REFERENDUM RESULTS AND DISCUSSION THREAD

[Deleted Cyber]

I don't know much about him or his political beliefs. I also don't think his comment yesterday was helpful (although, he is right). I was just challenging Cyber inocrrectly implying he was an 'unelected Eurocrat'.

Sorry, I didnt realise that we in the UK had the chance to vote for MEPs in all the other member states. I cant remembers Tusks name on my ballot paper but that may be an oversight casued by me being over 50. I stand corrected and thank you for pointing out my error.

Oh wait............

 

[Tredman]

Sorry, I didnt realise that we in the UK had the chance to vote for MEPs in all the other member states. I cant remembers Tusks name on my ballot paper but that may be an oversight casued by me being over 50. I stand corrected and thank you for pointing out my error.

Oh wait............

Wait, you mean like how we vote for the prime minister too?

Unlike a brexiter to have a sketchy understanding of facts.

 

[Deleted Cyber]

But what you keep missing is that they DON'T NEED to make changes. At all.

For two years they have held all the cards. It has been obvious.

No they dont need to make any changes at all. They only need to compromise if they want a deal. I have continued to say that. If they wont budge and we wont budge JDRodrigues is 100% right. There will be no deal.

Personally I think a deal is better for all sides but what Teflon-Bag came back with wasnt a deal . It was a capitulation. The EU is going into recession. There are a number of economies that will really suffer from brexit no deal in the short term. I would rather avoid that pain all round. But given the two options, Mays current deal or no deal the option is only No deal

 

[Deleted Cyber]

Wait, you mean like how we vote for the prime minister too?

Unlike a brexiter to have a sketchy understanding of facts.

I didnt realise that 27 members states voted for Thersa May either. I am learning lots today. Thanks

 

[Deleted Cyber]

Well this is staggering news and utterly unexpected...."Theresa May's demand to re-open negotiations on her Brexit deal has been officially rejected by the EU"


So I presume we are left with cancel or no deal. No deal it is then. ACES

Yep

And Teflon comes out of this with the "I really really tried"

 

[Tredman]

I didnt realise that 27 members states voted for Thersa May either. I am learning lots today. Thanks

Unlike a brexiter to miss the point.

If you really do think a no deal is preferable to any deal then I really pity you, but equally I hope you feel the pain others will because of you and your ilk's callousness.

 

[Tyrannosaurus Dan]

Sorry, I didnt realise that we in the UK had the chance to vote for MEPs in all the other member states. I cant remembers Tusks name on my ballot paper but that may be an oversight casued by me being over 50. I stand corrected and thank you for pointing out my error.

Oh wait............

Eh? What are you on about? You made a false statement, I corrected it.

 

[Deleted Cyber]

Unlike a brexiter to miss the point.

If you really do think a no deal is preferable to any deal then I really pity you, but equally I hope you feel the pain others will because of you and your ilk's callousness.

Personally I think a deal is better for all sides but what Teflon-Bag came back with wasnt a deal . It was a capitulation.

I repeat my view for you.If you choose to read that as I prefer a no deal then you deserve to be in politics.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

I demand to know what the DUP and the SNP are doing in the House of Commons. They weren't on my ballot paper.

 

[Deleted Cyber]

Eh? What are you on about? You made an false statement, I corrected it.

The phrase uneletcted eurocrat is the stock phrase used by brexiters in interviews as no one in britain votes for any other countries MEPs yet they have say and stock over decisions that effect the UK. I know he is elected. He was not elected by anyone from the UK though was he? And dont come all innocent. You knew exactly what I meant hence my facetious response. :shakehand:

 

[SLA]

I demand to know what the DUP and the SNP are doing in the House of Commons. They weren't on my ballot paper.

Personally i demand to know what ALL those other MPs from around the country are doing in Parliament. I was only given the option of voting for my local MP. I'm being ruled by an unelected Britocrat dictatorship!

 

[Tyrannosaurus Dan]

The phrase uneletcted eurocrat is the stock phrase used by brexiters in interviews as no one in britain votes for any other countries MEPs yet they have say and stock over decisions that effect the UK. I know he is elected. He was not elected by anyone from the UK though was he? And dont come all innocent. You knew exactly what I meant hence my facetious response. :shakehand:

But he was technically elected by the UK? The people we elect to represent us cast our vote for him didn't they (unless my understanding is wrong)?

Surely one of your complaints about the EU isn't that you can't vote for any other countries MEP's?!

 

[Deleted Cyber]

But they could have been couldnt they? They could have fought seats outside their country but chose not too. That does not apply to POLITICAL PARTIES from countries outside the UK.

 

[Deleted Cyber]

Bored now.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

So hang on. Donald Tusk should have stood for election as an MEP in the UK now? May I ask why?

 

[Deleted Cyber]

So hang on. Donald Tusk should have stood for election as an MEP in the UK now? May I ask why?

Where the fuck did you get that from?

I thought that this had covered the west lothian question?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/West_Lothian_question

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

Where the fuck did you get that from?

You'll have to explain what on earth you're banging on about here, as you've totally lost me.

But they could have been couldnt they? They could have fought seats outside their country but chose not too.

Who are you on about? What does this even mean?

 

[jdrodrigues]

The phrase uneletcted eurocrat is the stock phrase used by brexiters in interviews as no one in britain votes for any other countries MEPs yet they have say and stock over decisions that effect the UK. I know he is elected. He was not elected by anyone from the UK though was he? And dont come all innocent. You knew exactly what I meant hence my facetious response. :shakehand:

But that's how democracy works within an indirect electoral system. You don't have for every cabinet staff member, you put your trust in someone that shall do it for you, or who shall also delegate the decision to another.

I don't want to talk about the British parliament and ministers due to ignorance on how your system works. As such, in Portugal we vote for the parliament and the president, different elections. To form a government, the parliament suggests the prime Minister to the president, who then meets with every party and hears what they say. Then the president nominates the PM out of those and accepts his/hers suggestions for the remaining ministers. In a much broad scope.

However, you can say that the people elected the PM and all cabinet members as they were nominated by someone who was elected.

Most European institutions work in a similar fashion. We elect someone who will then elect someone and so on. The original power, however, derives from the people's vote. As such, it is a democracy.

 

[Tony Towner]

But that's how democracy works within an indirect electoral system. You don't have for every cabinet staff member, you put your trust in someone that shall do it for you, or who shall also delegate the decision to another.

I don't want to talk about the British parliament and ministers due to ignorance on how your system works. As such, in Portugal we vote for the parliament and the president, different elections. To form a government, the parliament suggests the prime Minister to the president, who then meets with every party and hears what they say. Then the president nominates the PM out of those and accepts his/hers suggestions for the remaining ministers. In a much broad scope.

However, you can say that the people elected the PM and all cabinet members as they were nominated by someone who was elected.

Most European institutions work in a similar fashion. We elect someone who will then elect someone and so on. The original power, however, derives from the people's vote. As such, it is a democracy.

Here's a thought to try and help you understand Brexit. As confused and illogical as Cyber's posts in the last day have been, as Brexiteers go he's a mild version

 

[nimrod]

But that's how democracy works within an indirect electoral system. You don't have for every cabinet staff member, you put your trust in someone that shall do it for you, or who shall also delegate the decision to another.

I don't want to talk about the British parliament and ministers due to ignorance on how your system works. As such, in Portugal we vote for the parliament and the president, different elections. To form a government, the parliament suggests the prime Minister to the president, who then meets with every party and hears what they say. Then the president nominates the PM out of those and accepts his/hers suggestions for the remaining ministers. In a much broad scope.

However, you can say that the people elected the PM and all cabinet members as they were nominated by someone who was elected.

Most European institutions work in a similar fashion. We elect someone who will then elect someone and so on. The original power, however, derives from the people's vote. As such, it is a democracy.

i think the difference between "representative" democracy and direct democracy has been deliberately and falsely misused in the whole debate.
the whole 'stopping democracy' argument used by brexiteers is a lie as proven in court
if you want that sort of democracy, you'll have to destroy the existing parliamentary system first
nevermind, any true democrat would probably have objected to the whole referendum to start with