Beer

[Tyrannosaurus Dan]

I think while some people either miss the point or deliberately ignore it then the 'discussion' will keep popping up every so often.

 

[SLA]

I don't see what the issue is. If a business can make a go of it selling at a high price point, why shouldn't they? It's not like craft brewers have a monopoly on the beer market. There are endless other cheaper options available. It's not profiteering, it's creating a business that works. If people stop buying the product at the price set, the business will either adapt or fold.

 

[machin05]

Hardly any new craft breweries are making any real profit anyway. It's passion and the final product that drives their ambition. The price they have to charge is almost a consequence of everything it takes to make as high a quality product as they do without losing money.

 

[Kenny]

Frank, can you share how you know the Craft Bear industry is taking part in "blatant profiteering". I presume it is based on something more than charging a price you wouldn't pay? As someone who is somewhat neutral on this subject, I have seen Machin share some info on how smaller craft places price so it would be interesting to see other side of the argument to this with some facts etc.

 

[Jolemai]

I think while some people either miss the point or deliberately ignore it then the 'discussion' will keep popping up every so often.

Quite. It feels like the politics threads.

 

[Johnny75]

Hardly any new craft breweries are making any real profit anyway. It's passion and the final product that drives their ambition. The price they have to charge is almost a consequence of everything it takes to make as high a quality product as they do without losing money.

There is an element of creating a 'buzz' around products and a high end product particularly or 'boutique' if you like as Cloudwater do very successfully. Of course they create that premium price and position themselves accordingly as they are seen as the beer to aspire too. And why shouldn't you pay more for what they do as they are producing the best. A Hugo Boss shirt doesn't cost much (if any) more in terms of sheer production number to produce than any other shirt but they can charge what they do because the items within and design of the product together with the marketing story told allow them to charge the price they do. This is where some craft breweries go wrong, they think they can be premium from the off and never find their niche.

I think Tiny Rebel, Cloudwater, Titanic and Wild Beer Co have found their niche and they are very good at what they do. All 3 occupy different spaces in the market and they do it well.

 

[Langers]

I'm looking forward to sampling some ales after work tonight (might head to the PO Vaults actually..) Then it's matchday tomorrow and a birthday party at a pub in the JQ which has some very tasty craft beers.

 

[Tyrannosaurus Dan]

Frank, can you share how you know the Craft Bear industry is taking part in "blatant profiteering". I presume it is based on something more than charging a price you wouldn't pay? As someone who is somewhat neutral on this subject, I have seen Machin share some info on how smaller craft places price so it would be interesting to see other side of the argument to this with some facts etc.

 

[The Bear]

I want to know what a Craft Bear is.

Is it a grizzly that sources freshly caught salmon from renewable minority streams?

 

[machin05]

There is an element of creating a 'buzz' around products and a high end product particularly or 'boutique' if you like as Cloudwater do very successfully. Of course they create that premium price and position themselves accordingly as they are seen as the beer to aspire too. And why shouldn't you pay more for what they do as they are producing the best. A Hugo Boss shirt doesn't cost much (if any) more in terms of sheer production number to produce than any other shirt but they can charge what they do because the items within and design of the product together with the marketing story told allow them to charge the price they do. This is where some craft breweries go wrong, they think they can be premium from the off and never find their niche.

I think Tiny Rebel, Cloudwater, Titanic and Wild Beer Co have found their niche and they are very good at what they do. All 3 occupy different spaces in the market and they do it well.

Reading that Cloudwater blog, I think that this Hugo Boss shirt analogy falls down slightly. They clearly spend far more on producing their beers than a lot of their competitiors based on pure ingredients alone. They have the loyal customer base to sustain that high production/high sale price model though. They're still THE hyped brewery in the UK at the moment.

 

[machin05]

:icon_lol:

 

[machin05]

I'm looking forward to sampling some ales after work tonight (might head to the PO Vaults actually..) Then it's matchday tomorrow and a birthday party at a pub in the JQ which has some very tasty craft beers.

Oooh, which pub in the JQ? The Wolf? Their line-up always looks ace.

If you fancy Brewdog (I know, I know) they're featuring some beers from a relatively new Birmingham brewery called Glass House. Heard very good things about their beers.

On a side not, I'm kind of off the beers at the moment. Partly because I just don't have any in the house and partly because of the Velo ride in a couple weeks. Want to make sure I'm in good nick for that!

Got a 75 mile training ride on Sunday, after which I will be sinking one if these:

A beer designed by a cyclist, not a brewer! Meant to be refreshing and restorative. http://abloc.beer/

After the Velo, I've got this lined up:

Had one on New Year's Eve last year and was one of the best beers I've ever had. Been saving this one for a special occasion and I reckon completing the Velo will be just that.

 

[Kenny]

One lives in hope....

 

[Langers]

Oooh, which pub in the JQ? The Wolf? Their line-up always looks ace.

If you fancy Brewdog (I know, I know) they're featuring some beers from a relatively new Birmingham brewery called Glass House. Heard very good things about their beers.

No, the Rose Villa Tavern. The Wolf is great, I agree with you there.

Brewdog isn't for me - I really don't like their bars. Meeting a mate so he might have some suggestions. Last time I went into Purity, they had some stonking beers on so might try there. They had Cali by Tiny Rebel on tap last time I was there.

 

[machin05]

I think Purity tend to keep the same beers on tap for a while, so every chance it's still be one.

 

[Boozad]

They keep them on for ages.

 

[Boozad]

I respect your opinion Machin, but my opinion is that the craft beer industry is intent on blatant profiteering, and I have not seen or read anything to make me change that view. And that is a shame as I like a lot of craft beers, but sadly the prices are just a rip off.

No they're not and no they're not.

 

[leedswolf]

Reading that Cloudwater blog, I think that this Hugo Boss shirt analogy falls down slightly. They clearly spend far more on producing their beers than a lot of their competitiors based on pure ingredients alone. They have the loyal customer base to sustain that high production/high sale price model though. They're still THE hyped brewery in the UK at the moment.

Absolutely.

 

[leedswolf]

No they're not and no they're not.

Indeed. If there's any profiteering then it's the fake craft that the macros are producing. One of the US macros now has control of the bulk of SA hops. They are now rigging the supply to craft brewers in the US.

 

[Boozad]

Take Greene King for example, utter piss. I'd much rather pay £5 for 2/3 of Cloudwater than £2 odd for a pint of their grossly mis-sold Shepherds Pie.