• Welcome, guest!

    This is a forum devoted to discussion of Wolverhampton Wanderers.
    Why not sign up and contribute? Registered members get a fully ad-free experience!

REFERENDUM RESULTS AND DISCUSSION THREAD

Dinowolf said:
If you can find me an honest politician that always speaks plainly, I would be impressed. Ask any politician a question and you never get a straight answer.
Click to expand...

i appreciate the sentiment Dino, but you too have ducked a question. you can't complain about being lied to if you don't challenge politicians for the lies they tell.

'always speak plainly' or 'never get a straight answer' is not the same as a outright lying.

"do you think democracy is best served by politicians being honest and being held accountable for what they say or by the doublespeak you describe above?"
 
thehistorymakers said:
What? It is the biggest change in British history. We haven't even started yet.

If it hasn't changed history, why are the remain camp taking it so bad?
Click to expand...

Rewriting history is when the leave campaign claim they never actually meant that £350 million should be spent on the NHS. The result of the referendum alters the course of our future, it does not change our past.
 
nimrod said:
no you didn't answer it. i didn't ask if you took notice of it, but whether you defend it.

you don't have to answer the simple question i asked, "do you defend the lie?", just don't pretend that you did.
Click to expand...

Did both Campaigns lie? The people who voted remain, weren't influenced by the 350 million, nor was I. I didn't take any notice of it then and I don't now. Both sides were lying and I can see through it.

The real question is, can you accept the democratic process and that remain lost?
 
nimrod said:
no you didn't answer it. i didn't ask if you took notice of it, but whether you defend it.

you don't have to answer the simple question i asked, "do you defend the lie?", just don't pretend that you did.
Click to expand...

The true figure was £164M surplus each week. It's all spin and they can make up the difference in attributing other benefits and costs savings from exiting the EU. It was debuncked at the time if people did their research. Blair told the biggest lie which resulted in the deaths of thousands. We continue to bomb the ME and do nothing about Palestine. Stuff like that is far more important.
 
He said Corbyn was elected with an overwhelming mandate.

 
thehistorymakers said:
The real question is, can you accept the democratic process and that remain lost?
Click to expand...

The amount of people (there were a lot) who voted remain also have a voice. Those who will take over from Cameron have to build a positive relationship within Europe. They are free to lobby their MP's on issues that are important to them (That's democracy).
 
Papper said:
The amount of people (there were a lot) who voted remain also have a voice. Those who will take over from Cameron have to build a positive relationship within Europe. They are free to lobby their MP's on issues that are important to them (That's democracy).
Click to expand...

So is accepting you lost, in a democratic election.
 
Papper said:
First point, we are currently in the EU and it's not made us a more prosperous place. In fact more than a few have been decimated.

I have seen no cohesion in the EU, no rise in equality and more obscure countries should not have a say on our destiny.

The Corporations of the world and the banks are more powerful than any Politician. We are better placed to put people first by the UK Ballot box.

Our EU Commissioner (I thought) given his background was there to serve Multi-Nationals. He was not elected by the British people (He was a Lord).

In short - Time for the people to take more control of their lives.
Click to expand...

It's not the EU which has 'decimated' us, it has been the policies of the parties we elected. Our EU commissioner was also chosen by the government we elected. We have no one to blame but ourselves - though I'm sure the Daily Mail and Sun are already looking for another group to blame, my money is on it all being Corbyn's fault from now on.
 
The Saturday Boy said:
Sorry but this is just a crass generalisation. There are 650 politicians in parliament, others in the devolved parliaments of Scotland, Northern Ireland and Wales and many 1000s in councils the length and breadth of the country. You really believe that not one of them gives a straight answer?
Click to expand...

Yep
 
thehistorymakers said:
Did both Campaigns lie? The people who voted remain, weren't influenced by the 350 million, nor was I. I didn't take any notice of it then and I don't now. Both sides were lying and I can see through it.

The real question is, can you accept the democratic process and that remain lost?
Click to expand...

again, you seem incapable of answering the question. it seems pretty clear though that you're defending politicians telling lies by virtue of the fact that in your opinion "they all do it". any undermining of democracy that arises as a result, you don't seem to care about.

i accept the result of the democratic process absolutely and expect the parties promises to be delivered, namely the £350m/wk increase to the NHS. but if it's a lie, i expect all self styled "democrats" to stand up and hold the liars to account. i've said before i don't actually think many people really believe in democracy. there are plenty of phonies around who talk the talk though.
 
tredman said:
It's not the EU which has 'decimated' us, it has been the policies of the parties we elected. Our EU commissioner was also chosen by the government we elected. We have no one to blame but ourselves - though I'm sure the Daily Mail and Sun are already looking for another group to blame, my money is on it all being Corbyn's fault from now on.
Click to expand...

The media will want somebody who plays ball but Corbyn is a very naughty boy. He serves people not the corporations.

I don't think there is anything left to make the economy boom again so whoever gets in has a problem convincing people that the ' good times ' are a thing of the past.
 
Cyber-_-man said:
Out of 650 MPs about 150 from all parties were in the leave camp.realistically only they can enthusiastically get on with the task of implementing the will of the people. Both major parties have shown a real lack of solidarity to uphold the will of the people so far. If they don't like what is happening stand down and trigger by elections. Trigger 20 of those and it's bye bye majority should tory seats get lost.

Yes it is a mess. All divorces are messy. There are no winners only degrees of losing. Cameron was aware of that when he called a referendum.Eu leaders were aware of that when they kicked his arse on reform and changes. That was where this was lost. If the changes requested in February had been made and ratified remain would have won by a landslide!
I am so far unimpressed with the limp leadership from all sides with regard to what happens next but accept it is early days. Politicians need to grow a set sand get on with the job mandated by the people. Sturgeon will be doing just that for Scotland. She may however find the people are referendumed out
Click to expand...

I think that is a good thing, in the same way that the Lib Dems held back Conservatives from making too much destruction then I would hope having remain supporters on the leave committee will prevent too much devastation and alienating ourselves from Europe.
 
nimrod said:
again, you seem incapable of answering the question. it seems pretty clear though that you're defending politicians telling lies by virtue of the fact that in your opinion "they all do it". any undermining of democracy that arises as a result, you don't seem to care about.

i accept the result of the democratic process absolutely and expect the parties promises to be delivered, namely the £350m/wk increase to the NHS. but if it's a lie, i expect all self styled "democrats" to stand up and hold the liars to account. i've said before i don't actually think many people really believe in democracy. there are plenty of phonies around who talk the talk though.
Click to expand...

I'm not defending them, I just don't take any notice of them.
Maybe if you would have come out and complained about the remain campaign's exaggerations during the campaign, i could understand your concern about truthfulness in politics. You didn't.
 
nimrod said:
again, you seem incapable of answering the question. it seems pretty clear though that you're defending politicians telling lies by virtue of the fact that in your opinion "they all do it". any undermining of democracy that arises as a result, you don't seem to care about.

i accept the result of the democratic process absolutely and expect the parties promises to be delivered, namely the £350m/wk increase to the NHS. but if it's a lie, i expect all self styled "democrats" to stand up and hold the liars to account. i've said before i don't actually think many people really believe in democracy. there are plenty of phonies around who talk the talk though.
Click to expand...

That point has been answered over and over yet you still persist with it. Who said this and why is it a lie?

You say you accept the result of the democratic process but it is clear that you haven't. Concentrating on a poster/bus advert to try to make an inappropriately small point is puerile.

'The bus advert may not be right, so the referendum is invalid' is a desperate attempt to circumvent true democracy.
 
Papper said:
The UK voted for Brexit and that is what will happen. It's irreversible.
Click to expand...

You might be surprised.

The MSP veto stuff being mentioned is probably piss and wind, but I can still see plenty of slips between cup and the Brexit lip
 
Paddingtonwolf said:
You might be surprised.

The MSP veto stuff being mentioned is probably piss and wind, but I can still see plenty of slips between cup and the Brexit lip
Click to expand...


She stopped Labour getting elected in the last election. Far too much power for somebody who is quite insignificant (unless your Scottish).

She's like a sheep tic. Parasitical and abusing her privilege.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

darlowolf64
  • Locked
The Clique and how to join it...
Replies
6
Views
2K
The Bear
The Bear
lemonjelly
The Mental Health thread
49 50 51
Replies
1K
Views
101K
Del Woppio
Del Woppio
Back
Top