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REFERENDUM RESULTS AND DISCUSSION THREAD

Tony Towner said:
The uncertainty has nothing to do with Cameron's resignation. The uncertainty is about where Britain will be in the next few years economically, not who the PM will be. Most economists / commentators agree that if he has begun negotiations or triggered article 50 straight away then the £ would have sunk even lower than it has. Seems bizarre to me for Brexiters to blame Remainers for what has happened to the £ since the vote.
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According to the President of the IMF, we need a quick Brexit, not uncertainty!

I copied and pasted the article below.


International Monetary Fund, has urged the UK government to make a quick withdrawal from the European Union in order to reduce economic uncertainty

The growth of the British economy will be heavily dependent on the new trade agreements the UK negotiates with the EU, Ms Lagarde said.

“We want to see clarity sooner rather than later because we think that a lack of clarity feeds uncertainty, which itself undermines investment appetites and decision making.”
 
thehistorymakers said:
According to the President of the IMF, we need a quick Brexit, not uncertainty!
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No, what he said was that any protracted negotiation would be damaging to the UK AND Europe. This is YOUR choice. This is what YOU wanted. We have no way of knowing what the long term implications will be good or bad, but for Christ's sake at least own the short term ones
 
Tony Towner said:
No, what he said was that any protracted negotiation would be damaging to the UK AND Europe. This is YOUR choice. This is what YOU wanted. We have no way of knowing what the long term implications will be good or bad, but for Christ's sake at least own the short term ones
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Whose decision is it to make the short term ones?

This is what she said.

“We want to see clarity sooner rather than later because we think that a lack of clarity feeds uncertainty, which itself undermines investment appetites and decision making.”
 
thehistorymakers said:
Whose decision is it to make the short term ones?

This is what she said.

“We want to see clarity sooner rather than later because we think that a lack of clarity feeds uncertainty, which itself undermines investment appetites and decision making.”
Click to expand...
The £ dropped to $1.33 overnight on the Asian markets, this was before Cameron resigned.
 
thehistorymakers said:
According to the President of the IMF, it is the uncertainty which is causing problems. If there is uncertainty, that is down to Cameron and his decision to stand down and have an election for a new leader in his party. It looks like there will be a new leader, from the remain camp, who thinks exactly the same as him. It seems like the 3 months gap, is an orchestrated plan, to give time, for our currency to be scavenged and enough fear to be put in to the nation to regret their democratic decision.
The markets are castigating the UK, because they don't want us to leave the EU and are trying to reverse our democtatic decision. It surprises me to see socialists backing the investment banks, IMF and stock markets, who are attacking our currency. I would have thought that the stock markets would have been seen as the real enemy of true socialism!
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Maybe if the leave side had a plan there wouldn't be this uncertainty, not only that but they then either decided to fuck off or stabbed in the back by there own side. But of course as usual its everyone else's fault.

The one comfort I think all on the remain side had on here when the leave side won, was that at least you would stop posting your usual shite, turns out that was wishful thinking as well.
 
Has there been any polls leave/remain since the vote?

Question for both sides - if there was another referendum tomorrow after what has played out over the last two weeks would the result be the same?
 
Donegal Wolf said:
Maybe if the leave side had a plan there wouldn't be this uncertainty, not only that but they then either decided to $#@! off or stabbed in the back by there own side. But of course as usual its everyone else's fault.

The one comfort I think all on the remain side had on here when the leave side won, was that at least you would stop posting your usual $#@!e, turns out that was wishful thinking as well.
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The government have to have a plan. The leave campaign are not the government. Cameron disembarked and caused uncertainty. You can't blame the leave campaign for not implementing Brexit, it is the government who have to do it. Farage was never part of the government. We were not voting to change the government, we voted to leave the EU. It is the government who are responsible for implementing Brexit.
We have will had 3 months of dithering and uncertainty, caused by Cameron.
 
Donegal Wolf said:
Has there been any polls leave/remain since the vote?

Question for both sides - if there was another referendum tomorrow after what has played out over the last two weeks would the result be the same?
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The only poll that counts, was the referendum one. We all had a choice and we voted to leave! That was the democratic will of the people.
 
I love how the brexiteers blame cameron for the uncertainty and the slow death of the economy of the economy.

I can't stand the man, but he was very certain on what he thought was the best path. The majority didn't agree and now he gets the blame, instead of the people who voted and campaigned for economic suicide.
 
Donegal Wolf said:
Has there been any polls leave/remain since the vote?

Question for both sides - if there was another referendum tomorrow after what has played out over the last two weeks would the result be the same?
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One of the Welsh newspapers was saying Wales is now remain, but that's all I've seen.
 
thehistorymakers said:
The only poll that counts, was the referendum one. We all had a choice and we voted to leave! That was the democratic will of the people.
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True it was the democratic will and the remain side have accepted that (funny how the leave side had already their excuses about a stitch-up on the vote, bring your own pens to the booth, going to be rigged by the establishment ready if they lost) and it was the democratic will on the 23rd June, but the old saying "I made my mind up based on the facts and when the facts change I can change my mind,." The facts have irrefutably changed since 23rd June, would the vote be the same, especially on such a small percentage?

As we know Ireland had 2 referendums on each of the Nice and Lisbon treaties, as one political commentator said in the first vote people voted with their hearts in the second as the full ramifications set in people voted with their heads.

I would guess you will agree some sort of deal and that will be brought back to the country as another referendum for in/out.
 
Donegal Wolf said:
True it was the democratic will and the remain side have accepted that (funny how the leave side had already their excuses about a stitch-up on the vote, bring your own pens to the booth, going to be rigged by the establishment ready if they lost) and it was the democratic will on the 23rd June, but the old saying "I made my mind up based on the facts and when the facts change I can change my mind,." The facts have irrefutably changed since 23rd June, would the vote be the same, especially on such a small percentage?

As we know Ireland had 2 referendums on each of the Nice and Lisbon treaties, as one political commentator said in the first vote people voted with their hearts in the second as the full ramifications set in people voted with their heads.

I would guess you will agree some sort of deal and that will be brought back to the country as another referendum for in/out.
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I think you will find, it's the remain side who can't accept the result.
The only thing we have now, is uncertainty. That is being caused by the leader of the government standing down.

A question for you.

Did the leave campaign have the power to implement the Brexit, or is it up to the goverment to implement the democraticic will of the people?
 
thehistorymakers said:
I think you will find, it's the remain side who can't accept the result.
The only thing we have now, is uncertainty. That is being caused by the leader of the government standing down.

A question for you.

Did the leave campaign have the power to implement the Brexit, or is it up to the goverment to implement the democraticic will of the people?
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Err its been accepted in black and white,nobody said it wasnt the result on the night, that doesnt mean people should stop debating such an important subject, so stop spouting the usual victim bollocks.

The government said it needs a Brexiter to lead the removal, imagine the shit Cameron would have got if he stayed from the 3 amigos about dragging his feet over article 50 etc, as time has shown they are great lads shouting from the sidelines.

The leave campaign could have had the power to implement the Brexit by taking over as leaders of the government but instead they chose to stab each other in the back and walk away.

But thats probably a a good job they didnt as they clearly had no idea what to do if they have the power, although isnt one of the tory candidates a leaver (yep taking back control worked, a new PM being chosen by 0.2% of the population, how is that democratic)

Farage for as much as I despise him aint stupid, night after the vote he was talking about having to stop around to make sure that the government went through with leaving as quickly as possibly, which is a reasonable position (fuck I jsut said Farage and reasonable in the same sentence), funny how he has walked away just like that. Its as good as it gets for him, he has seen the writing on the wall either it aint going happen or if it does the whole economic ramifications are that bad.
 
Donegal Wolf said:
Err its been accepted in black and white,nobody said it wasnt the result on the night, that doesnt mean people should stop debating such an important subject, so stop spouting the usual victim bollocks.

The government said it needs a Brexiter to lead the removal, imagine the $#@! Cameron would have got if he stayed from the 3 amigos about dragging his feet over article 50 etc, as time has shown they are great lads shouting from the sidelines.

The leave campaign could have had the power to implement the Brexit by taking over as leaders of the government but instead they chose to stab each other in the back and walk away.

But thats probably a a good job they didnt as they clearly had no idea what to do if they have the power, although isnt one of the tory candidates a leaver (yep taking back control worked, a new PM being chosen by 0.2% of the population, how is that democratic)

Farage for as much as I despise him aint stupid, night after the vote he was talking about having to stop around to make sure that the government went through with leaving as quickly as possibly, which is a reasonable position ($#@! I jsut said Farage and reasonable in the same sentence), funny how he has walked away just like that. Its as good as it gets for him, he has seen the writing on the wall either it aint going happen or if it does the whole economic ramifications are that bad.
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There are lot of facts wrong with that post.
 
Donegal Wolf said:
As we know Ireland had 2 referendums on each of the Nice and Lisbon treaties, as one political commentator said in the first vote people voted with their hearts in the second as the full ramifications set in people voted with their heads.
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What happened there, is the Irish government and establishment, weren't happy with losing the first referendum, so they called another one. That isn't called democracy, that's called, not accepting the democratic will of the people and only accepting the result when you win. We don't need any lessons from Ireland on referendums.
 
thehistorymakers said:
What happened there, is the Irish government and establishment, weren't happy with losing the first referendum, so they called another one. That isn't called democracy, that's called, not accepting the democratic will of the people and only accepting the result when you win. We don't need any lessons from Ireland on referendums.
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One country where you could have taken lessons from is Ireland, we have them all the time, we have a commission which means that either side of the debate cant make stuff up and put it down as facts (that goes for both sides of the leave/remain debate), they dont turn into terrible punch and judy shows like this did.

There is a small element of truth about voting till you ge tthe answer tou want but also I said the facts changed and people change their mind, which is why the vote changed, they got a better deal on Lisbon, Cameron's failings initially were getting nothing really in his talks at the start of the year plus for the 2nd Lisbon vote it was the autumn of 2008 we could see the shit storm coming, we made sure we got in the biggest boat we could to ride the stormy waters
 
THM, if there was a second referendum are you confident that the outcome would be the same?
 
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