Newcastle (H) 15/9: Build-Up & Match Thread

[Tom Hark]

All about opinions.

Mine would be that, over the course of a season, Johnstone will definitely make less horrendous howlers than Sa would.

Mine would be that, if we didn't have such a shit defence and such a toothless attack, it would make fuck-all difference which of them was in goal.

I think (and do tell me if I'm wrong) that many moons ago (around the time we signed Doris?) DW was of the opinion that the goalkeeper was one of the less important positions in the side, and here we are splitting hairs over the merits of two adequate, if hardly outstanding candidates.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

I say a lot of things! I think that would have been around the time I was defending Hennessey against some of the more rabid criticism he'd get, and also Doris was directly replacing Hahnemann who very quickly fell off a cliff.

What I will say (and back in 2011, I hadn't had too much experience of it, bar the odd loanee and Paul Jones Mk II) is that when you have a shit keeper, you really, really, really, really notice it.

Sa's problem is that he can all too readily look like an absolute competition winner. I can easily pick out five goals he's let in for us that absolutely defy explanation from a professional keeper, let alone one good enough to play in the Premier League and get in Portugal squads. He can also be superb.

I don't blame Gary O'Neil for tiring of that because I did a long time ago, well before Gaz turned up.

 

[big mean bunny]

All about opinions.

Mine would be that, over the course of a season, Johnstone will definitely make less horrendous howlers than Sa would.

Regardless of what people say about sa, he graded as a +8.9 on the expected goals scale in 23/24, and Johnstone was -6. That's pretty stark even if people disagree with that type of stat. Palace replaced SJ and then sold him, so that indicates they potentially viewed something in or near that being accurate on his side.

 

[Johnny75]

Regardless of what people say about sa, he graded as a +8.9 on the expected goals scale in 23/24, and Johnstone was -6. That's pretty stark even if people disagree with that type of stat. Palace replaced SJ and then sold him, so that indicates they potentially viewed something in or near that being accurate on his side.

I don't get it either. Sa is erratic but Johnstone is just sub par to me.

However that could be levelled at Mario before he turned up and now he's found his true role and home and looks like the player he should have been when he first broke through.

Football is nuts at times.

 

[Lycan]

I think you can tell by the timing of the transfer that Johnstone wasn't our #1 target in that position. Palace replaced him in their squad with Matt Turner on loan, they could've done that at any time in the window so it's not as if we were waiting for them to sign someone before he became available.

We kept hold of Sá and Bentley when nobody would meet our valuation as well so it's not as if we were dependent on receiving funds in that area before we spent, we could've signed Johnstone a day after the Neto sale if it was a question of affordability.

O'Neil has said that he's 'good for the group' which basically means that he's British and probably quite professional. He's spoken before about how he went from Bournemouth who he described as quite 'militaristic' to a more relaxed foreign group at Wolves. He probably wants to regain a bit of that without losing the added quality he has at Wolves.

We clearly want to try and continue to play out from the back as well which is IMO why we wanted to replace Sá in the first place. Sá just can't do it. I'm not sure if Johnstone can either tbh which is why I don't think he was ever our #1. Most of the other keepers we were linked with are much better in this regard. We were linked with Álvaro Valles who is excellent with his feet and Ramsdale who is decent (although not that good or Arsenal wouldn't have signed Raya).

I don't buy that it was purely about competition as we were clearly ok with Sá leaving if Saudi met our valuation after our own transfer window had shut. I wouldn't be surprised to see Sá leave in January and not be replaced.

 

[Tony Towner]

The plan was for him to leave a fortnight ago and not be replaced. For whatever reason we asked for too much / they moved on. Johnstone wouldn't have been signed if they thought Sa was staying imo

 

[Kenny]

The plan was for him to leave a fortnight ago and not be replaced

Very much this.

In fact would suggest he had a move lined up and it fell through before our deadline
His time off was nothing to do with a stressful week caused by Johnstone arriving.

GO has done the right thing with his public comments.
Let's see who plays v Brighton next week...I'm going with GO bins the cup keeper idea.

 

[Carsy]

Mine would be that, over the course of a season, Sa will definitely make more outstanding saves than Johnstone would.

I’d rather a keeper did the basics better and made less mistakes than did the ‘outstanding’ if they were the only options, much like I’d prefer a centre half to be a good defender rather than a David Luiz type.

Based on what I’ve seen of Johnstone it’s a small upgrade, but as mentioned previously it want our most pressing concern.

 

[Carsy]

We were less panicky at the back. Defending a little deeper, Dawson playing and Sa not being an adventure everytime the ball was at his feet were all factors.

Be interesting to know whether the difference was down to Dawson, Sa not playing, or both.

I do think playing a little deeper had a big difference as you’ve mentioned also

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

We did play a bit deeper but the first half was still total chaos.

 

[Alan]

Yeah, the highness of the back line isn’t the crux of our issues defensively (though it probably doesn’t help, at least some of the time).

 

[Wilf Wolf]

I can see why GO wanted a different keeper simply because Sa is a bomb scare with the ball at his feet. My worry is that the upside of having Johnstone doing that bit better will be outweighed by him being a much poorer shot stopper than Sa. Only time will tell but my initial impression is overall it won’t make a lot of difference. The disappointing thing is that with a little more ambition we could have got a decent upgrade on Sa rather than just shuffled the deckchairs.

 

[The Bear]

Only a win takes us out of the bottom three now.

I'd still be just about happy with a draw though ultimately.

 

[NicholasG1973]

Only a win takes us out of the bottom three now.

I'd still be just about happy with a draw though ultimately

Early days.

Out season won’t be defined by tomorrow’s game, that’s for definite - but, agreed, it would be nice to get something out of tomorrow.

Newcastle are decent though - a point would probably be a good one.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

We have to get *some* wins from somewhere. We can't get to November and have 0 wins because 'those teams are all better than us'. It can't happen. Not if the manager wants to keep his job anyway.

 

[Tredman]

We haven’t won in the league for fucking ages. It’s feels Bruno-esque.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

We haven’t won in the league for fucking ages. It’s feels Bruno-esque.

I mean the football is way better in an attacking sense. If only because Lage's football was like sitting through an endless Toploader concert.

But you can't go like 8 months with 1 league win (against Luton, who everyone knows were simply outgunned at this level).

And if you aren't targeting this one, which ones between now and 2 November are you.

 

[The Bear]

The difficult starting fixtures really has painted us in a bad light because of how last season ended. Which was as much the club's fault as the managers.

I'm still not worried about relegation but the longer it goes on without a win the worse things look from the outside.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

I don't think you get away with it regardless. Even if we'd finished last season quite well (which we didn't) - you can't go 'we will write off the first quarter of the season as they are hard games'.

 

[The Bear]

Personally I don't subscribe to counting the end of last season as a terrible run joined up with this season, because there were plenty of reasons for taking their feet off the gas.

But I know plenty do and so will other fans and the media. For me it's one of those where stats don't paint the correct story. This season we have a much better bench so that shouldn't happen again. We've just got to try and get as many points as we can until we get a softer run of fixtures and can start to build a bit of momentum.