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REFERENDUM RESULTS AND DISCUSSION THREAD

Cyber-_-man said:
what Cameron promised in 2013. Merkel not to bottle out re Junker. And for the EU to take the leave vote seriously. I didnt think leave would win but I wanted the message to be heard. Leavers were grossly underestimated across the board. Never in political history has a mood been so misread , well not in my lifetime.

Still , none of this matters a jot now. We came , we voted , we won.Now we have to get on with the consequences. And I am still completely in the dark as regards what the $#@! that means
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So you voted for something without understanding what the implications might be?
 
SLA said:
So basically you wanted the UK to be able to stamp its little feet and have the EU tremble and make all sorts of new concessions on top of the many they'd already given us. In that case they called our bluff knowing full well that if we did vote to leave the suffering would fall almost entirely on us. And thus did it come to pass.
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Yeah shit happens.


Lolz
 
Don't see why anyone needs to 'suffer' or why the EU would want to make the UK 'suffer'. It's a two-way street surely.
I don't see why wanting sovereignty, control of ones own laws and tougher controls on immigration are such a bad thing.

Don't see that the above has a massive bearing on trade between countries either.
 
arklowolf said:
Don't see why anyone needs to 'suffer' or why the EU would want to make the UK 'suffer'. It's a two-way street surely.
I don't see why wanting sovereignty, control of ones own laws and tougher controls on immigration are such a bad thing.

Don't see that the above has a massive bearing on trade between countries either.
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As I mentioned above, we were involved in drawing up the laws and then they were passed into UK law by our sovereign parliament - how is that not having control of them?

I don't see that the EU *want* us to suffer, but if we're dumb enough to inflict suffering on ourselves, it's not down to them to prevent it at the expense of the well-being of the 27 nations who remain part of the EU.
 
Hard to come out with that statement when the likes of Johnson were saying that exit from the Single Market wouldn't happen if we left, and yet here we are.
 
SLA said:
As I mentioned above, we were involved in drawing up the laws and then they were passed into UK law by our sovereign parliament - how is that not having control of them?

I don't see that the EU *want* us to suffer, but if we're dumb enough to inflict suffering on ourselves, it's not down to them to prevent it at the expense of the well-being of the 27 nations who remain part of the EU.
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So you agree then that the direction the 27 others wanted to take was different to the direction the UK wanted to take and that the refusal to make any more concessions was a primary reason for a successful leave vote.

I see that the EU see it as essential that Brexit is the most difficult and complicated and self harming political process possible to completely discourage others from doing it. We are just really unlucky that we are the test case, but we knew we would be. It is essential that it is thrashed out properly , throughly and a blueprint for "leave" is there for all member states.

The biggest issue I have had is the triggering of article 50. Premature evacuation so to speak.
 
Johnny75 said:
Deluded $#@!e. I turned it off when he said 'everybody knew what they were voting for'.

Clearly not $#@!tard otherwise we wouldn't be in this mess.
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He goes on to talk about people who didn't listen.
 
Johnny75 said:
Deluded $#@!e. I turned it off when he said 'everybody knew what they were voting for'.

Clearly not $#@!tard otherwise we wouldn't be in this mess.
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Thats not quite right though is it Johnny?

People voted to be

Out of the union
Out of single market
Out of customs union

What is fucked up is that there is a complete impasse from all sides making that happen. Thats the mess. And Ireland is the biggest sticking point.

So actually , a government called a referendum offering an outcome that was impossible to achieve? Thats probably the summary.
 
Funnily enough there are Irish saying this could be a golden opportunity.
They can have the best of both worlds.
Typical Irish way of going about things really. Hate the Brits but love everything British.
 
Cyber-_-man said:
Thats not quite right though is it Johnny?

People voted to be

Out of the union
Out of single market
Out of customs union

What is fucked up is that there is a complete impasse from all sides making that happen. Thats the mess. And Ireland is the biggest sticking point.

So actually , a government called a referendum offering an outcome that was impossible to achieve? Thats probably the summary.
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Is it, is that what people voted for?

http://uk.businessinsider.com/boris-johnson-single-market-brexit-campaign-customs-union-2018-1

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...referendum-single-market-brexit-a7104846.html

https://eu-rope.ideasoneurope.eu/2018/02/14/boris-johnson-remember-what-he-said/

Only it looks like Boris Johnson (who you might remember was rather prominent in the campaign) said that we wouldn't/shouldn't leave the Single Market.

Also, what percentage of people do you think actually understand what it is, and yet still voted Leave?
 
The referendum was not called because the EU refused to play ball. Let us remember that cameron is not an effective statesman. he's a privelidged cunt, who surrounded himself with yes men, schoolfriends, and people who's world view was his.

He was not able to be master of his own party, let alone an effective pm or representative of the UK.

He cultivated an image that appeared to make him electable. Even this wasn't very good, he couldn't even win an election against gordon brown ffs. Which shows everything was style without substance.

He then half arsedly (as he does with most stuff) has a bit of a chat with the EU, then returns and calls the referendum on a whim to prove how right he fucking is, as he's always right. Plus, he believes it will give him a mandate for the country, and most importantly it will give him a mandate within his own party, which in reality the conservatives have been divided on europe for decades, and he hoped to quell that one.

Spectacular failure on every front, from someone who is a failure as a human being. This whole process, and a lot of what has happened since has never been about the best interests of the country, or even about the will of the people. Start to finish it has been about self interest of specific individuals in the conservative party. May didn't learn from any of that, being the candidate not as bad as everyone else (but no good as a candidate) to obtain the leadership. Sham GE which also backfires, and then getting into bed shamefully with the DUP shows her self interest. Everything boris does is based on self interest. Gove has consistently acted in his own self interest. Liam fox manages to come out of the wilderness based on self interest (and possibly adam werrity's self interest too). I mean that fucker should have never been allowed to resume political life given his conflicts of interest, yet is all ok! rees mogg has used it to develop his own cult status, and so on.

As a result, we've got racism and hate crime on a constant rise. People are dying earlier, in manners which are preventable owing to the shocking self interested policies that cameron and co have put into place. Everyone hates each other, as we are either remainers or brexiteers. The labour party, to their shame, have engaged in their own petty squabbles and their own self interests far too frequently throughout this whole debacle.

This whole thing has been about some rich peoples self interests. Quite a contradiction to his strapline of "we're all in this together. We are now, cos of you, you fucking cunt. You used the country for your own interests, and accept no accountability or responsibility, and it highlights how fucking contradictory and full of lies you were, and that set the tone for everything subsequent.

It's a disgrace. It has never, ever been about the EU, and it still isn't. All this is about squabbles within the conservative party. The whole UK is going to suffer as a result of these squabbles. Not one thing have they done as part of this that has actually beein in the national interest.
 
lemonjelly said:
The referendum was not called because the EU refused to play ball. Let us remember that cameron is not an effective statesman. he's a privelidged cunt, who surrounded himself with yes men, schoolfriends, and people who's world view was his.

He was not able to be master of his own party, let alone an effective pm or representative of the UK.

He cultivated an image that appeared to make him electable. Even this wasn't very good, he couldn't even win an election against gordon brown ffs. Which shows everything was style without substance.

He then half arsedly (as he does with most stuff) has a bit of a chat with the EU, then returns and calls the referendum on a whim to prove how right he fucking is, as he's always right. Plus, he believes it will give him a mandate for the country, and most importantly it will give him a mandate within his own party, which in reality the conservatives have been divided on europe for decades, and he hoped to quell that one.

Spectacular failure on every front, from someone who is a failure as a human being. This whole process, and a lot of what has happened since has never been about the best interests of the country, or even about the will of the people. Start to finish it has been about self interest of specific individuals in the conservative party. May didn't learn from any of that, being the candidate not as bad as everyone else (but no good as a candidate) to obtain the leadership. Sham GE which also backfires, and then getting into bed shamefully with the DUP shows her self interest. Everything boris does is based on self interest. Gove has consistently acted in his own self interest. Liam fox manages to come out of the wilderness based on self interest (and possibly adam werrity's self interest too). I mean that fucker should have never been allowed to resume political life given his conflicts of interest, yet is all ok! rees mogg has used it to develop his own cult status, and so on.

As a result, we've got racism and hate crime on a constant rise. People are dying earlier, in manners which are preventable owing to the shocking self interested policies that cameron and co have put into place. Everyone hates each other, as we are either remainers or brexiteers. The labour party, to their shame, have engaged in their own petty squabbles and their own self interests far too frequently throughout this whole debacle.

This whole thing has been about some rich peoples self interests. Quite a contradiction to his strapline of "we're all in this together. We are now, cos of you, you fucking cunt. You used the country for your own interests, and accept no accountability or responsibility, and it highlights how fucking contradictory and full of lies you were, and that set the tone for everything subsequent.

It's a disgrace. It has never, ever been about the EU, and it still isn't. All this is about squabbles within the conservative party. The whole UK is going to suffer as a result of these squabbles. Not one thing have they done as part of this that has actually beein in the national interest.
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