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Trump

Trump and Putin becoming big buddies isn’t good for us in Europe, get the next 4 years out of the way without too much damage and, hopefully, America will come to it senses and we can get back to a bit of normality.
Things won't be the same again in our lifetime. Democrats could get in to power promising to start USAID again, pay the big price of defending Europe and rejoin WHO, but I think that is a hard sell, especially when you are likely to have JD Vance when Trump leaves politics.
What makes it so difficult to go back to like we were before Trump, as any big investors or organisation now knows, that in 4 years after the Democrats leave office, it can all be taken down again by Vance. That is not a very investor. friendly proposition, for people to invest big money.
The other important thing is, there are likely to be big problems with the countries in Europe, who are more Russian friendly. They can see that Europe is weaker than the US, Russia and China. Come to any conflict, it is possible that they choose to side with Russia.
The UK and EU need to speak with one voice for defence and be prepared for the worst.
 
America and Russia in a land grab and Europe almost being forced into being another super state out of necessity.
Sounds like a world set up similar to 1984, some have already started to re-write history.
It’s simple Russia invaded Ukraine in 2022 with no legitimate reason other than a historical claim going back a 1,000 years.
On JD Vance the bloke is clearly an idiot firing multiple questions at Zelensky to start with how is he supposed to answer?
As for that prick of a journalist attacking Zelensky about not wearing a suit, fuck off you arrogant areshole 101 other things that are more important to ask.
Trump, Vance and some of the invited media had the attitude of “we are America and respect us and do as your told”
 
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I think trump wants cheap rare earth stuff from Ukraine and wants to lift sanctions on Russia so he can buy cheap oil and gas.

Increased defence spending for European nations would be a boon for the US too
 
I think trump wants cheap rare earth stuff from Ukraine and wants to lift sanctions on Russia so he can buy cheap oil and gas.

Increased defence spending for European nations would be a boon for the US too
Throw in he wants to end the war as he told his supporters he would and it’s just a transactional issue to be sorted in the best interest of the USA and to hell with the wider consequences. Russia will bide its time, re-arm with oil and gas revenues and return to war when it suits them, and it won’t just be Ukraine.
 
Throw in he wants to end the war as he told his supporters he would and it’s just a transactional issue to be sorted in the best interest of the USA and to hell with the wider consequences. Russia will bide its time, re-arm with oil and gas revenues and return to war when it suits them, and it won’t just be Ukraine.
Im not sure Russia can really afford another conflict, they're behind individual member countries of Europe let alone combined.

That said though, if Russia needs to spend on defence then they will, regardless of what that might mean for their citizens
 
Im not sure Russia can really afford another conflict, they're behind individual member countries of Europe let alone combined.

That said though, if Russia needs to spend on defence then they will, regardless of what that might mean for their citizens
They can’t afford it the moment but a few years of oil revenue and they will be able to. I read they’re currently putting 35% of their GDP into “defence” and there’s little the Russian population can do to stop it.
 
Im not sure Russia can really afford another conflict, they're behind individual member countries of Europe let alone combined.

Unfortunately, you could change the word Russia, for the UK and EU and it would be just as true.
Also, with Russia realising that the UK and EU are going to beef up our military considerably, if they did have any desires to go in to another neighbouring country, there is no time better than now, as we have declared our hand, as not good enough to take on Russia and not being unified in to agreeing to spend enough money to defend ourselves.
Putin will have helped with his popularity back at home having taken the part of Ukraine he wanted and also having a US president, that thinks the sun shines out of his ass.
 
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BREAKING: Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy breaks his silence on Donald Trump's disastrous Oval Office outburst with stunning grace and class — but refuses to apologize to Trump as demanded by MAGA.

And the best part? He did it on Fox News.

This is what a real world leader sounds like...

"President Trump said after your meeting that you disrespected him and the vice president and all of America in the Oval Office," said Fox News' Bret Baier when Zelenskyy appeared on his show. "Do you think you did? And do you think you owe an apology to President Trump?"

"Thank you so much. First of all, thank you for the invitation, for this dialogue and good evening to all of your country, to all Americans," said Zelenskyy. "I'm very thankful to Americans for all your support. You did a lot. I'm thankful to President Trump and to Congress's bipartisan support and I was always very thankful from all of our people."

"You helped us a lot from the very beginning, here in three years of full scale invasion. You helped us to survive and anyway we are strategic partners," he continued.

"And even in such tough dialogue — and I think we have to be very honest and we have to be very direct to understand each other because it's for us very necessary," said Zelenskyy.

"To President Trump — and with all respect that he wants to finish this war — but nobody wants to finish more than we because we in Ukraine we are in this war, we are in this battle for freedom, for our lives," he went on.

"So I'm just telling that I think we have to be on the same side and I hope that the president on our side together with us and that is very important to stop Putin," continued Zelenskyy. "And I heard from President Trump a lot of times that he will stop the war and I hope he will. And we need to pressure him with Europe, with all the partners."

"And I think this dialogue had to be a little bit earlier to understand where we are," he continued. "Like you know, I don't remember exactly, but like President Reagan said that peace is not just the absence of war."

"Yes, we are speaking about just, lasting peace, about freedom, about justice, about human rights and that's why I said that 'I think so' to ceasefire," he went on. "And you know Putin, he's broken twenty-five times ceasefire during all these years, ten years."

"So I'm not hearing from you Mr. President a thought that you owe the president an apology," said Baier, clearly trying to pander to Trump who was almost certainly watching at home.

"No I respect the president and I respect the American people and if — I don't know, I think that we have to be very open and very honest and I'm not sure that we did something bad," replied Zelenskyy.

"I think maybe somethings we have to discuss out of media, with all respect to democracy and free media but there are things where we have to understand the position of Ukraine and Ukrainians," he added. "And I think that is the most important thing."

"We are partners. We are very close partners. We have to be fair. We have to be very free," said Zelenskyy, sounding far more like an American president than Donald Trump did today.

This is an astonishing display of statesmanship. Rather than give into ego or pettiness, Zelenskyy is rising above Donald Trump's childish bullying to serve his people.

Zelenskyy isn't interested in following Trump down into the gutter. He's interested in securing a lasting peace for his innocent embattled country, a task made all the more difficult by Trump's kowtowing to Vladimir Putin.

Zelenskyy is also correct that these conversations should take place behind closed doors instead of being exploited to create a media circus. Trump and Vance ambushed him in the Oval Office in front of reporters because they knew that it would make headlines and entertain their base.

They are not serious leaders. Zelenskyy is.
 

Did they ask the Elon?
Trump took the piss out of him about his clothes as soon as he got out of the car, pointing at him and saying 'I love your outfit, nice you made an effort' or words to that affect.

Disgraceful humiliation and bullying of a brave leader from the get go which is all yesterday was about
 
BREAKING: Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy breaks his silence on Donald Trump's disastrous Oval Office outburst with stunning grace and class — but refuses to apologize to Trump as demanded by MAGA.

And the best part? He did it on Fox News.

This is what a real world leader sounds like...

"President Trump said after your meeting that you disrespected him and the vice president and all of America in the Oval Office," said Fox News' Bret Baier when Zelenskyy appeared on his show. "Do you think you did? And do you think you owe an apology to President Trump?"

"Thank you so much. First of all, thank you for the invitation, for this dialogue and good evening to all of your country, to all Americans," said Zelenskyy. "I'm very thankful to Americans for all your support. You did a lot. I'm thankful to President Trump and to Congress's bipartisan support and I was always very thankful from all of our people."

"You helped us a lot from the very beginning, here in three years of full scale invasion. You helped us to survive and anyway we are strategic partners," he continued.

"And even in such tough dialogue — and I think we have to be very honest and we have to be very direct to understand each other because it's for us very necessary," said Zelenskyy.

"To President Trump — and with all respect that he wants to finish this war — but nobody wants to finish more than we because we in Ukraine we are in this war, we are in this battle for freedom, for our lives," he went on.

"So I'm just telling that I think we have to be on the same side and I hope that the president on our side together with us and that is very important to stop Putin," continued Zelenskyy. "And I heard from President Trump a lot of times that he will stop the war and I hope he will. And we need to pressure him with Europe, with all the partners."

"And I think this dialogue had to be a little bit earlier to understand where we are," he continued. "Like you know, I don't remember exactly, but like President Reagan said that peace is not just the absence of war."

"Yes, we are speaking about just, lasting peace, about freedom, about justice, about human rights and that's why I said that 'I think so' to ceasefire," he went on. "And you know Putin, he's broken twenty-five times ceasefire during all these years, ten years."

"So I'm not hearing from you Mr. President a thought that you owe the president an apology," said Baier, clearly trying to pander to Trump who was almost certainly watching at home.

"No I respect the president and I respect the American people and if — I don't know, I think that we have to be very open and very honest and I'm not sure that we did something bad," replied Zelenskyy.

"I think maybe somethings we have to discuss out of media, with all respect to democracy and free media but there are things where we have to understand the position of Ukraine and Ukrainians," he added. "And I think that is the most important thing."

"We are partners. We are very close partners. We have to be fair. We have to be very free," said Zelenskyy, sounding far more like an American president than Donald Trump did today.

This is an astonishing display of statesmanship. Rather than give into ego or pettiness, Zelenskyy is rising above Donald Trump's childish bullying to serve his people.

Zelenskyy isn't interested in following Trump down into the gutter. He's interested in securing a lasting peace for his innocent embattled country, a task made all the more difficult by Trump's kowtowing to Vladimir Putin.

Zelenskyy is also correct that these conversations should take place behind closed doors instead of being exploited to create a media circus. Trump and Vance ambushed him in the Oval Office in front of reporters because they knew that it would make headlines and entertain their base.

They are not serious leaders. Zelenskyy is.

They did it not only to entertain his base, but to have an excuse to withdraw aid and support. Putin put this plan in place since the 90s, and his asset has executed his plan perfectly. Europe needs to step the fuck up, because the US is no longer an ally
 
BREAKING: Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy breaks his silence on Donald Trump's disastrous Oval Office outburst with stunning grace and class — but refuses to apologize to Trump as demanded by MAGA.

And the best part? He did it on Fox News.

This is what a real world leader sounds like...

"President Trump said after your meeting that you disrespected him and the vice president and all of America in the Oval Office," said Fox News' Bret Baier when Zelenskyy appeared on his show. "Do you think you did? And do you think you owe an apology to President Trump?"

"Thank you so much. First of all, thank you for the invitation, for this dialogue and good evening to all of your country, to all Americans," said Zelenskyy. "I'm very thankful to Americans for all your support. You did a lot. I'm thankful to President Trump and to Congress's bipartisan support and I was always very thankful from all of our people."

"You helped us a lot from the very beginning, here in three years of full scale invasion. You helped us to survive and anyway we are strategic partners," he continued.

"And even in such tough dialogue — and I think we have to be very honest and we have to be very direct to understand each other because it's for us very necessary," said Zelenskyy.

"To President Trump — and with all respect that he wants to finish this war — but nobody wants to finish more than we because we in Ukraine we are in this war, we are in this battle for freedom, for our lives," he went on.

"So I'm just telling that I think we have to be on the same side and I hope that the president on our side together with us and that is very important to stop Putin," continued Zelenskyy. "And I heard from President Trump a lot of times that he will stop the war and I hope he will. And we need to pressure him with Europe, with all the partners."

"And I think this dialogue had to be a little bit earlier to understand where we are," he continued. "Like you know, I don't remember exactly, but like President Reagan said that peace is not just the absence of war."

"Yes, we are speaking about just, lasting peace, about freedom, about justice, about human rights and that's why I said that 'I think so' to ceasefire," he went on. "And you know Putin, he's broken twenty-five times ceasefire during all these years, ten years."

"So I'm not hearing from you Mr. President a thought that you owe the president an apology," said Baier, clearly trying to pander to Trump who was almost certainly watching at home.

"No I respect the president and I respect the American people and if — I don't know, I think that we have to be very open and very honest and I'm not sure that we did something bad," replied Zelenskyy.

"I think maybe somethings we have to discuss out of media, with all respect to democracy and free media but there are things where we have to understand the position of Ukraine and Ukrainians," he added. "And I think that is the most important thing."

"We are partners. We are very close partners. We have to be fair. We have to be very free," said Zelenskyy, sounding far more like an American president than Donald Trump did today.

This is an astonishing display of statesmanship. Rather than give into ego or pettiness, Zelenskyy is rising above Donald Trump's childish bullying to serve his people.

Zelenskyy isn't interested in following Trump down into the gutter. He's interested in securing a lasting peace for his innocent embattled country, a task made all the more difficult by Trump's kowtowing to Vladimir Putin.

Zelenskyy is also correct that these conversations should take place behind closed doors instead of being exploited to create a media circus. Trump and Vance ambushed him in the Oval Office in front of reporters because they knew that it would make headlines and entertain their base.

They are not serious leaders. Zelenskyy is.
If the US pulls out of Ukraine, when and how do you think the war will finish?
 
They did it not only to entertain his base, but to have an excuse to withdraw aid and support. Putin put this plan in place since the 90s, and his asset has executed his plan perfectly. Europe needs to step the fuck up, because the US is no longer an ally
I sort of agree with this, we really need to step up and quickly.
 
Europe putting itself in such a weak military position and being beholden to America was always asking for trouble. Expanding eastwards had its advantages but opened the door to problems playing out too. Trying to play collectively with a straight bat is seen as laughable by Putin when he knows it’s pretty much impossible for them to agree on anything while he does what he likes with the sweep of a pen.

Seems to me the NATO force alone is pretty much a waste of space as it stands and I’m not sure we can get involved in disputes in non NATO countries anyway.

Can only assume Zelenskyy signs the deal and the countries committed to NATO spend like never before very, very quickly and those who want to return east do so.

Leaves anyone not in NATO in an extremely vulnerable position but I’m not sure we’re in any position to stop Putin doing whatever he likes with those.
 
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