The Road to Russia 2018

[Tony Towner]

Just seen the goals, both good hits from Celtics reserve centre forward, but awful keeping for both from Hart who has been shocking for over a year now and isn't in the best 3 English keepers any more

 

[Alan]

Norway continuing to shit the bed in spectacular fashion.

But as I type this they equalize against the Czechs. No confidence in them maintaining that, though. Shambolic underachievers this cycle.

 

[jd1981]

Well no surprises in reality a poor game and low on quality. Thought England were bang average as usual and Scotland did there routine thing of raising their game.
People have slated Guardiola all season for ditching Hart based on today you can see why he was binned off. Positioning for both free kicks was abysmal.

 

[Alan]

Germany against San Marino on TV here in the States for some reason.

With some of the small nations in UEFA (Lithuania, Kazakhstan, San Marino, etc.), how is that you lot are the only confederation (not including CONMEBOL because they only have nine members) to only have one proper round of qualifying? Surely it would be better to have earlier rounds for the lower seeds?

Surely the San Mariners (?) don't enjoy getting pasted like this.

 

[Tony Towner]

It's all about the Benjamin's Alan. Even though I agree with you

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

I think the theory is that Kazakhstan (for example) don't learn anything if they end up finishing second in a mini-group of them, Moldova and Andorra and getting knocked out. It's not a perfect situation at the moment but I'm not sure pre-qualification is the answer. UEFA will point to the Faroes getting a couple of good results down the years, Andorra winning last night against Hungary (who made the last 16 of the Euros last year), the steady improvement of some of the smaller Balkan nations down the years, how rancid Turkey were as recently as the early 90s but how they developed through playing better opposition...even Wales are ok these days.

Our calendar allows for all the fixtures so it's no biggie. Of course the games themselves against the palpably out of their depth teams are awful to watch, but no-one's forcing you to turn up or tune in.

 

[Alan]

It's all about the Benjamin's Alan. Even though I agree with you

Indeed.

I should make clear that if a change were to occur, the smaller matchups would still need comparable TV money from somewhere, which would be difficult. Otherwise they'd end up like the Caribbean nations and struggle just to break even each year.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

I should make clear that if a change were to occur, the smaller matchups would still need comparable TV money from somewhere, which would be difficult. Otherwise they'd end up like the Caribbean nations and struggle just to break even each year.

Well that bit is just never going to happen. I watch far, far, far too much football, way more than is good for me, but even so I am not watching Azerbaijan vs Luxembourg.

 

[Alan]

I think the theory is that Kazakhstan (for example) don't learn anything if they end up finishing second in a mini-group of them, Moldova and Andorra and getting knocked out. It's not a perfect situation at the moment but I'm not sure pre-qualification is the answer. UEFA will point to the Faroes getting a couple of good results down the years, Andorra winning last night against Hungary (who made the last 16 of the Euros last year), the steady improvement of some of the smaller Balkan nations down the years, how rancid Turkey were as recently as the early 90s but how they developed through playing better opposition...even Wales are ok these days.

Our calendar allows for all the fixtures so it's no biggie. Of course the games themselves against the palpably out of their depth teams are awful to watch, but no-one's forcing you to turn up or tune in.

Don't get me wrong, I'm 100% about championing minnows. But do San Marino learn anything from this that they couldn't find out in some other way?

It does, at least, put into perspective just how difficult the game is and how easy the professionals tend to make it look.

 

[Alan]

Well that bit is just never going to happen. I watch far, far, far too much football, way more than is good for me, but even so I am not watching Azerbaijan vs Luxembourg.

That's my point; it wouldn't happen. Just like it doesn't happen for Guyana vs St. Vincent & the Grenadines.

 

[Tony Towner]

Indeed.

I should make clear that if a change were to occur, the smaller matchups would still need comparable TV money from somewhere, which would be difficult. Otherwise they'd end up like the Caribbean nations and struggle just to break even each year.

In my lifetime England haven't qualified for numerous tournaments including 3 World Cups, but there is real apathy probably more than ever towards the national team. This is multi faceted partly due to numerous let downs in tournaments, partly the overpaid Prima Dona view but the soulless tournament qualification process we now go through undoubtedly plays a part. Bottom 16 ranked sides should play each other in a tiered qualification tournament, bin the play offs and make the groups all or nothing.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

Don't get me wrong, I'm 100% about championing minnows. But do San Marino learn anything from this that they couldn't find out in some other way?

It does, at least, put into perspective just how difficult the game is and how easy the professionals tend to make it look.

Can't win either way really. Bar them because they're not good enough? You're kind of abandoning the principles of international football completely there. Make them just play each other? No-one watches it, no-one improves and a large section of the teams spend years doing nothing and just waiting for the next pre-qualifiers. Stick with what we have? Well, it's not great is it.

A team like San Marino can't ever compete, I suppose UEFA would make the argument that Latvia and Albania have made the Euros this century, so why couldn't teams with moderate population bases like Macedonia, Estonia and Armenia one day.

 

[Alan]

In my lifetime England haven't qualified for numerous tournaments including 3 World Cups, but there is real apathy probably more than ever towards the national team. This is multi faceted partly due to numerous let downs in tournaments, partly the overpaid Prima Dona view but the soulless tournament qualification process we now go through undoubtedly plays a part. Bottom 16 ranked sides should play each other in a tiered qualification tournament, bin the play offs and make the groups all or nothing.

Of course then there's Oceania who don't even get a single qualifying spot...

But I digress. We could probably debate ideas for hours but it's not for this thread. Apologies for hijacking it.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

Oceania can't have an automatic spot now Australia have left. Otherwise you're just giving New Zealand a bye every four years.

No problem with discussing this on this thread as far as I'm concerned.

 

[Alan]

I just find not giving any spots to a federation to be bit unfair on principle. Sure, it'd be New Zealand nine times out of ten, but it's getting closer. Tahiti won the regional tournament a few years back, and even New Caledonia and the Solomon Islands have been poking around the perch recently.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

I mentioned Turkey earlier. Between 1984 and 1993, England played them eight times in qualifying. We conceded no goals in those games. There were two 8-0s, a 4-0 and a 5-0 in those eight games.

What do you think would have happened to the development of Turkish football at that stage if we'd collectively said "sorry, you're rubbish, your ranking is awful, you can't play us any more"?

Cross sport, look at the difference in cricket with Bangladesh between now and say, 2005.

 

[Alan]

I'd never suggest that any nation should be barred from qualifying outright, to be clear.

 

[jd1981]

I just find not giving any spots to a federation to be bit unfair on principle. Sure, it'd be New Zealand nine times out of ten, but it's getting closer. Tahiti won the regional tournament a few years back, and even New Caledonia and the Solomon Islands have been poking around the perch recently.

When the quality is that low they should be made to prove themselves against better sides in a play off against a team from Asia.
I'm all for spreading the World Cup but not if it seriously reduces the quality.
Reality is even when the World Cup is spread out we get some serious dros gracing the stage.

 

[Donegal Wolf]

]Well no surprises in reality a poor game and low on quality[/B]. Thought England were bang average as usual and Scotland did there routine thing of raising their game.
People have slated Guardiola all season for ditching Hart based on today you can see why he was binned off. Positioning for both free kicks was abysmal.

All those games which the fixtures list have thrown up in the last couple of years which involve the home nations (& Ireland) playing against each other have all been the same, plenty of effort, application passion etc but low on quality, must be 7 or 8 of them in the last 2 years all virtually the same (possible exception England/Wales last year), highlights the quality of the players being produced and shows how much the PL relies on the foreign players to provide the star quality and variety.

Not wanting to go political on this thread but if Brexit really goes tits and the foreign players coming to the UK dry up, then games like yesterday (and worse as these are the best players) could be what we get used to in the future every week in the league

 

[Donegal Wolf]

Good away win for the Nordies again last night, they are carrying on the good work from the Euros looking good to make the playoffs