The F1 Thread

[FrankMunro-371]

I have never agreed with these team orders regarding overtaking. It is called motor racing, and it should not end up like a procession.

 

[Deano]

What can be done though?

Didn't they try banning team orders a few years back and if i remember right they just used code words and got round it anyway.

 

[The Bear]

 

[Lord Knows]

Why not one team one driver, to many cars on the track as it is.

 

[Law's Bus]

I have never agreed with these team orders regarding overtaking. It is called motor racing, and it should not end up like a procession.

That's true, but the fact is that motor racing is a TEAM sport where the individual drivers are the public's focus of attention. It has always been that way - Mercedes and Auto Union before WW2 operated like it, Bugatti and Sunbeam before them.

How stupid would Red Bull have looked if both drivers ruined their tyres trying to beat one another? Or if both cars were so intent on winning that they ran out of fuel? Or even if they crashed into one another again, like in Turkey 2010?

I don't agree much with Bernie Ecclestone, but many years ago he remarked that if the drivers were the be-all and end-all, then they should hire a circuit, stand on the starting grid wearing their full gear and watch just how many people turned up.

 

[FrankMunro-371]

That's true, but the fact is that motor racing is a TEAM sport where the individual drivers are the public's focus of attention. It has always been that way - Mercedes and Auto Union before WW2 operated like it, Bugatti and Sunbeam before them.

How stupid would Red Bull have looked if both drivers ruined their tyres trying to beat one another? Or if both cars were so intent on winning that they ran out of fuel? Or even if they crashed into one another again, like in Turkey 2010?

I don't agree much with Bernie Ecclestone, but many years ago he remarked that if the drivers were the be-all and end-all, then they should hire a circuit, stand on the starting grid wearing their full gear and watch just how many people turned up.

You are right, it is a team sport, and had both drivers crashed it would have been disastrous for the team. My concern is though, we do not to go back to the days of drivers going around a circuit in procession, lap after lap. Team orders are fine, and should be adhered to, but to the racing fan, we want to see drivers trying to overtake, irrespective of the teams they drive for. I would prefer it if they were told to only overtake a team mate with extreme car.

 

[Nando]

Ruin their tyres racing? God forbid.

That's the problem.

 

[Law's Bus]

Ruin their tyres racing? God forbid.

That's the problem.

I refer the honourable gentleman to the Belgian GP of 1979 where the Ligier team-mates of Laffite and Depailler were so desperate to beat each other that they wrecked their tyres and handed the win to Jody Scheckter's Ferrari.

Tyres that don't last if you abuse them is hardly a new phenomenon.

 

[Nando]

I'll go back to Melbourne.

Kimi has a quick car, rather than engage in a battle with the front three of Vettel, Alonso and Massa he sits three seconds behind them looking after his tyres. It's intelligent from Lotus and himself in the context of the race but it's bloody boring.

Tyres shouldn't be ever lasting, but we shouldn't have a scenario that discourages racing.

 

[Law's Bus]

we shouldn't have a scenario that discourages racing.

I absolutely couldn't agree more - but then as someone who counts Gilles Villeneuve, Bernd Rosemeyer and Ronnie Peterson as three of the all-time greats (with a total of ONE European Championship between them), I could hardly do otherwise!

 

[broughtonwolf]

Seems a good opportunity to relive the famous Villeneuve / Pironi Ferrari duel.

 

[Carrotdude]

I'll go back to Melbourne.

Kimi has a quick car, rather than engage in a battle with the front three of Vettel, Alonso and Massa he sits three seconds behind them looking after his tyres. It's intelligent from Lotus and himself in the context of the race but it's bloody boring.

Tyres shouldn't be ever lasting, but we shouldn't have a scenario that discourages racing.

There is definitely a balance that needs to be found, I think as the season progresses the tyres will improve and the teams will get better at getting more out of them. I quite like it when there is a battle between either pushing as hard as possible and making an extra stop or trying to save your tyres and eke them out for one stop less. FWIW I have thoroughly enjoyed both races so far.

 

[Nando]

It's not entirely dissimilar to when we had refuelling except tyre wear is now the determining factor instead of fuel load. The difference now though is that you look after your tyres and are therefore not on the limit whereas before you had to wring everything out of your car to try and make the extra stop worthwhile.

There have been some really bizarre regulations in the relatively recent past. The whole Q3 fuel burn was an absurd idea along with the race fuel final qualifying, then we had no tyre changes in 2005 now it's gone completely the opposite way.

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

Hmmm

new pictures have "emerged" of webber cutting up vettel immediately after the chequered flag. Wonder who got those shots released eh, Seb?

 

[The Bear]

It was hardly a big secret. The clip was all over YouTube the other day.

 

[Nando]

Some lovely quotes from Seb regarding Mark flying about. I can't stand him.

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

Seb is a truly classless wanker of an individual. I hope Webber knocks him off the track in the next race.

 

[The Bear]

Yes, he's been less than contrite about it all today.

 

[Langers]

Can't Red Bull fine him or something? The guy is a twat.

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

He's richer than God and they can't afford to piss off their sponsors who rather like the teutonic numbnuts.