REFERENDUM RESULTS AND DISCUSSION THREAD

[The Saturday Boy]

Ken Clarke has said he would accept a soft Brexit, though he'd prefer to Remain. Reality is Corbyn won't want to back anyone else as he's happy sitting on the fence.

The same “soft Brexit” that the Labour Party would want to negotiate? Until very late in the day, none of the opposition parties had any role to play in the negotiations because they were excluded, but it seems very clear that membership of the customs union and single market would have been what Labour were looking for and is something the EU wanted too - what you might call the “easiest deal in history” to borrow a phrase.

Such a deal would not have got through this Parliament though.

 

[Tony Towner]

Stupid, arrogant prick.

https://twitter.com/tnewtondunn/status/1163963029924528133?s=19

 

[Templeton Peck]

The same “soft Brexit” that the Labour Party would want to negotiate? Until very late in the day, none of the opposition parties had any role to play in the negotiations because they were excluded, but it seems very clear that membership of the customs union and single market would have been what Labour were looking for and is something the EU wanted too - what you might call the “easiest deal in history” to borrow a phrase.

Such a deal would not have got through this Parliament though.

Right. There were opportunities to avoid No Deal through compromise but Lib Dems, TIG and Lucas voted against or abstained. No Deal is on them.

 

[Tredman]

Lol. Fanbois.

 

[Johnny75]

Right. There were opportunities to avoid No Deal through compromise but Lib Dems, TIG and Lucas voted against or abstained. No Deal is on them.

This is fine wummery. I tip my hat to you.

Nobody could be that stupid to believe what you've written.

 

[The Saturday Boy]

Right. There were opportunities to avoid No Deal through compromise but Lib Dems, TIG and Lucas voted against or abstained. No Deal is on them.

Labour also voted against the Withdrawal Agreement, the consequence of which led to May going and Johnson picking up the no deal mantle.

The consequences of no deal rest firmly with the government, but it is Parliament that has enabled it...and that includes the Labour Party.

 

[Templeton Peck]

This is fine wummery. I tip my hat to you.

Nobody could be that stupid to believe what you've written.

From the man who believes Corbyn's letter an attempted Communist coup!

 

[Templeton Peck]

Labour also voted against the Withdrawal Agreement, the consequence of which led to May going and Johnson picking up the no deal mantle.

The consequences of no deal rest firmly with the government, but it is Parliament that has enabled it...and that includes the Labour Party.

The Withdrawal Agreement was essentially hard brexit but dealing with NI though. Labour's soft Brexit was a much better compromise but views were too entrenched on either side.

 

[Johnny75]

From the man who believes Corbyn's letter an attempted Communist coup!

Whatabouttery too. You're having a blinder, what's next victimhood from the media?

Are you really stupid enough to believe that No deal is on the Lib Dems, Lucas and TIG? Really?

 

[The Saturday Boy]

The Withdrawal Agreement was essentially hard brexit but dealing with NI though. Labour's soft Brexit was a much better compromise but views were too entrenched on either side.

I don't disagree with you, but a soft Brexit would unlikely to have got through this parliament because it would have destroyed the conservative Party. For various reasons, every political party in Parliament is culpable for the situation we are in to some extent - that includes SNP, Lib Dems, Labour and the Greens no matter what Mr Angry says. It has been a collective failure.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

"Soft Brexit" is a daft concept in itself. Let's not kid ourselves that there was the path to the land of milk and honey, if only we'd followed it.

The whole thing is ludicrous.

 

[The Saturday Boy]

"Soft Brexit" is a daft concept in itself. Let's not kid ourselves that there was the path to the land of milk and honey, if only we'd followed it.

The whole thing is ludicrous.

Brexit is a daft concept, particularly now when we still feel the consequences of a global recession and austerity politics. There are inescapable facts - the Tories pushed through a referendum they didn’t think would deliver an out result and then everyone panicked when they realised. A “soft Brexit” makes rejoining the EU easier in future and could also have been the foundation of a long term departure if the political will was such, gradually dismantling our membership in a planned and considered manner. Unfortunately, politics got in the way.

I am not at all in favour of the EU or it’s direction if travel but give me the option of a customs union/free market Brexit and no deal...then I would go for the former over the latter. Give me a choice between a customs union/free market and remain and I go for the latter.

The Tories offer no deal, Lib Dems offer Remain but there is no chance that the Lib Dems are going to get a majority in Parliament. It is almost guaranteed that Labour would run an election based on a soft Brexit followed by a binary choice binding referendum between that deal and remain. The EU, given the choice of no deal or a customs union type deal would be willing to negotiate even if that meant just inserting a customs union into the current withdrawal agreement which immediately gets rid of the need for a backstop.

If there is a general election called, it is a binary choice - no deal with the Tories or the possibility of no Brexit with Labour. A vote for the Lib Dems is wasted unless it is tactical to unseat a Tory and with any luck in those constituencies Labour voters will pile in on the Lib Dems. Likewise, Lib Dems and Greens should be piling in to ensure Labour wins in marginals to keep the Tories out.

The only problem is “yeah but Corbyn”. I guarantee that the current Labour Party membership would only elect a left wing leader so while the face might change, the politics won’t.

 

[Tredman]

The policies are not the problem, it's the environment that Corbyn has fostered - the anti-Semitism, the racism, the hatred, the attitude of 'we're right you can fuck off'.

This comes from him and his staff. He's probably crippled the labour party for at least a generation, if not ever. Let's hope a truly liberal open party can take their place. As a life long labour voter, and member for most of my life, I would be very happy to see 'Corbyn's labour' vanish from the face of this earth.

 

[Templeton Peck]

Whatabouttery too. You're having a blinder, what's next victimhood from the media?

Are you really stupid enough to believe that No deal is on the Lib Dems, Lucas and TIG? Really?

The 'whatabouterry' is entirely relevant. You called me stupid. I suggest that your belief that Corbyn was plotting a communist coup is a case of pot and kettle.

 

[Templeton Peck]

The policies are not the problem, it's the environment that Corbyn has fostered - the anti-Semitism, the racism, the hatred, the attitude of 'we're right you can fuck off'.

This comes from him and his staff. He's probably crippled the labour party for at least a generation, if not ever. Let's hope a truly liberal open party can take their place. As a life long labour voter, and member for most of my life, I would be very happy to see 'Corbyn's labour' vanish from the face of this earth.

None of which is true. WTF is Corbyn's Labour by the way?

 

[Tredman]

None of which is true. WTF is Corbyn's Labour by the way?

There is literally no point in discussing it with you. It's rather sad, we used to think the UK was mercifully free of what's called 'cadres' in developing countries. Sadly not.


Edit - outriders seems to the twitter term.

 

[Templeton Peck]

There is literally no point in discussing it with you. It's rather sad, we used to think the UK was mercifully free of what's called 'cadres' in developing countries. Sadly not.


Edit - outriders seems to the twitter term.

So no thoughts on what Corbyn's Labour is then?

 

[Tredman]

So no thoughts on what Corbyn's Labour is then?

There is literally no point in discussing it with you. It's rather sad, we used to think the UK was mercifully free of what's called 'cadres' in developing countries. Sadly not.


Edit - outriders seems to the twitter term.

.

 

[Johnny75]

The 'whatabouterry' is entirely relevant. You called me stupid. I suggest that your belief that Corbyn was plotting a communist coup is a case of pot and kettle.

I apologise for calling you stupid it was harsh. It still doesn't change my point that you really can't be serious that no deal is not in any part Corbyn's fault?

 

[Templeton Peck]

What do you think he could have done?