The Rugby Thread

[Bit on the shaggies]

It's a good point, especially as there's no real second tier (at least, to the best of my very limited knowledge) or pyramid system with American Football. Either you get a contract in the NFL or you don't have anything.

I believe that many of the Eagle's team are NFL "drop outs", but they have problems converting because there are not that many transferable skills. For instance most NFL players never touch a ball, will never have passed it, don't run, and the 'tackling' isn't comparable.

Having said that, athletically they are probably second to none.

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

Apparently rugby is the fastest growing participation sport in the States. Give it a decade and they might end up being competitive. Scotland still aren't clear with 18 minutes left and the States might be able to sneak something from a good performance.

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

Bonus point on the board for Scotland. 10 points to 7 lead in the group over the Boks. They will still need to beat the South Africans to top the group though, you would imagine.

 

[Johnny75]

Good result in the end for the Scots. The Americans just ran out of steam. A decent game though. I have been surprised at how good the games have been considering many in the press said a lot of games would effectively by dead rubbers.

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

I didn't see the Australian drubbing of Uruguay this morning, but there hasn't really been another shellacking. Namibia stayed competitive and fought well even against the might of New Zealand. Maybe the days of the 100 point slaughter in the group stages of the World Cup are now in the past?

 

[Johnny75]

Looking back at yesterday's game and listening to the various pundits. Many of them have gone for England lost the game rather than Wales winning it excuse (indiscipline, poor decision making, bad substitutions, lack of ideas). I don't think that's particularly fair on the Welsh who I thought played pretty well.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

I didn't see the Australian drubbing of Uruguay this morning, but there hasn't really been another shellacking. Namibia stayed competitive and fought well even against the might of New Zealand. Maybe the days of the 100 point slaughter in the group stages of the World Cup are now in the past?

Just progress I guess and it happens in most sports, worth remembering the Rugby World Cup isn't even 30 years old yet and the likes of Argentina weren't getting any form of competition rugby outside of the four year cycle until very recently. Outside of countries with the approximate population of Dudley, you don't really get that many thumpings in international football these days, at least as far as Europe goes - not that long ago since England beat Turkey 8-0. You don't get absolute no hopers qualifying for the Europa League very often, let alone the Champions League. Cricket wise, Afghanistan, Ireland, Bangladesh, they give anyone a decent game in ODIs nowadays given reasonably favourable conditions.

 

[jd1981]

Looking back at yesterday's game and listening to the various pundits. Many of them have gone for England lost the game rather than Wales winning it excuse (indiscipline, poor decision making, bad substitutions, lack of ideas). I don't think that's particularly fair on the Welsh who I thought played pretty well.

It was combination of both Wales played well and hung in there, but you can't deny that was poor discipline at the breakdown that cost England heavily.

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

Looking back at yesterday's game and listening to the various pundits. Many of them have gone for England lost the game rather than Wales winning it excuse (indiscipline, poor decision making, bad substitutions, lack of ideas). I don't think that's particularly fair on the Welsh who I thought played pretty well.

I think it was a bit of both to be honest. The Welsh scrum was going backwards for most of the game, and they dealt with that by getting Fauletau to break from the back almost as soon as it was hooked. That is good play in that they found a way to check the big weakness.

At the end of the day, at 19-9, England should have been looking to pull away. They did give away penalties that kept Wales within 7 point range, and then there was the opportunity for the fine Welsh try.

The poor subs and lack of ideas probably do lie firmly at the feet of S Lancaster esq. What was more bizarre was his feeling that Burgess and Barritt was a good idea as a centre partnership.

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

That looked a great try by Simon Zebo. But no - foot in touch.

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

Ireland comfortably in charge. Romania are tackling themselves to a complete standstill and the heavy point scoring will come when they are knackered. Simon Zebo and Tommy Bowe look bloody quality.

 

[Bit on the shaggies]

Ireland comfortably in charge. Romania are tackling themselves to a complete standstill and the heavy point scoring will come when they are knackered. Simon Zebo and Tommy Bowe look bloody quality.

The whole team looks quality if you ask me. I wouldn't be amazed if they got to the final. They and New Zealand look to be the teams to beat this year.

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

They are on New Zealand's side of the draw aren't they?

 

[BillyDee]

Further to the comments about rugby in the US, whilst it is a growing sport over there, they mostly play 7s. Still, Fiji started the same way and are now a very decent 15s team (hopefully very very decent come Thursday...).

 

[Bit on the shaggies]

They are on New Zealand's side of the draw aren't they?

The winner of Ireland's pool will play the runner up of New Zealand's and vice versa. So they can only meet in QFs (basically if Ireland lose to France) or the final.

 

[Alan]

It's a good point, especially as there's no real second tier (at least, to the best of my very limited knowledge) or pyramid system with American Football. Either you get a contract in the NFL or you don't have anything.

It's not quite that simple, there's the CFL, AFL, practice squads, and numerous semi-pro teams.

 

[The Bear]

Apparently the New England Patriots practice squad are paid very handsomely and don't even have to travel away with the team. They just stay at home.

 

[Donegal Wolf]

I believe that many of the Eagle's team are NFL "drop outs", but they have problems converting because there are not that many transferable skills. For instance most NFL players never touch a ball, will never have passed it, don't run, and the 'tackling' isn't comparable.

Having said that, athletically they are probably second to none.

I saw an interview with Nigel Melville a couple of world cups ago, he was involved in a project in the U.S rugby where they would identify American Footballers who had fallen just short of the NFL to play rugby and that it had surprised them how hard it had been for them to transfer over to rugby, as you said magnificent athletes but they struggled with the skill sets as they dont have the equivalent, even the basic fitness was different, the gridiron boys had trained for years and years for explosive burst over 10-15 seconds, now you were asking them to hit rucks/tackle continuously over a number of minutes.

Suppose some progress has been made as they won one of the stages of the world 7's last year.

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

The other problem is how many positions in gridiron actually touch the ball in a game? Let alone pass it? Quarterback, Running Back, the Wide Receivers, the Tight Ends, Special Team kick returner? Plus the style of passes isn't the same as in rugby at all (apart from the odd pass to a running back behind the line of scrimmage) so the method of catching the ball is completely different.

Add to that the completely different style of impact between the offense and defense to a tackle in rugby and you can see how massively different the games are to each other.

A kick returner would be a very useful runner in rugby during broken play, but he needs to receive the ball in a completely different way (unless you stuck him at full back and he was catching Garryowens all day without pressure on the catch).

 

[Donegal Wolf]

The whole team looks quality if you ask me. I wouldn't be amazed if they got to the final. They and New Zealand look to be the teams to beat this year.

The France game is the key, win that and we have Argentina in the quarters, then probably the winner of the group of death so it is possible, lose it and its the All Blacks, then Springbok in the semi final.

Saying that I don't think we will win it we could get close but we have a fundamental problem when we meet the heavyweights in that we are not big enough to run over or fast enough to run around them in the centre so despite all our coaching and playsets etc we will eventually come up short against one of the big guns. If only BOD and Darcy were 10 years younger.

Along with that we have an unfortunate habit of losing the really tight 1-2pt games over the last couple of years.