REFERENDUM RESULTS AND DISCUSSION THREAD

[Johnny75]

Address the point for God's sake man. Should this 'we won deal with it' crap be put aside now and everybody listened to or not? Or you going to admit that it isn't the will of the people (you need 100% for it to be the will of the people) to leave the EU but the result of an advisory referendum? And are you going to pack in the juvenile 'you lost' and actually come up with a plan that is best for all of Britain?

I'm sick to death of hearing you crow about how bad others are and how 'you won'. It isn't getting you anywhere and it's just pissing people off. We've had a good deal of debate on here the last few days without you so maybe you can join in with some pertinent points instead of your trite crap.

You can't change the past so attacking the speaker is pointless (I would've thought you'd have got that by now).

 

[thehistorymakers]

I should've added wrong too.

Any chance you can address the points John Major has slapped you down with?

I think you should read what he says more closely. "Shouting down people is against our traditions of tolerance."

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

He's right.

 

[Johnny75]

I think you should read what he says more closely. "Shouting down people is against our traditions of tolerance."

Any chance you can address the point?

 

[thehistorymakers]

Address the point for God's sake man. Should this 'we won deal with it' crap be put aside now and everybody listened to or not? Or you going to admit that it isn't the will of the people (you need 100% for it to be the will of the people) to leave the EU but the result of an advisory referendum? And are you going to pack in the juvenile 'you lost' and actually come up with a plan that is best for all of Britain?

I'm sick to death of hearing you crow about how bad others are and how 'you won'. It isn't getting you anywhere and it's just pissing people off. We've had a good deal of debate on here the last few days without you so maybe you can join in with some pertinent points instead of your trite crap.

You can't change the past so attacking the speaker is pointless (I would've thought you'd have got that by now).

It isn't advisory anymore. You will not call me a bigot or insult me. You can't bully me. John Major never gave a vote on Mastrich and Blair never gave us a referendum. They didn't care about the will of the people, but their own personal interests. So it doesn't surprise me that they don't like the result and don't agree with the majority.

 

[thehistorymakers]

He's right.

I am not the one shouting people down or insulting people, Paddy.

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

No, you are the one who has said "you lost, get over it" for 8 months.

 

[Tredman]

Shame, this thread was quite good yesterday. Turned into a big pile of steaming poo again today.

 

[thehistorymakers]

Shame, this thread was quite good yesterday. Turned into a big pile of steaming poo again today.

Yes, that is because we are talking about Brexit today. I have been quite conciliatory since Christmas. I think most people have accepted that we are leaving now. John Major and Tony Blair get huge amounts of money for doing speeches on the EU. I find them quite devisive and not constructive to where we are now. They probably help with newspapers sales though.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

Free speech though isn't it. They're free to say what they want so long as it doesn't break any laws, just as Nigel Farage has spent two decades indulging in dog whistle racism and rank hypocrisy. Then it's up to anyone listening to agree or disagree.

The culture that the arguments that the likes of Ken Clarke, John Major and Tony Blair have made need to be "silenced" is horrific.

By the way Major's point on approaching discussions in a conciliatory fashion rather than the ridiculous belligerence we've shown so far is spot on.

 

[thehistorymakers]

Free speech though isn't it. They're free to say what they want so long as it doesn't break any laws, just as Nigel Farage has spent two decades indulging in dog whistle racism and rank hypocrisy. Then it's up to anyone listening to agree or disagree.

The culture that the arguments that the likes of Ken Clarke, John Major and Tony Blair have made need to be "silenced" is horrific.

By the way Major's point on approaching discussions in a conciliatory fashion rather than the ridiculous belligerence we've shown so far is spot on.

They don't need to be silenced but it needs to be taken in to perspective that they recieve a lot of money for making pro EU speeches.

 

[Trips]

It isn't advisory anymore. You will not call me a bigot or insult me. You can't bully me. John Major never gave a vote on Mastrich and Blair never gave us a referendum. They didn't care about the will of the people, but their own personal interests. So it doesn't surprise me that they don't like the result and don't agree with the majority.

Major and Blair never offered votes on the EU, good job that hero of the people Cameron stepped forward then :icon_lol:

Cameron didn't give a shit about the will of the people either, he wanted to shut up the backbenchers and rid the issue of the EU from his party.

 

[thehistorymakers]

By the way Major's point on approaching discussions in a conciliatory fashion rather than the ridiculous belligerence we've shown so far is spot on.

Agreed with this, but it would also help if some people with power in the EU, took this in to account too.

 

[Lord Knows]

Major and Blair never offered votes on the EU, good job that hero of the people Cameron stepped forward then :icon_lol:

Cameron didn't give a shit about the will of the people either, he wanted to shut up the backbenchers and rid the issue of the EU from his party.

Approximately what are the percentages of Conservative MPS who given a FREE vote would vote to stay within the European Union?

 

[thehistorymakers]

Major and Blair never offered votes on the EU, good job that hero of the people Cameron stepped forward then :icon_lol:

Cameron didn't give a $#@! about the will of the people either, he wanted to shut up the backbenchers and rid the issue of the EU from his party.

Agreed with all that. He only offered it for power. It was all about David.

 

[Trips]

Approximately what are the percentages of Conservative MPS who given a FREE vote would vote to stay within the European Union?

In the referendum in June

186 voted remain, 135 leave, 9 unknown

 

[Johnny75]

They don't need to be silenced but it needs to be taken in to perspective that they recieve a lot of money for making pro EU speeches.

You're saying somebody paid them to make those speeches? And as DW rightly says they can say what they like and we can listen to what we like, we don't have to agree with you or your ilk and you seem to be having trouble accepting this, why?

Regardless of whether they got paid or not they made the speeches and they have set their points out. You have not challenged their points (or mine for that matter). Any chance you can do this?

 

[Lord Knows]

In the referendum in June

186 voted remain, 135 leave, 9 unknown

So the Conservative party have big issues yet to be resolved and as the detail emerges with Brexit over the next couple of years we can expect massive divisions once again.

 

[Trips]

So the Conservative party have big issues yet to be resolved and as the detail emerges with Brexit over the next couple of years we can expect massive divisions once again.

More than likely. Cameron gambled on remain winning the EU vote to finally rid the issue from his party. He gambled, and lost. Then resigned and didn't/doesn't have to deal with the fallout.

 

[thehistorymakers]

You're saying somebody paid them to make those speeches? And as DW rightly says they can say what they like and we can listen to what we like, we don't have to agree with you or your ilk and you seem to be having trouble accepting this, why?

Regardless of whether they got paid or not they made the speeches and they have set their points out. You have not challenged their points (or mine for that matter). Any chance you can do this?

I am saying John Major gets paid £25000 for pro EU speeches and he has made many. Tony Blair a lot more it has been reported.
I agree with the bit about his speech that we should go on a charm offensive, instead of being conflictive, but that goes for the EU too.
He has asked for a second referendum before. I think this is an Ilogical idea. You can't go in to the biggest negotiations in our history, with the EU knowing if they play very hard with us, it is likely that people would change their mind about leaving the EU. That is what some in the remain camp want and I understand why they want this, but you have to go in to the negotiations on an equal footing, knowing that a good deal is in the interests of both sides and in the interests of business and the people that live in the UK and in the EU.