Palace 1-0 Wolves: Verdict Thread

[MARKakaJIM]

The players being terrified is not coming from Nuno.
Its coming from a disasterous run of form.
We started the season with good results without playing anywhere near as well as we can. Our confidence has been drained and now the players are shit scared to do anything so be safe.

This team by and large is very young it takes a lot of courage to try things when your confidence is shot to pieces, a more experienced team may be able to just play there way out of

It's up to the coach to give them that confidence though, by allowing them the freedom to have a go then they won't fear making mistakes. It's the opposite extreme but look at Leeds, they've been pummeled a few times yet they still bombed forward with reckless abandon because that's the mentality their coach enforces. Nuno is conservative first and foremost, that's reflected in his teams mentality and when things go against then tend to recede into their shell as a result rather than come out swinging.

I think this season it's also often been the younger players that have been let down by their more experienced colleagues. The likes of Neto, RAN, Vitinha, Kilman and even Silva don't seem to go hiding as quickly as say the entire central midfield do. They might not have always been effective but I've seen more if them still showing for the ball and trying to play their way out of problems than others who should be far more confident in doing so.

 

[PuntsWolf]

The performances aren’t that different to how they’ve been all season.

Sheff Utd - they ar awful and we scored two goals in 6 mins. One an outrageous finish and two a set piece. We then decided not to play for 60 mins.

Man City - horrific 45. Actually tried to play a bit second half though tbf.

West Ham - just awful.

Fulham - another team who we played at a good time as they were awful. GK made a few good saves. Deserved the win but easily could have not won - fine margins.

Leeds - we just weren’t great. Rui had nothing to do but with better quality from them or bad luck one of their countless shots deflects in. Our goal is as lucky as they get. Hoof which Raul gets on from a defender slip, then some good quality but a huge slice of luck. Another game we won on fine margins.

Newcastle - weren’t great after 10 mins. Another goal which only goes in becuase of Raul quality/ GK pushing it in his net. Soft goal to concede but no different to what we’ve been doing all year

Palace - did actually play well first half. But they were abject. Still could have been different without the marginal offside calls for the goals and penalty.

Leicester - awful. Unlucky with the penalty, but play so deep with no effort to score and bad things can happen.

Saints/Arsenal/Villa - played well in a 4. Our best performances by a margin.

Liverpool - untroubled in a 4 until the Coady error. A threat on the break even with no striker. Could easily have made it 1-1 but then a series of errors in the middle of the pitch and Wijnaldim quality and it’s 2-0 and game over.

Chelsea - did well second half. Could easily have been 2-0 down though and game over. Won the game with “outrageous quality” again.

Burnley - awful

United - Decent performance, Bruno probably should score but Rui actually makes a save/ hit him. Poor decisions/quality in final third from us. Give away a soft goal.

Brighton - did OK first half. Didn’t really do much to score 3 but certainly weren’t threatened. Parked the bus second half and conceded.

Everton - untroubled all game in a 4 but conceded 2. Looked OK going forward despite a Random team. Faded badly second half and were awful going forward. Still untroubled though.

Albion - had the game won at HT similar to Brighton. Gave away terrible goals. No goal threat second half but Cutrone should equalise from a loose ball.

Chelsea - awful. Take the point

Palace - awful.

Not too many good performances in there. Our best actually came without Raul in a 4-2-3-1. But we don’t have him to score a goal from nothing. We haven’t been great for ages, but the fine margins are going the other way. “Regressing to the mean”. That’s a problem

 

[Tony Towner]

The players being terrified is not coming from Nuno.
Its coming from a disasterous run of form.

Don't think you can divorce the 2 - he's the manager his job is to give them that belief and confidence and he's not exactly exuding it himself

 

[Tony Towner]

The performances aren’t that different to how they’ve been all season.

Sheff Utd - they ar awful and we scored two goals in 6 mins. One an outrageous finish and two a set piece. We then decided not to play for 60 mins.

Man City - horrific 45. Actually tried to play a bit second half though tbf.

West Ham - just awful.

Fulham - another team who we played at a good time as they were awful. GK made a few good saves. Deserved the win but easily could have not won - fine margins.

Leeds - we just weren’t great. Rui had nothing to do but with better quality from them or bad luck one of their countless shots deflects in. Our goal is as lucky as they get. Hoof which Raul gets on from a defender slip, then some good quality but a huge slice of luck. Another game we won on fine margins.

Newcastle - weren’t great after 10 mins. Another goal which only goes in becuase of Raul quality/ GK pushing it in his net. Soft goal to concede but no different to what we’ve been doing all year

Palace - did actually play well first half. But they were abject. Still could have been different without the marginal offside calls for the goals and penalty.

Leicester - awful. Unlucky with the penalty, but play so deep with no effort to score and bad things can happen.

Saints/Arsenal/Villa - played well in a 4. Our best performances by a margin.

Liverpool - untroubled in a 4 until the Coady error. A threat on the break even with no striker. Could easily have made it 1-1 but then a series of errors in the middle of the pitch and Wijnaldim quality and it’s 2-0 and game over.

Chelsea - did well second half. Could easily have been 2-0 down though and game over. Won the game with “outrageous quality” again.

Burnley - awful

United - Decent performance, Bruno probably should score but Rui actually makes a save/ hit him. Poor decisions/quality in final third from us. Give away a soft goal.

Brighton - did OK first half. Didn’t really do much to score 3 but certainly weren’t threatened. Parked the bus second half and conceded.

Everton - untroubled all game in a 4 but conceded 2. Looked OK going forward despite a Random team. Faded badly second half and were awful going forward. Still untroubled though.

Albion - had the game won at HT similar to Brighton. Gave away terrible goals. No goal threat second half but Cutrone should equalise from a loose ball.

Chelsea - awful. Take the point

Palace - awful.

Not too many good performances in there. Our best actually came without Raul in a 4-2-3-1. But we don’t have him to score a goal from nothing. We haven’t been great for ages, but the fine margins are going the other way. “Regressing to the mean”. That’s a problem

You could extend that back to July and the post lockdown element of last season. Broadly more defensively solid, but defending too deep when we had a lead, few goals and last minute points lost. I do think the lack of crowds has affected us a lot, but we are at the stage now where even if the reason is genuine it cannot be accepted. I was accepting of a win a few, lose a few meh season appreciating that situation, but it's sunk lower than that. Again 'we miss our fans' constantly from Nuno must get into their heads. It's now victim mentality I'm afraid

 

[Wilf Wolf]

The performances aren’t that different to how they’ve been all season.

Sheff Utd - they ar awful and we scored two goals in 6 mins. One an outrageous finish and two a set piece. We then decided not to play for 60 mins.

Man City - horrific 45. Actually tried to play a bit second half though tbf.

West Ham - just awful.

Fulham - another team who we played at a good time as they were awful. GK made a few good saves. Deserved the win but easily could have not won - fine margins.

Leeds - we just weren’t great. Rui had nothing to do but with better quality from them or bad luck one of their countless shots deflects in. Our goal is as lucky as they get. Hoof which Raul gets on from a defender slip, then some good quality but a huge slice of luck. Another game we won on fine margins.

Newcastle - weren’t great after 10 mins. Another goal which only goes in becuase of Raul quality/ GK pushing it in his net. Soft goal to concede but no different to what we’ve been doing all year

Palace - did actually play well first half. But they were abject. Still could have been different without the marginal offside calls for the goals and penalty.

Leicester - awful. Unlucky with the penalty, but play so deep with no effort to score and bad things can happen.

Saints/Arsenal/Villa - played well in a 4. Our best performances by a margin.

Liverpool - untroubled in a 4 until the Coady error. A threat on the break even with no striker. Could easily have made it 1-1 but then a series of errors in the middle of the pitch and Wijnaldim quality and it’s 2-0 and game over.

Chelsea - did well second half. Could easily have been 2-0 down though and game over. Won the game with “outrageous quality” again.

Burnley - awful

United - Decent performance, Bruno probably should score but Rui actually makes a save/ hit him. Poor decisions/quality in final third from us. Give away a soft goal.

Brighton - did OK first half. Didn’t really do much to score 3 but certainly weren’t threatened. Parked the bus second half and conceded.

Everton - untroubled all game in a 4 but conceded 2. Looked OK going forward despite a Random team. Faded badly second half and were awful going forward. Still untroubled though.

Albion - had the game won at HT similar to Brighton. Gave away terrible goals. No goal threat second half but Cutrone should equalise from a loose ball.

Chelsea - awful. Take the point

Palace - awful.

Not too many good performances in there. Our best actually came without Raul in a 4-2-3-1. But we don’t have him to score a goal from nothing. We haven’t been great for ages, but the fine margins are going the other way. “Regressing to the mean”. That’s a problem

And a happy Sunday to you too! I’m just off to slash my wrists as that is beyond depressing.

 

[darlowolf64]

I think its both ways, Nuno changing the team and tactics week in and week out doesnt help, players get insecure, will i play next week etc...you are correct we have a very young team in general and they usually have a performance curve that is more unstable than older players..injuries with our small squad and covid, support from fans I think has got to us much more than most teams..

I keep seeing you write this Fred so…

GK; Rui Patricio, John Ruddy

FB/WB; Ki-Jana Hoever, Nelson Semedo, Marcal, Rayan Ait Nouri, Jonny

CB; Willy Boly, Conor Coady, Max Kilman, Romain Saiss (Donk & Marcal can play here)

Mid; Ruben Neves, Joao Moutinho, Leander Dendoncker (Saiss can play here)

CAM; Morgan Gibbs-White, Vitinha

Wide F; Daniel Podence, Adama Traore, Pedro Neto,

Fwd; Willian Jose, Fabio Silva, Raul Jimenez(inj)

Players who have made the bench/started

Def; Hugo Bueno, Christian Marques, Nigel Lonwijk, Luke Matheson, Lewis Richards

Mid; Luke Cundle, Owen Otasowie*, Taylor Perry, Meritan Shabani,

Fwd; Theo Corbeanu

* A case can be made for Owen to be considered as one of the first XI midfielders now and so we have a “First Team Squad” of 23 plus 9 others that can be considered as live outsiders for the first team so we are hardly at “bare bones” level.

What I will give you though is there must be a question mark over the ability of some of the players listed above. We don’t know if any of the kids are at the required level but we hope at least a few are. We also know that we have reached the stage where the club must seriously look at upgrading some of the first XI.

I’ll say that, for me, we need a keeper that can seriously challenge Rui. John Ruddy keeping a clean sheet against Chorley is no barometer and I’d like to see a young keeper brought in with the view to succeeding Patricio when he is ready

We are pretty well stocked at full/wing back and Jonny can’t get passed fit quick enough! I would like to see a new, experienced (not 18) central defender brought in

Joao Moutinho and Leander Dendoncker are 2 midfielders who, I think, are the easiest to upgrade and we need to sort that position out pdq. We can’t rely on O.O fitting in and playing every game.

The attacking midfield and wide forwards area is pretty well stocked but I’d like to see an experienced central attacking midfielder brought in, one who can do the role that Donk is constantly put in of the “box to box link player”. Won’t be cheap but it needs to happen.

As for the forwards, we are looking pretty good when Raul gets back especially if we sign Willian and if Corbeanu can develop further.

So I think we need a Keeper, CB, CM and a Box to Box type player

Sorry that this is in the Palace verdict thread but I’m answering a comment made.

 

[darlowolf64]

As for the game…

I’ve calmed down a little from yesterday and I think that we didn’t play as badly as we have in some previous games but the one thing that is really starting to bug me is a lack of urgency.

We have got ourselves into a rut of just passing around near the opposition area and then we are back with the ball at the half way line (and deeper) with the ball at Coady’s feet. It’s so frustrating!

I think once in the first half yesterday a wing back (Hoever) swung the ball in, first time, but Willian had made a run around the defender to move in front of him. A gamble between the 2 CB’s would have left him with a tap-in. Willian was also happy and able to get the ball deep, hold it up and lay off, then burst into the area only for us to tip-tap around. I know it will come and our players have to adjust to him as much as he has to adjust to them but there were some signs that he may be a good signing. On the two chances he had, one was because of a clever run across the front of a defender and snap shot that the keeper tipped over the bar and the second a good header that the keeper made a really good save to, low to his left. Early signs are promising…

I’m hoping that we will adapt to his style of forward play and not drag him into our current style!

 

[Freddeno]

I keep seeing you write this Fred so…

GK; Rui Patricio, John Ruddy

FB/WB; Ki-Jana Hoever, Nelson Semedo, Marcal, Rayan Ait Nouri, Jonny

CB; Willy Boly, Conor Coady, Max Kilman, Romain Saiss (Donk & Marcal can play here)

Mid; Ruben Neves, Joao Moutinho, Leander Dendoncker (Saiss can play here)

CAM; Morgan Gibbs-White, Vitinha

Wide F; Daniel Podence, Adama Traore, Pedro Neto,

Fwd; Willian Jose, Fabio Silva, Raul Jimenez(inj)

Players who have made the bench/started

Def; Hugo Bueno, Christian Marques, Nigel Lonwijk, Luke Matheson, Lewis Richards

Mid; Luke Cundle, Owen Otasowie*, Taylor Perry, Meritan Shabani,

Fwd; Theo Corbeanu

* A case can be made for Owen to be considered as one of the first XI midfielders now and so we have a “First Team Squad” of 23 plus 9 others that can be considered as live outsiders for the first team so we are hardly at “bare bones” level.

What I will give you though is there must be a question mark over the ability of some of the players listed above. We don’t know if any of the kids are at the required level but we hope at least a few are. We also know that we have reached the stage where the club must seriously look at upgrading some of the first XI.

I’ll say that, for me, we need a keeper that can seriously challenge Rui. John Ruddy keeping a clean sheet against Chorley is no barometer and I’d like to see a young keeper brought in with the view to succeeding Patricio when he is ready

We are pretty well stocked at full/wing back and Jonny can’t get passed fit quick enough!

Joao Moutinho and Leander Dendoncker are 2 midfielders who, I think, are the easiest to upgrade and we need to sort that position out pdq. We can’t rely on O.O fitting in and playing every game.

The attacking midfield and wide forwards area is pretty well stocked but I’d like to see an experienced central attacking midfielder brought in, one who can do the role that Donk is constantly put in of the “box to box link player”. Won’t be cheap but it needs to happen.

As for the forwards, we are looking pretty good when Raul gets back especially if we sign Willian and if Corbeanu can develop further.

Sorry that this is in the Palace verdict thread but I’m answering a comment made.

Mike, I dont think we have a bad squad anyway but its their mentality(to not attack) that scares me..yes you can always upgrade in any position..if i can choose one it would be a more attacking midfielder..but our players are good enough(so many internationals) that they should be able to pass the ball around in one touch rather than passing it with walking football sideways and backwards..

 

[PuntsWolf]

You could extend that back to July and the post lockdown element of last season. Broadly more defensively solid, but defending too deep when we had a lead, few goals and last minute points lost. I do think the lack of crowds has affected us a lot, but we are at the stage now where even if the reason is genuine it cannot be accepted. I was accepting of a win a few, lose a few meh season appreciating that situation, but it's sunk lower than that. Again 'we miss our fans' constantly from Nuno must get into their heads. It's now victim mentality I'm afraid

I did consider going back further as I agree with you, just cba. Even our wins post lockdown 1 were these fine margins/individual quality - Donck leg swinger vs Villa, Raul/Adama West Ham and Bournemouth, Raul quality vs Burnley even though we didn’t win. Everton and Palace were comfortable wins, whether that’s because they didn’t turn up or not you decide.

 

[SSB]

Why Neves was on the bench today. Surprised he was even at the game!

https://twitter.com/x/status/1355649310877245440

She had the baby in Portugal. Supposed he could have FaceTimed the birth from the bench. We are living in strange times.

 

[redvictor]

She had the baby in Portugal. Supposed he could have FaceTimed the birth from the bench. We are living in strange times.

And sad ones. Life is dog shit right now.

 

[redvictor]

Don't think you can divorce the 2 - he's the manager his job is to give them that belief and confidence and he's not exactly exuding it himself

Actually, there is a lot in that. If you are looking to a guy for inspiration then Nuno isn't the guy currently. He looks and sounds mentally fucked.
Someone said about maybe getting in some help. A fresh set of eyes and ears to help Nuno. If you are looking at from in the team who would you go to? Scott Sellars maybe?

 

[Dire Wolf]

And a happy Sunday to you too! I’m just off to slash my wrists as that is beyond depressing.

It is but there is no denying it is pretty accurate.

 

[Paul]

As for the game…

I’ve calmed down a little from yesterday and I think that we didn’t play as badly as we have in some previous games but the one thing that is really starting to bug me is a lack of urgency.

We have got ourselves into a rut of just passing around near the opposition area and then we are back with the ball at the half way line (and deeper) with the ball at Coady’s feet. It’s so frustrating!

My issue is there is 90 minutes of a calculated lack of urgency, as someone had eluded to before how often does Coady ping out diagonal balls anymore, two defenders in the box for a goal kick ? How hard is it to probe for gaps when you've given the opposition 5 minuted to put 10 players in front of you, we were the fastest counter attacking team on the league, we are now easily the slowest

 

[pavlosmacwolf]

I didn't know that Mrs nerves had the baby in Portugal .
Never mind yesterday, how the hell has the guy played at all in the last few weeks with the er indoors being close and miles away?
There are so many things we don't know affecting our players and management right now, but way to go Ruben.
Me, I would have sorted a dodgy pilot and been home in Portugal more than a fortnight ago, and fuck the game of footie.

 

[Mild 'n' Scratchins]

liverpool

runs and hides

Not really for this thread but now I understand...this will piss me off. Big fan of Romain.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

Debunked by David Ornstein and they've just been asking Klopp about a PNE defender on Sky.

So rule nothing out but it doesn't seem likely.

 

[YoungWolf]

A Liverpool fan I know reckons they are signing another centre back tomorrow too.

 

[Tredman]

Davies signing tomorrow from PNE according to Percy.

So no Origi for us, wounder.

 

[The Bear]

Yeah Ben Davies for £2m I heard.