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REFERENDUM RESULTS AND DISCUSSION THREAD

Langers said:
Well I'm just pleased that Johnson's speech wasn't just a load of empty rhetoric and buzz words. It was also good to see some detailed analysis of how 'we' will all make it work. Top stuff, Bojo. I can't see how it will be anything other than a roaring success.

*whistles Rule Britannia*
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It's the same old blither about how people talking us down are the real danger and they should just trust that it'll all work out in the end (because of course, those in charge have inspired SO much faith over the last couple of years). In the end, when this fails, everyone other than those actually responsible for this catastrophe will be blamed. The EU, Remainers, Project Fear, those fucking foreigners, the biased left wing media, the young (ie virtually everyone under 45), Labour, the SNP, pro-European Tories...they'll chuck Cruella under the bus too. I mean she deserves it to an extent because she's hopeless and a horrible cunt in her own right, but this isn't a situation that she created, she's just been palpably incapable of doing anything at all to fix it.

If something is obviously a disaster with zero redeeming features and the inevitable conclusion will be a shitshow that even Mr Magoo could see on the horizon, then it's reasonable, even essential at times to call it out as such. See Saunders, Dean. If you ignore all the signs and willingly sail to your own doom then that's a special kind of idiocy.
 
Deutsch Wolf said:
It's the same old blither about how people talking us down are the real danger and they should just trust that it'll all work out in the end (because of course, those in charge have inspired SO much faith over the last couple of years). In the end, when this fails, everyone other than those actually responsible for this catastrophe will be blamed. The EU, Remainers, Project Fear, those fucking foreigners, the biased left wing media, the young (ie virtually everyone under 45), Labour, the SNP, pro-European Tories...they'll chuck Cruella under the bus too. I mean she deserves it to an extent because she's hopeless and a horrible cunt in her own right, but this isn't a situation that she created, she's just been palpably incapable of doing anything at all to fix it.

If something is obviously a disaster with zero redeeming features and the inevitable conclusion will be a shitshow that even Mr Magoo could see on the horizon, then it's reasonable, even essential at times to call it out as such. See Saunders, Dean. If you ignore all the signs and willingly sail to your own doom then that's a special kind of idiocy.
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It'll be labours fault for ruining the economy...
 
If Labour cause* a recession in 2007/8 then it is totally unreasonable to expect any significant recovery in the next 10 years, what do you think we are, magicians?

If we leave the EU, ripping up over 40 years of integration, chucking away the fundamental systems on which imports/exports are based, walking away from the largest trading bloc on the planet and reverting to WTO-only rules (which not one single country in the world currently does, even the likes of Mauritania, Iraq and North Korea have some form of FTAs with some partners), there might be some short term pain but of course we'll fix it and damn quickly too. Are you stupid or something?


*Bloody Labour running the global economy and encouraging sub-prime lending in the US, shame we didn't listen to the Tories slamming all their economic policies pre-2007, because that happened
 
From that thread - "Project Cheer or Project Fear - I know what side I'm on". This is the level of the debate.
 
I'm on the side of Project Not Getting Fucked In The Arse By A Bunch Of Ideologically Driven Fuckwits.
 
Visage said:
Are we not doing will of the people any more?
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Of course we are but thats not the reason we wont have one.

1. The government wont ever ever ever make such a decision binary again
2. This govt would lose all face and credibility.
3. There is only minimal appetite for it in real terms- many are sick of going to the polls.

No we are where we are and the only option this lot will choose is to press on.
 
I don't think it'll happen either but on point 2, they have nothing at all to lose in that respect. Everyone already knows what they are. Even Conservative voters don't like this Government.
 
Cyber-_-man said:
Of course we are but thats not the reason we wont have one.

1. The government wont ever ever ever make such a decision binary again
2. This govt would lose all face and credibility.
3. There is only minimal appetite for it in real terms- many are sick of going to the polls.

No we are where we are and the only option this lot will choose is to press on.
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Despite the overwhelming evidence that cancelling this ridiculous charade is the best, safest, most sensible and responsible thing to do for the country. Which should trump any of the 3 points you raise. Fuck another referendum - just scrap the fucking thing.

Unfortunately this will never happen with a spineless government and opposition who only give a shit about getting into power. Fuck common sense and doing the right thing, eh?
 
I have always been open with you guys and tried to negotiate my position knowing it is opposite to the vast majority. I still believe that leaving the current EU set up is right given Britain's current stance. However if hypothetically there was a plan c where the EU reigned in its ambitions and recognised some of the brexit concerns I would happily have another vote. This time let it be informed and not binary. I would then vote with all good informed conscience. But I have to agree. This lot are fucking this up even more spectacularly than could have been anticipated. Its a remainders dream ticket!
 
Boris projected the myth of a European superstate looming again yesterday in his dire speech, Juncker immediately refuted it.

We had more opt outs than anyone else ever has had or ever will have. We would never have joined Schengen or the Euro.

We had a raft of measures that we could have used to control immigration, immigrants' rights to benefits etc but never used them.

Ultimately the majority of those who voted Leave did not understand what the EU does, they voted based on very base instincts. Now I wonder what could have provoked that.

JS92738860.jpg
 
Deutsch Wolf said:
Boris projected the myth of a European superstate looming again yesterday in his dire speech, Juncker immediately refuted it.

We had more opt outs than anyone else ever has had or ever will have. We would never have joined Schengen or the Euro.

We had a raft of measures that we could have used to control immigration, immigrants' rights to benefits etc but never used them.

Ultimately the majority of those who voted Leave did not understand what the EU does, they voted based on very base instincts. Now I wonder what could have provoked that.

JS92738860.jpg
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I need to know why joining the euro or shenghen was such an issue. I hate the opt outs. They are wrong and unnecessary. All in or all out you can't sit on the fence. You also can't expect a human being not to try his luck for work that pays 10 times more in the UK than it does in His own country. Romania electrician btw. Is the example I am using. Google the figures. They are close enough.
I am hating this hiatus that sees bullshit spouted by an incompetent govt. Vote again with real options and end this nonsense
 
Why is it "all in or all out"? That was never the position! It was never even going to be a question.

It'd be like us resigning from FIFA now because one day they'll say we can't have four Home Nations teams, no-one else gets away with it and one day it'll be all in or all out. So let's quit while we're ahead and never play in a World Cup ever again.
 
Deutsch Wolf said:
Why is it "all in or all out"? That was never the position! It was never even going to be a question.

It'd be like us resigning from FIFA now because one day they'll say we can't have four Home Nations teams, no-one else gets away with it and one day it'll be all in or all out. So let's quit while we're ahead and never play in a World Cup ever again.
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No. You can't have such inequality between countries. It will always be unworkable in the long run. The goal ius economic and monetary union. That is stated. So to get that you need a level playing field. Not having it led to opt outs. Not having enough opt outs lked to a referendum. Having a referendum led us here. I believe in learning from mistakes not compounding them
 
Britain Elects
Britain Elects
@britainelects
On bringing back compulsory military service for young people:

Support: 48%
Oppose: 36%

--

18-24 yr olds:
Support: 10%
Oppose: 62%

65+ yr olds:
Support: 74%
Oppose: 18%

via @YouGov, 15 Feb
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At least they are consistent :/
 
Pre-empting stuff that might (and probably won't) happen decades down the line is an odd way to shape your vote, but it's up to you I suppose.

It wasn't opt outs or lack of them that led to a referendum. It was the lunatic fringe of the Conservative party being bizarrely given a voice. They won largely through outright lies and appealing to the racist nature of English people.

I appreciate you have your own reasons and I would not tar you with the same brush, but the people who won this political fight and the majority of the people who voted for it are simply appalling. Being aligned with them in any way would be a seriously frightening prospect if I were on that side of the fence.
 
Cyber-_-man said:
No. You can't have such inequality between countries. It will always be unworkable in the long run. The goal ius economic and monetary union. That is stated. So to get that you need a level playing field. Not having it led to opt outs. Not having enough opt outs lked to a referendum. Having a referendum led us here. I believe in learning from mistakes not compounding them
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Only none of that is true. The EU may have needed changing but we had veto's, funding streams, infrastructure projects, the pound (which nobody was forcing us to change from), trading power with the rest of the world and unlimited freedom of movement.

And some people have voted all that away. Just let that sink in for a minute.
 
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