice and Coady (100% effort but shit) could've been 2 down at the break. We are too slow through midfield, but although embarrasing wasn't the worst I've seen us play in the last 6 months never mind years.
Walter is on a learning curve now alright! The way we capitulated is gonna be hard to deal with but he must realize he's making too many changes.
On the other hand Barnsley were very good and we were carved to pieces.
All in all these last 2 home games have cooled my expectation somewhat but not time to shit one pants just yet
 
There's no excuse for defending in the way that we did this evening. Thirteen new players (many of whom were not involved tonight) and a new manager are all professionals and therefore should be able to defend to a level.

Barnsley are better than most people expected, but let's not kid ourselves or make excuses, tonight was simply not good enough and a number of our lads need to take a long, hard look at themselves after that.

I agree with this.
cant see us getting anything at newcastle, hope im wrong

But I could not see us getting anything from Newcastle before the season started.

There were 43 attempts at goal in this game and 26 of those came from Barnsley. Normally we would be chuffed to bits with 17 attempts and 60% possession. The defendingw as dire. Zenga has cancelled the day off. Let us hope he has learned enough to ensure this does not happen again
 
Felt awful and went to bed at 8, just woke up and seen this. A few general points as obviously I cannot comment on the game directly:
Zenga, stop going on about it being pre season it gives excuses and gives out the wrong message.
Pick a first 11 and make changes as and when necessary. You can't have it both ways saying the players have only just joined and then not playing them alongside each other consistently.
Stop over training them and when you do make them train in your favoured formation, first 11 vs second so that they get to know each other, the runs they make and how they like to receive the ball with the odd adjustment throughout. Shit result so you are coming in tomorrow is old school and I'm not sure this is a group that will respond well to it.
Honeymoon well and truly over. We only drew on Saturday in my view because of some bad managerial calls and it seems tonight he has to take a large lump of the blame. As I have said previously I have no idea if most of our new signings are any good, but the only way to find out is playing them in a settled side. I don't think he'll be here by Xmas.
 
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