Keir Starmer at it again..

[WolfMan]

You lost, start your own party or get over it.

I'm not really sure this is helpful - when Corbyn won his landslide leadership victories should the right of the Labour party just fucked off and started their own party?

Corbyn and people of his political persuasion have been part of the Labour party for decades and it's managed to survive and even win elections. Under the two party system we have it really doesn't make sense to splinter off and form endless parties. Better to have one broad church where a range of views are tolerated.

One of the reasons the Tories are in such trouble now is essentially what you are advocating for happened by force, although the purged MP's didn't end up starting their own party, I'm sure you can see the parallel.

 

[Elephant Pyjamas]

Come on this is disingenuous bollocks. You know as well as everyone else on here that Labour voters went Lib Dem because it was the best option to beat the Tory. The winning candidate even thanked them for lending her their vote. To suggest anything to the contrary is just weak

Then why did Labour even bother to have a candidate?

 

[Tony Towner]

Because they aren't in a political alliance with the Lib Dems.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

Then why did Labour even bother to have a candidate?

Why do the Tories ever bother having a candidate in say, Bootle?

Rees-Mogg stood in Fife FFS. Everyone knew he had no chance of winning but it was to give the big pencil an experience of campaiging.

 

[Johnny75]

I'm not really sure this is helpful - when Corbyn won his landslide leadership victories should the right of the Labour party just fucked off and started their own party?

Corbyn and people of his political persuasion have been part of the Labour party for decades and it's managed to survive and even win elections. Under the two party system we have it really doesn't make sense to splinter off and form endless parties. Better to have one broad church where a range of views are tolerated.

One of the reasons the Tories are in such trouble now is essentially what you are advocating for happened by force, although the purged MP's didn't end up starting their own party, I'm sure you can see the parallel.

That's the thing now, the extreme left don't want to be part of it anymore which is why they keep sniping at Starmer.

Take a look at the two on here, they would rather Boris keep running by the looks of things so they could keep winning the argument.

The Labour right (centre to the rest of the country) are tolerant as seen by the Corbyn vote. The left are riddled with anti-semetic loons with all the tolerance of Mugabe.

 

[Elephant Pyjamas]

To clarify who are "the two on here"?

 

[WolfMan]

That's the thing now, the extreme left don't want to be part of it anymore which is why they keep sniping at Starmer.

Take a look at the two on here, they would rather Boris keep running by the looks of things so they could keep winning the argument.

The Labour right (centre to the rest of the country) are tolerant as seen by the Corbyn vote. The left are riddled with anti-semetic loons with all the tolerance of Mugabe.

I get what you are saying but there was quite a bit of sniping going on during Corbyns leadership from the right of the party if I remember correctly.

Just think it's beholden on the leader to unite all the factions together into a manageable whole, something which Corbyn failed to do ultimately.

 

[Elephant Pyjamas]

Why do the Tories ever bother having a candidate in say, Bootle?

Rees-Mogg stood in Fife FFS. Everyone knew he had no chance of winning but it was to give the big pencil an experience of campaiging.

Surely running in Bootle or Fife is not really comparable with running yesterday?

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

Pretty much. I'll have a grand with you right now that Labour never win that seat in the next 20 years. Obviously we both need to live another 20 years for this to work, which isn't a given.

 

[Templeton Peck]

Come on this is disingenuous bollocks. You know as well as everyone else on here that Labour voters went Lib Dem because it was the best option to beat the Tory. The winning candidate even thanked them for lending her their vote. To suggest anything to the contrary is just weak

Completely wrong. The Lib Dems have come second there twice in 30 years. In 2019 they had about half the Labour vote. The Labour campaign leaflet said 'Lib Dems can't win here'. The 'best option' to beat the Conservatives was Labour.

 

[Templeton Peck]

That's the thing now, the extreme left don't want to be part of it anymore which is why they keep sniping at Starmer.

Take a look at the two on here, they would rather Boris keep running by the looks of things so they could keep winning the argument.

The Labour right (centre to the rest of the country) are tolerant as seen by the Corbyn vote. The left are riddled with anti-semetic loons with all the tolerance of Mugabe.

Johnny projecting again.

 

[Elephant Pyjamas]

Pretty much. I'll have a grand with you right now that Labour never win that seat in the next 20 years. Obviously we both need to live another 20 years for this to work, which isn't a given.

It's not comparable at all, Labour knew by standing they'd take votes from the Lib Dems and that would potentially lead to the Tories regaining the seat.

That's never the case for the Tories in Bootle or Fife is it!?

The Tories standing people in Bootle or Fife makes sense to give them experience, there was no logic to standing Wood yesterday, if they want him to get experience, then stand him in Surrey.

 

[Tony Towner]

Completely wrong. The Lib Dems have come second there twice in 30 years. In 2019 they had about half the Labour vote. The Labour campaign leaflet said 'Lib Dems can't win here'. The 'best option' to beat the Conservatives was Labour.

Again missing the point. Tory voters were going to defect to the Lib Dems as a protest vote not Labour. Knowing this Labour voters did the same to ensure the victory.

 

[Tredman]

Everyone needs to be voting ABT going forward, happy to hold my nose and vote for whoever has the best chance of getting rid of these fuckers.

 

[Templeton Peck]

Again missing the point. Tory voters were going to defect to the Lib Dems as a protest vote not Labour. Knowing this Labour voters did the same to ensure the victory.

Labour were the obvious choice for a protest vote given the data. If your entire electoral strategy hinges on attracting Tories when can Labour capture those votes if not now?

 

[Elephant Pyjamas]

That's the thing now, the extreme left don't want to be part of it anymore which is why they keep sniping at Starmer.

Take a look at the two on here, they would rather Boris keep running by the looks of things so they could keep winning the argument.

The Labour right (centre to the rest of the country) are tolerant as seen by the Corbyn vote. The left are riddled with anti-semetic loons with all the tolerance of Mugabe.

I'll assume you count me as one of the 2, as you are so often wrong. (funny how you describe parts of Labour as "extreme left" but correct Labour right as being "centre to the rest of country" do you not recognise the cognitive dissonance there?)

I want Labour to win the next election, i voted for Starmer too, unfortunately for me that's not because this guise of Labour represent my politics (although Starmer pretended to with his 10 pledges), but it's because this guise of the Tories represent my views far less! Does that mean i can't be critical of Starmer? It seems to me that you think so? You have spent the last few years tearing the arse out of Corbyn, yet i don't think you want the Tories in power either?

Ironically i hope Boris clings on until to the next election, as this represents the best chance of getting the Tories out, (plus i'd like to see him get beaten as i think he's an epic cunt) but what i think will happen is that Sunak, Patel, Javid or Gove will takeoever as PM and beat Starmer as people in this country seem to have incredibly short memories.

If Starmer were to become PM he would return some level of decency and honesty to parliament and would roll back the attacks on our legal system, judges, and right to protest, and hopefully rebuild some kind of working relationship with our biggest trading partners, and reduce the number of kids drowning in the Channel. In a similar way to how Biden seems far better than Trump, despite not being an amazing politician himself.

I'd take that at the moment and it has nothing to do with whether you are left or right, just having honest public servants acting as adults and doing their best for the country.

You might learn a bit from the bit in bold.

 

[Tony Towner]

Labour were the obvious choice for a protest vote given the data. If your entire electoral strategy hinges on attracting Tories when can Labour capture those votes if not now?

It's not a marginal seat though. North Shrops will go back Tory in a couple of years irrespective of the wider election result. They aren't the floating voter Labour will need to attract

 

[Johnny75]

Johnny projecting again.

What do you think I'm projecting?

 

[Templeton Peck]

That's the thing now, the extreme left don't want to be part of it anymore which is why they keep sniping at Starmer.

Whereas the Labour Right were staunch in their support of Corbyn. Have the Left launched a coup yet?

Take a look at the two on here, they would rather Boris keep running by the looks of things so they could keep winning the argument.

I've said before I'd vote Labour over Tory and I voted for Starmer when I was still a member. It's ignored though by some on here as it doesn't fit with their loony left narrative. If wanting him to honour promises he made during the leadership campaign makes me a loony cunt then I'll live with that.

The Labour right (centre to the rest of the country) are tolerant as seen by the Corbyn vote. The left are riddled with anti-semetic loons with all the tolerance of Mugabe.

Tolerant? Jews are being kicked out but they're Left so it's fine.

https://www.jewishvoiceforlabour.org.uk/statement/how-labours-claim-of-countering-antisemitism-has-resulted-in-a-purge-of-jews/

Starmer has spent most of his time reducing party democracy and centralising power for factional reasons. Irony is of course that when Corbyn was leader there was much noise from the Right about Stalinist purges but they never came. People often judge others by their own standards though.

As you're often fond of saying - if they're not happy they should fuck off and form their own party. Maybe Change UK 2.0? Rory Stewart as leader? Chuka on bass?

 

[Elephant Pyjamas]

Far more eloquent than I.