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REFERENDUM RESULTS AND DISCUSSION THREAD

Ken Clarke:

“Whilst I welcome the tone of the Prime Minister’s statement today and the commitments to free trade and internationalism and so on, which are very welcome, does my Right Honourable Friend agree that when he’s negotiating free trade agreements or customs union with any other country or groups of country, the parties both agree to be bound by sets of rules which neither of them are going to change. And any agreement involves submitting to some means of resolution of disputes – be it arbitration or a court of law or the World Trade Organisation rules.

“So what I don’t understand when reading the Prime Minister's statement or listening to my Right Honourable Friend is which country in the world is going to enter into a trade agreement with this country on the basis that the rules are entirely what the British say they’re going to be on any particular day and if there’s any dispute about the rules it’s going to be sorted out by the British Government.”
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A few of us older forum members now scenting the chance to go back to pounds, shillings and pence; rods, poles and perches; furlongs... That'll send shivers through a few staff rooms...
 
EdgeOfTheAlps said:
To produce thousands of cars that they can't sell because well, they're not very good and look like $#@!.
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Talking of cars, climate control, low emissions and corruption, you might be interested in reading this. The EU new about VW falsifying their emissions, several years before they got found out in the USA. What did the EU do? Knowing that VW cars were qualifying for government subsidies from many countries, including the UK. Not a lot.

http://m.spiegel.de/international/business/a-1103249.html
 
We voted for Brexit, Dan. That is to leave the EU. We know what we voted for. I wonder if we had voted to remain in the EU, Would remain voters have accepted, leave voters saying you didn't know what you voted for and you voted to remain, but not to take contol back of our own borders . That would be ridiculous. Well it is just as ridiculous, trying to tell leave, what we voted for.
It is coming across a little pretentious, people saying if you voted leave you don't know what you voted for, but if you voted remain, you did!
 
As we were already a member of the EU I think it's fair to say that those of us that voted remain knew exactly what we were voting for.
 
16002813_376904336009389_3042982513172516700_n.jpg
 
I don't think May has a lot of choice other than to go for the hard Brexit option irrespective of whether she believes it is the correct one or whether she can deliver it.

Two things are clear firstly that any deal that didn't involve the UK controlling it's own immigration wouldn't be acceptable to the majority of those who voted leave as this was the driving factor behind their vote and secondly the EU wouldn't let us stay in the single market without free movement of people so this really was the only option open to her and she has to try and make the best of it.

Personally I think we will end up with a complex agreement with the EU with different tariffs across multiple areas. I think free trade will exist in some markets which suits them, cars definitely, food possibly, tourism probably and not in others where the stand to gain less. I'd be amazed if this was negotiated in 2 years though.
 
EdgeOfTheAlps said:
One that the UK as one of 28 with veto rights would have had a say in maintaining.
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But people saying that they knew what the future was going to be because they voted remain is nonsense.

Yes, the outline might have been clear, but the detail could be better, but could be worse.

The people who voted leave thinks the future will be better away from the EU where as remain think it will be better in. Neither know who will be right, yet some remain voters seem to think they know what the future will be like.
 
Penk Wolf said:
But people saying that they knew what the future was going to be because they voted remain is nonsense.

Yes, the outline might have been clear, but the detail could be better, but could be worse.

The people who voted leave thinks the future will be better away from the EU where as remain think it will be better in. Neither know who will be right, yet some remain voters seem to think they know what the future will be like.
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I'm not saying remain voters can predict the future, but when you are already part of something and you are voting for things to remain that way then it's an accurate assessment to say that you know what you are voting for.
 
From my perspective I expected short term problems followed by long term gains, so far, currency aside, all I've seen and heard is that companies are on the up and hopefully companies should reward staff properly which should mean that any increase in pricing should be counteracted by wage/salary rises.

There is a skills shortage in the Country, so if these pay rises aren't happening then people should be looking at their options. Equally I'm concerned and keeping an eye on what is happening regarding work from people within the EU as we need their workforce.
 
If you allow wages to rise considering prices are almost guaranteed to go up then you will have rampant inflation.
 
Rampant inflation is inevitable.

Most of my suppliers have increased prices between 7 - 10%
 
Before the vote David Cameron went to the EU for some concession and came away with relatively little therefore it isn't a stretch to assume that a vote to remain was for the status quo. That means people who voted to remain understood that they were voting for more of the same. I would suggest that even the most ill informed would understand that this meant continued free movement of people, comtinued membership of the single market and laws and regulations made outside our national parliament. Nearly half those who voted in the referendum vote for this - who is representing their wishes now?

Those who voted leave probably had a variety of reasons for doing so but it seems to have come down to immigration, immigration, immigration and the only way to achieve this is by complete withdrawal from the EU. I don't think the evidence is there to support the so called "hard Brexit" position and, given that nearly half those who voted did so for remain any exit should reflect this position. The people did not vote to leave in one bloc, it was a very small majority.

I think it is fair to infer that to vote remain was a "known quantity", to leave not so. This idea that we can go from one member of a trading bloc to an independent nation trading confidently in the world mis a leap of faith and so far the "confident" leavers trumpet a trade deal with New Zealand and a zealous protectionist in Trump as evidence in their favour.

We are still feeling the consequences of a global economic crisis, our economy remains fragile for reasons unrelated to our decision to leave the EU. This is probably the worst time to leave the EU.
 
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