Jeremy Corbyn

[So Long Architect]

Most NHS trusts HAVE to use bank staff. It is a fact of life within the NHS. They are expected to run on absolutely minimal staff levels (the patients / nurses ratio on wards is absolutely fucking terrifying) and so as soon as you get sickness or holiday, bank staff have to be used otherwise patient care is compromised.

Yes, I know. My point was that we shouldn't expect a Conservative government to see this as a problem or be in any sort of a rush to change it. A few private individuals are making a very good living from the NHS in this regard which would seem to me to fit the bill very nicely from a Conservative perspective.

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

When I was trust secretary for an NHS trust it was a huge problem at the trust board level. Big KPI on minimal bank staff use which just doesn't balance against a big KPI on ensuring patient safety. Impossible conundrum. And that was under the Brown government. I would imagine it can only be exponentially more difficult now.

 

[Tredman]

That's better Johnny. True intentions out in the open.

Maybe your doctor thought: 'What an arse coming all the way from Spain to get treated, these ex-pats are taking the piss, fuck him, I'll tell him 6 months. It'll allow me to treat others that really need it and are living here'.

Of course he may not think like that but, well, you know....

With any luck the rules on charging foreign visitors for using GPs will include ex-pats - it definitely should do.

 

[So Long Architect]

When even the Express think something's not quite right, there must be something up - http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/58...ng-billions-from-supplying-doctors-and-nurses

 

[Parkins left foot]

I can see a my GP in Spain the same day. If the surgery is closed, I can use a 24 hour health centre on my estate. There are 5, 24 hour walk in health centres on different estates in Cordoba.
I needed to see a consultant several years ago, for my sinuses. I went to see my doctor in the morning, he gave me a consultant appointment, the same afternoon. I would of had to wait at least 6 months in the UK, to see a specialist.

Total rubbish, if you're going to spout crap at least try to make it believable.

Rude, arrogant and wrong, Johnny.

I stated it was several years ago. Quite often people wait over 3 months now and 6 months is not unheard of. The waiting times are very regional.
My Doctor at the time told me 6 months. There are thousands of links I could put up to demonstrate my point, but I don't need to.

Maybe your doctor thought: 'What an arse coming all the way from Spain to get treated, these ex-pats are taking the piss, fuck him, I'll tell him 6 months. It'll allow me to treat others that really need it and are living here'.

Of course he may not think like that but, well, you know....

In essence probably both viewpoints are correct depending on what you need doing & where you live as there is no level playing field. In Dorset I have always found the waiting times to be very good ( with my knee op last year wait would have been 6 weeks if I had opted for the main district hospital and was actually seen in less than 2 as went for the private hospital that the NHS buys time/operations in for this procedure & was seen MRI'd & operated on within 7weeks).

I am aware that other parts of the UK are not as fortunate (a concern as the service should be striving to bring service for all up to the best provision in the country). We should be focusing on & highlighting where decent waiting times are not met - if it can be done down here then no reason why not elsewhere, its not as if there's no demand here as theres loads of elderly people!!

 

[Paul]

Why, when discussing the NHS, does anybody only mention frontline staff, what's happening behind the scenes, are they in the same predicament ?

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

Ask people like Squeeze. Formerly frontline. Went into trust staff. Treated poorly. Left the service and went into private practice. Happening all over the institution that is the NHS. What she does is not a DIRECT impact on patient safety now, unlike when she was an A&E sister or worked in Intensive Care HDU, but her background in developing informatics to help patient care is just being wiped out within the NHS and so the expertise is being lost and private companies like the one she now works for bid to supply the service.

From my point of view, merging two trusts to save costs was effectively a turkey voting for Christmas. I knew it would end in a redundancy. However, professional integrity meant doing it as well as I could.

 

[Johnny75]

That's better Johnny. True intentions out in the open.

I think the term is 'Whoosh'.

I have the same experience as PLF, the choice enacted during the last giverment(s) has worked very well. And I live in an area with a failing hospital apparently. The Health Service and hospital here have been nothing but excellent and it pisses me right off when ill thought out nonsense is pedalled as fact.

One thing I would like to ask is why we're you going to a UK doctor when you could use your E111 card and have a seemingly better service from an overstuffed Spanish health service?

 

[thehistorymakers]

I think the term is 'Whoosh'.

I have the same experience as PLF, the choice enacted during the last giverment(s) The Health Service and hospital here have been nothing but excellent and it pisses me right off when ill thought out nonsense is pedalled as fact.

One thing I would like to ask is why we're you going to a UK doctor when you could use your E111 card and have a seemingly better service from an overstuffed Spanish health service?

That my UK Doctor told me that I would have to wait 6 months, is a fact. I prefer to believe his judgement on waiting times, than the UK's number one football coach. Who makes absurd insults, based on no idea of the waiting time in the city or town that I stayed in, in the UK. Stick to football coaching.

I have told you before, I have a business in the UK and pay taxes through my company. I am entitled to see a UK doctor, if the service isn't good enough, I can use the option of seeing a Doctor in Spain.

At the moment the Spanish goverment is trying to push through reforms, to copy the British system, of privitisation through the back door. The difference being at the moment, the health union in Spain seems to have more clout, than the health unions in the UK. It is inevitable that with time the Spanish system will follow the UK model. It is only a matter of time.

 

[Johnny75]

What a shock that you didn't answer the question; I'll ask again in case you missed it: Why didn't you see a Spanish doctor? Seems a long way to go to see a doctor, especially when you can use your E111 card.

If I lived in Spain I would see a local doctor, but I guess that's just me. Health tourism doesn't really appeal to me.

 

[thehistorymakers]

What a shock that you didn't answer the question; I'll ask again in case you missed it: Why didn't you see a Spanish doctor? Seems a long way to go to see a doctor, especially when you can use your E111 card.

If I lived in Spain I would see a local doctor, but I guess that's just me. Health tourism doesn't really appeal to me.

Because I was in the UK for 6 weeks with my work, which I am most years.

 

[Boozad]

For those of us who actually read your post we'd probably figured that out, people out to attack the poster and not the post (ever more prevalent on here these days) would have easily missed it.

 

[The Saturday Boy]

It looks like across the public sector the intention is to reduce the levels of staff to a core level and supplement this with temporary staff as and when needed so we are likely to see an increase in the use of agencies. More staff with less rights.

 

[So Long Architect]

It looks like across the public sector the intention is to reduce the levels of staff to a core level and supplement this with temporary staff as and when needed so we are likely to see an increase in the use of agencies. More staff with less rights.

Question on agencies, as I don't know much about it - what rights do agency staff have through their agency, who presumably is their employer?

 

[The Saturday Boy]

Question on agencies, as I don't know much about it - what rights do agency staff have through their agency, who presumably is their employer?

Agency staff are classed as workers not employees - rights such as equal treatment apply after 12 weeks, right to the national minimum wage and protection from discrimination apply immediately as do rights to holiday pay. Employees are usually granted additional rights through their employment contract which do not apply to agency workers such as continuity of employment, pay progression, notice periods. There is pretty much no thing as unfair dismissal for agency workers.

Despite the oft quoted high cost of agency staff employers use them because they perceive it as cheaper and less risky - on the other hand you lose things like goodwill, loyalty, consistency etc.

 

[So Long Architect]

Agency staff are classed as workers not employees - rights such as equal treatment apply after 12 weeks, right to the national minimum wage and protection from discrimination apply immediately as do rights to holiday pay. Employees are usually granted additional rights through their employment contract which do not apply to agency workers such as continuity of employment, pay progression, notice periods. There is pretty much no thing as unfair dismissal for agency workers.

Despite the oft quoted high cost of agency staff employers use them because they perceive it as cheaper and less risky - on the other hand you lose things like goodwill, loyalty, consistency etc.

Cheers.

 

[Penk Wolf]

Agency staff are classed as workers not employees - rights such as equal treatment apply after 12 weeks, right to the national minimum wage and protection from discrimination apply immediately as do rights to holiday pay. Employees are usually granted additional rights through their employment contract which do not apply to agency workers such as continuity of employment, pay progression, notice periods. There is pretty much no thing as unfair dismissal for agency workers.

Despite the oft quoted high cost of agency staff employers use them because they perceive it as cheaper and less risky - on the other hand you lose things like goodwill, loyalty, consistency etc.

Aren't they employees of the agency and have a contract with the agency? Would they not get the same rights regarding unfair dismissal if they were with the same agency for over 2 years?

 

[The Saturday Boy]

Aren't they employees of the agency and have a contract with the agency? Would they not get the same rights regarding unfair dismissal if they were with the same agency for over 2 years?

Agencies are brokers of labour, there is no contract of employment that classifies the person as an employee primarily because there is no obligation to either provide or accept work which is the basic tenet of an employer/employee relationship and neither does an agency direct the work of the individual.

There may be a contract between agency and worker but it is not a contract of employment.

 

[Penk Wolf]

Agencies are brokers of labour, there is no contract of employment that classifies the person as an employee primarily because there is no obligation to either provide or accept work which is the basic tenet of an employer/employee relationship and neither does an agency direct the work of the individual.

There may be a contract between agency and worker but it is not a contract of employment.

What a load of bollocks. If they are on their payroll, which I believe they are, then they should be an employee of the agency and treated in the same ways as any employee would be with contracts and rights, etc.

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

They aren't on the payroll. They are paid for services they supply.