The Rugby Thread

[Bit on the shaggies]

What a great point by Woodward. Cheika changed the rules to bring in Giteau... while we missed out on Steffon Armitage.

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

SCW starts it immediately by pointing out that Chieka recalled Giteau from France whereas Armitage wasn't allowed to be picked.

And now "we played into Australia's hands". Lancaster being hung out to dry. He and Robshaw will be gone. No doubt the Uruguay game will now be shifted to ITV4.

 

[Tredman]

Meh, armitage knew the rules. The long term future of England club rugby is more important than one World Cup. The Celtic league is a shambles because of French defections.

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

But England have damaged their squad by copying All Black dogma. Not sure that is a good thing Tredman.

 

[Bit on the shaggies]

I think the point is that you field your best possible side. Armitage would have been part of that and the fact that he's in France should play no part in the decision.

 

[jd1981]

Big watershed moment for England, time for a clean slate in the 6N and rebuild for four years time.
Lancasters record, is 2nd,2nd,2nd,2nd in 6N and a group stage exit in a home World Cup.

 

[Parkins left foot]

Even if we had won tonight (or dealt with the game v Wales properly) doubt we would be going that much further - too many errors/indiscipline/strange selections.

There will be changes at the top - as for the 'foreign' players, if they qualify to play for England & they are the best players for their position then bloody pick them. Most of us don't care where they play their club rugby!

 

[Tredman]

It's not about the English team, it's about English club rugby. Always has been. There's more to rugby than world cups and 6 nations. Feel free to join me with Stafford U7s at Leek tomorrow to see that in action.

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

I would love to Tredders. Sadly I can't tomorrow. Grass Roots rugby is so important across all four of the home nations and it is from there that we get the next Leigh Halfpenny, the next Martin Johnson, the next BO'D the next John Jeffrey. I love seeing the kids play, and I would encourage any fan to get out and support them.

 

[Parkins left foot]

So its OK for British clubs to employ overseas players & that has no effect on opportunity for UK players, but as soon as one of ours goes across the channel they are persona non grata.

Seems illogical to me & not sure that it impacts adversely on grass roots UK players. If they are good enough they will get to the top of the game somewhere.

 

[Bit on the shaggies]

English club rugby wouldn't be half of what it is if there was no English team. When England perform kids take notice and get interested in the game, it's no secret that player numbers exploded after 2003.

 

[Tredman]

English football would seem to be the perfect counterpart to your argument. Fact is English clubs don't pay enough to attract top overseas talent thanks to some very good financial rules, therefore English players get a very good chance in a competitive league.

 

[Parkins left foot]

English club rugby wouldn't be half of what it is if there was no English team. When England perform kids take notice and get interested in the game, it's no secret that player numbers exploded after 2003.

That is very true, but tonight's team all play in the UK as that's the selection rules.

There are only a few who you might consider bringing in to improve the team that play elsewhere (mainly France). Not clear how that would affect interest in the sport if the England team was succesful

 

[Bit on the shaggies]

Lancaster (on 5 live) sounds like he'll be stepping down after the tournament.

 

[Tredman]

Lancaster (on 5 live) sounds like he'll be stepping down after the tournament.

He should do, he didn't pick the best team - ignoring overseas players there were a good few players who shouldn't have been out there.

 

[Parkins left foot]

English football would seem to be the perfect counterpart to your argument. Fact is English clubs don't pay enough to attract top overseas talent thanks to some very good financial rules, therefore English players get a very good chance in a competitive league.

?? Not sure that's a truly accurate analogy - isn't it true that the % of English qualified players regularly appearing at Premier League level is less than many other National teams/leagues & that the complaint is that clubs too readily turn overseas rather than look at local talent. Which is why with the quotas of 'local' players the price of UK qualified players is disproportionate to their ability in many cases.

 

[Nando]

Abendanon goes instead of Goode and Armitage over Haskell I'd guess. It isn't the difference. Bizarre selections and seemingly no game plan put an end to our chances.

Our back line in the second half was comprised of two fly halves, a centre out wide and someone who's playing his club rugby at 6. Madness.

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

Lancaster should be given until the Uruguay dead rubber, and then should step down immediately after. England have failed badly in this tournament and the buck stops with him.

 

[Tredman]

No, English clubs are governed by very strict financial rules, which means sugar daddies have minimal effect.

Therefore they need to bring players through their youth ranks and can't do a 'France' and hire the best players from abroad - simultaneously destroying French development and Celtic teams.

 

[North West Wanderer]

Beaten by a superior team.