The Football Coaching Thread

[big mean bunny]

One of the local sides round our way that regularly win the youth leagues at virtually ever age group played one of the academy sides and were beating them 4-0 in the 2nd half when the academy manager called the game off allegedly. I heard this from someone at the club hence why I don't actually want to name them or the team, but still the last year of being around academies and there coaches has really opened my eyes. Luckily the one who came across to me in the best light (technical coaching and personality wise) works for Wolves! so thats a nice bonus.

 

[YoungWolf]

Certainly a cause for concern - worries me that it's a lot about 'who you know'. Orients academy really isn't too great, they could attract so much better players if they put the work in but they lose out so easily. I have three or four players I could send to them who would get in , comfortably but I would rather they had other opportunities elsewhere before it came to that

 

[Johnny75]

Most academies are run adequately at best from what I've seen. The problem as the two of you have identified is selection, clubs don't pay the scouts and these scouts tend to be teachers or club coaches. Either way the structure is just not there for proper and effective talent identification. It doesn't matter how good the coach is if he hasn't the tools to work with.

Coupled with that staid and tired coaching schemes and the drop out rate is around 80% which is ridiculous. If clubs had articulate and professional recruiting systems then this issue would be rare. The whole system is to cock at the moment with only Brentford a shining light in the whole sorry mess.

 

[big mean bunny]

I was thinking about this this evening, we play staff football on a Friday at work and pupils that left sometimes come if they are the sort of kids that were heavily involved in sport whilst with us, well liked by the staff or have gone to study sport and so come and attend work experience or help out. And we had two lads this evening that left two years ago that were both decent footballers, however the amount of development (both physical and technical) that they have done in that time was very noticeable to me as I used to take their training for a bit. And its purely from a greater exposure to football and sport, neither of them no longer play other than as part of their courses. rather than u21.

One of them wouldn't be far off being able to go straight into the into my club sides firsts which is tier 12, and so whilst entirely amateur isn't a mugs league. And it made me think that pretty much ever pupil that leaves and comes back has made significant progress when they have gone to one of the sports colleges, purely through more focused study. As a fan of American sports I am often critical of how we bin off so much talent in this country when the US consider a development period of an athlete up to the age of 26 in some cases. I have always thought we should have up to u23s for the home grown rule in your squad.

If I was in charge of a unlimited youth budget like Arsenal, Utd, Liverpool etc then I wouldn't be as big on having a be all end all facility. I would try to establish authority over the youth league, regulate all the coaching and basically try to be in charge of every team and club via proxy. Providing as high a level of coaching as possible for everyone in a certain area as well as running the standard youth team.

 

[YoungWolf]

Most academies are run adequately at best from what I've seen. The problem as the two of you have identified is selection, clubs don't pay the scouts and these scouts tend to be teachers or club coaches. Either way the structure is just not there for proper and effective talent identification. It doesn't matter how good the coach is if he hasn't the tools to work with.

Coupled with that staid and tired coaching schemes and the drop out rate is around 80% which is ridiculous. If clubs had articulate and professional recruiting systems then this issue would be rare. The whole system is to cock at the moment with only Brentford a shining light in the whole sorry mess.

I agree, it is a bit of a mess and that is worrying.

My biggest gripe is how appalling the facilities are at grassroots level. I've been to Spurs tonight and Reading last week and they have great indoor 3G pitches but talented kids who are yet to be noticed or picked up have to deal with shoddy excuses for a football pitch and it halts their development. How much are the FA investing into grassroots football, I don't know how much it costs but they should be looking to install 3G pitches everywhere they can so that the players have a better playing surface and also so that less games get called off!

Anyway, took one of my u8s sides to a festival at Spurs training ground. Played for six a side games against Spurs selected sides then three other games against local teams. We drew 2, won 1 and lost 1 against the Spurs teams but most importantly I had 4 players from my mine that I took picked out. At some point they are going to be training at development centres I think which is fantastic, one is a year younger so a great chance for him. Really proud of them, they really rose to the challenges they faced and played some great stuff.

 

[YoungWolf]

My u13s and u8s haven't played since before christmas :facepalm:

In positive news, in April my u13s will be taking part in the FA Youth Futsal Cup, but will be playing at u14s level!

 

[YoungWolf]

Scudamore wants more 3G pitches for rain-hit grassroots leagues.

Exactly what is needed but these things cost a lot to install, and a lot to maintain. Who's going to pay for all this?

 

[MARKakaJIM]

Surely the maintenance isn't all that high? What is there to do once it's down? Rake it over every now and again, throw some more rubber on there when it needs it, I'd have thought the upkeep was far less labour hungry than a grass pitch.

 

[YoungWolf]

I guess, but apparently if you don't look after it well enough the life span of a 3G pitch isn't that long. I don't know the actual details, I've just been reading about it and the obvious concern is money haha.

Still, you are right I guess it should be easier to look after a grass pitch, but then no one actually looks after the grass pitches anyway!

 

[MARKakaJIM]

The initial costs to install are probably pretty high, certainly far above a grass pitch. There never seems to be much going on maintenance wise when I've played over 3G places though, they seem to have hardly any staff aside from referees and a receptionist.

I wanted our Sunday League side to try and use a 3G pitch for our home games a few years ago, more for gimmick than anything else. Don't know if it would've been allowed but our manager didn't explore it anyway the tight bastard.

 

[YoungWolf]

At amateur level I don't think there would be any rules against it.

I've played games in the Youth Conference on astro, and not even the good one. In the other league I played in, which was more of a development league for Premier and Football League clubs only Spurs used a 3G though.

I really think it's something that should be embraced, but I think some are worried about losing the tradition of grass. Would it cost clubs like Crawley/Stevenage more if they had a top quality 4G surface? They could then train on that surface too, or even hire it to the public to help cover costs.

Maidstone do exactly that, but if they get promoted would have to play their games elsewhere as conference clubs have voted against it being used

 

[MARKakaJIM]

Just seems stupid when UEFA are happy for it to be used at the very top level by some Russian clubs. Playing on a quality grass pitch is still the way to go but they take time and effort to maintain. They could at least provide a load of flat pitches for amateur level by switching to artificial turf.

 

[YoungWolf]

Agree, and the quality of football would surely improve too!

 

[MARKakaJIM]

Definitely.

I do love the odd game on a complete mudbath where the ball becomes almost irrelevant, it's a good crack but the novelty would soon wear off if you were playing like that every week. Some of the pitches at amateur level are shocking though. Built up the side of a hill, bobbly as fuck, uncut, poorly marked out and all sorts. The place we played last season even filled a goal mouth with rubble from the building work next door at one point when we asked if they could do something about the hole that was forming.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

The FA really have got their heads in the sand regarding 3G pitches, fine for Man City to train on every day, fine to be used in the Champions League, but you can't use them in the Conference South? They're indistinguishable from grass these days, we're not talking about the monstrosities at Loftus Road/Boundary Park in the late 80s. Would stop loads of games being postponed every year.

 

[Wolf Hunting]

Definitely.

I do love the odd game on a complete mudbath where the ball becomes almost irrelevant, it's a good crack but the novelty would soon wear off if you were playing like that every week. Some of the pitches at amateur level are shocking though. Built up the side of a hill, bobbly as fuck, uncut, poorly marked out and all sorts. The place we played last season even filled a goal mouth with rubble from the building work next door at one point when we asked if they could do something about the hole that was forming.

When I played for British Rail (some years ago now!) in the Manchester Wednesday League, one fixture was against the inmates in Strangeways.
Obviously, they played all of their games at home and that pitch was packed sand and shale. Not a blade of grass to be seen. It sloped and was indeed on the side of a hill with Salford Van Hire main Depot at the far end.
As the goalie for BR my knees were in fucking bits after those games.
But it made me laugh, they were all like whippets - they had fuck all to do except train and get fit - and the wind used to howl down the slope. When one of their lads was approached by our center half, he just stood still, scuffed his feet in the ground and this appalling cloud of dust and grit enveloped our CH and that cunning fucker just ran past him as he sank to his knees rubbing the shit out of his eyes....
Good days.
When you were getting changed after, one of their lads brought your tea in. In a stainless steel bucket full of a couple of gallons of strong tea + Milk + sugar with a tray of a dozen mugs which you dipped in.

 

[Parkins left foot]

Didn't play football when younger - well with my eyesight I would have been a liability-but did play hockey & without doubt the dirtiest (& most alcoholic) team we played was the Metropolitan Police.

On some of the pitches we played on the ball would almost disappear from sight due to mud & potholes

 

[YoungWolf]

Well. Pleasant surprise to see the game my u8s played today on a decent pitch. Must have really good drainage or something, because it was fine and some really good football was played.

In the first game we did really well, playing out from the back all the way up the field on several occasions. Second game did really well until the last ten minutes when we conceded 3 in the final ten minutes, some tired legs as they hadn't played in almost two months. Pleased as missing two of my arguably strongest player today too!

 

[YoungWolf]

Got four players training with Spurs, as well as the two that were already there. Finally Orient have woken up and want to arrange a friendly, despite us trying to sort one for ages. So lazy

 

[YoungWolf]

Friendly with Orient on April 1st - can see them wanting four/five of my players will be interesting!