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Israel-Palestine

prawnking said:
Quite startling btw how 'Israel' is catch-all (not just for Alan), yet it's Hamas or Gazans/Palestinians for the other side
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No, it’s illustrative of the power imbalance between Israel and Gaza.

You seem to be under the impression that somehow the way I’ve spoken about things precludes an abhorrence at the bloodshed being committed, which I don’t especially appreciate.
 
prawnking said:
If we're distinguishing between the civilian population and political/military, shouldn't we do that for both sides?
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I think the difference is that Israel’s ability and propensity (using white phosphorus, which is bordering on a war crime ffs) to harm Gazans unaffiliated with Hamas is much, much greater than Hamas’ ability to do the same to Israelis unaffiliated with the IDF.

Israel’s chief military spokesperson has all but said that any Gazans remaining in the evacuation zone will be considered targets.

It shouldn’t be ignored.
 
I think from a humatarian perspective there is no difference. I get the geopolitical difference, but that doesn't really interest me in terms of the impact on innocent people, and the same innocent people having either a State or a terrorist organisation acting in their name whilst they suffer
 
AndyWolves said:
I still don't know what Hamas we're trying to achieve, all they've ended up doing is giving the Israeli military an "excuse" to wipe Gaza off the map.
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It was Iranian motivated, the most powerful Islamic State in the region. It had little to do with Palestine and nothing to do with the security of the Palestinian people
 
Alan said:
I think the difference is that Israel’s ability and propensity (using white phosphorus, which is bordering on a war crime ffs) to harm Gazans unaffiliated with Hamas is much, much greater than Hamas’ ability to do the same to Israelis unaffiliated with the IDF.

Israel’s chief military spokesperson has all but said that any Gazans remaining in the evacuation zone will be considered targets.

It shouldn’t be ignored.
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Has anyone confirmed israels use of white phosphorous.
Has anyone confirmed that israel bombed the safe route, because
a) it looks more like ied's than aerial bombs,
And B) it makes no sense for israek to want to keep civilians in gaza and around the battle zone, that's the Hamas plan ffs.
P.s. no mention whatsoever of white phospherous on cnn, bbc, sky, dw, or al jazeera, not a word.
 
Alan said:
I think the difference is that Israel’s ability and propensity (using white phosphorus, which is bordering on a war crime ffs) to harm Gazans unaffiliated with Hamas is much, much greater than Hamas’ ability to do the same to Israelis unaffiliated with the IDF.

Israel’s chief military spokesperson has all but said that any Gazans remaining in the evacuation zone will be considered targets.

It shouldn’t be ignored.
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On a Jewish holy day Hamas intentionally targeted schools and youth centres with the intention of maximising Israeli civilian deaths; slaughtered families, children and babies, and it seems to be already regarded in the Jewish community as the worst time for their people in terms of loss of life since the Holocaust.

That shouldn't be ignored either.
 
Tony Towner said:
I think from a humatarian perspective there is no difference. I get the geopolitical difference, but that doesn't really interest me in terms of the impact on innocent people, and the same innocent people having either a State or a terrorist organisation acting in their name whilst they suffer
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This is also true and I’ve done my stance a disservice if I haven’t made this clear.
 
prawnking said:
On a Jewish holy day Hamas intentionally targeted schools and youth centres with the intention of maximising Israeli civilian deaths; slaughtered families, children and babies, and it seems to be already regarded in the Jewish community as the worst time for their people in terms of loss of life since the Holocaust.

That shouldn't be ignored either.
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Literally, who is ignoring it?
 
Alan said:
Literally, who is ignoring it?
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Plenty on here seem to be focused entirely on the other direction.

Read the thread, the links, the comments FFS

Order of blame:

1. Israel
2.'The West'












3. Hamas

And it was Hamas who instigated the entire war one week ago!
 
prawnking said:
Plenty on here seem to be focused entirely on the other direction.

Read the thread, the links, the comments FFS
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Literally nobody has suggested Hamas get off scot free. The concern is, quite justifiably, that exponentially more innocent Gazans will pay for Hamas’ crimes, and Israel won’t give a damn about it.
 
pavlosmacwolf said:
Has anyone confirmed israels use of white phosphorous.
Has anyone confirmed that israel bombed the safe route, because
a) it looks more like ied's than aerial bombs,
And B) it makes no sense for israek to want to keep civilians in gaza and around the battle zone, that's the Hamas plan ffs.
P.s. no mention whatsoever of white phospherous on cnn, bbc, sky, dw, or al jazeera, not a word.
Click to expand...
 
Tony Towner said:
It was Iranian motivated, the most powerful Islamic State in the region. It had little to do with Palestine and nothing to do with the security of the Palestinian people
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That's interesting, I've done a bit of quick reading and found that not all in that region are happy with Israel and UAE getting all cozy. What better way to upset the region.
 
prawnking said:
Plenty on here seem to be focused entirely on the other direction.

Read the thread, the links, the comments FFS

Order of blame:

1. Israel
2.'The West'












3. Hamas

And it was Hamas who instigated the entire war one week ago!
Click to expand...

Well obviously Israel bears ultimate responsibility as the occupier. Israel retreats to its 1968 borders and last weekend doesn't happen. The West are in a position to ensure a 2 state solution but refuse to do so. Hamas are a product of decades of poverty, violence and humiliation.
 
Templeton Peck said:
Well obviously Israel bears ultimate responsibility as the occupier. Israel retreats to its 1968 borders and last weekend doesn't happen.
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Feels a very Student Union approach, I mean yes you are probably correct, but as a practical solution it's ridiculous and fails to address the reality. I'm 51, that was 4 years before I was born
 
Tony Towner said:
Feels a very Student Union approach, I mean yes you are probably correct, but as a practical solution it's ridiculous and fails to address the reality
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Unfortunately, it feels so irrevocably like a “practical” solution is a fantasy. I don’t know how you even begin at this point.
 
Tony Towner said:
Feels a very Student Union approach, I mean yes you are probably correct, but as a practical solution it's ridiculous and fails to address the reality. I'm 51, that was 4 years before I was born
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It's also the UN position not just the SU. The only practical solution is a 2 state one which the US could enforce tomorrow if it wished.
 
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