Crystal Palace (H) 2/11: Build-Up & Match Thread

[Wilf Wolf]

I'd assumed Gomes and Lemina being caught up field was down to how they were tasked with playing. I actually think we have some really good options in midfield. Just need GON to work out how to use them.

Where do you see Doyle fitting in?

 

[sycophantia]

Where do you see Doyle fitting in?

As part of a three or to come on as sub to help control the game one way or another. I think all of our CMs can fit together in multiple tactics depending on how we want to play it.

 

[The Bear]

Our CM dilemma is almost like the Gerard/Lampard situation but with defensive players. They can't all play together and pushing one of them forwards to fit them all on the pitch together doesn't work. I hope GON has finally realised that now.

 

[Mel Evo]

From what I’ve seen it’s straightforward to start fixing the midfield ‘puzzle’ by having Andre start as a defensive midfielder and go from there. He’s a cut above. Just seems so obvious. Personally I’d have Gomes next to him then three in front. Cunha in the middle of that 3, probably Sarabia and Gomes on each side (don’t like what I’ve seen of Forbs much to start, we’ve got plenty of other soso options too). JSL up top. The clamour for Doyle does mystify me. Looks OK, but too weak and slow. It’s not like his ability is so great that it compensates - maybe in the Championship. Lots of people just want it to happen because he’s English, I guess.

 

[Deano]

I think our best 2 central midfield players are Andre and Gomes. I don't think he thinks/knows this and I think he will start Doyle for his role in the goal at the weekend and I don't think he wants to drop Lemina with him being captain unless it's forced. Unfortunately unless any of that changes, it is always going to mean someone playing that right hand side of midfield position who's game isn't suited to it.

 

[jd1981]

Well a family member has dropped out for Saturday so I’ve been given the ticket.
Looking again on the website they just aren’t shifting any tickets.

 

[darlowolf64]

Well a family member has dropped out for Saturday so I’ve been given the ticket.
Looking again on the website they just aren’t shifting any tickets.

Oooo, unlucky

 

[Wolftone]

From what I’ve seen it’s straightforward to start fixing the midfield ‘puzzle’ by having Andre start as a defensive midfielder and go from there. He’s a cut above. Just seems so obvious. Personally I’d have Gomes next to him then three in front. Cunha in the middle of that 3, probably Sarabia and Gomes on each side (don’t like what I’ve seen of Forbs much to start, we’ve got plenty of other soso options too). JSL up top. The clamour for Doyle does mystify me. Looks OK, but too weak and slow. It’s not like his ability is so great that it compensates - maybe in the Championship. Lots of people just want it to happen because he’s English, I guess.

Not me. I'd like Doyle in the midfield for his tidyness under pressure, his passing ability and his vision.
He's not very fast admittedly but nor was Moutinho.
Jaoa Gomes has his own attributes similar to Andre.
Lemina is more 'box to box'.
We need to perm two of those three with Doyle imo. Gomes will be suspended sooner or later anyway.

 

[Elephant Pyjamas]

I've been disappointed with J. Gomes this season, I know there are mitigating factors. But still.

 

[Wolftone]

I've been disappointed with J. Gomes this season, I know there are mitigating factors. But still.

Me too. I think he looks frustrated with the way things are going (understandable really).

 

[Mel Evo]

Not me. I'd like Doyle in the midfield for his tidyness under pressure, his passing ability and his vision.
He's not very fast admittedly but nor was Moutinho.
Jaoa Gomes has his own attributes similar to Andre.
Lemina is more 'box to box'.
We need to perm two of those three with Doyle imo. Gomes will be suspended sooner or later anyway.

Bit ridiculous to compare Tommy Doyle to Moutinho. I mean, Riquelme was slow too, but those guys do have the distinction of being world class. No problem with seeing Doyle come on as a sub, but every time you pick him you’re dropping someone of greater ability.

 

[Mel Evo]

I've been disappointed with J. Gomes this season, I know there are mitigating factors. But still.

There is no one GON couldn’t make look ropey the way he sets us up.

 

[Wolftone]

Bit ridiculous to compare Tommy Doyle to Moutinho. I mean, Riquelme was slow too, but those guys do have the distinction of being world class. No problem with seeing Doyle come on as a sub, but every time you pick him you’re dropping someone of greater ability.

I was comparing his speed to Moutinho, bit unfair on Doyle in that regard actually. Obviously I know he's not in the same class. If he was he'd still be at Man City.
He's the best passer of a ball (forward looking) we've got imo. Obviously not sidewsys, that would be Andre probably.

 

[Mel Evo]

I was comparing his speed to Mourinho, bit unfair on Doyle in that regard actually. Obviously I know he's not in the same class. If he was he'd still be at Man City.
He's the best passer of a ball (forward looking) we've got imo. Obviously not sidewsys, that would be Andre probably.

With a following wind you could be making reasonable Will Hughes comparisons (and he’d have some years to do before he proved that) but your withering assessment of Brazils starting defensive midfielder is one you might regret when see where he’s playing in a few years compared to Doyle.

Also, Moutinho was an absolute monster at winning the ball back. Doyle is the opposite, and it’s an issue.

 

[Wolftone]

With a following wind you could be making reasonable Will Hughes comparisons (and he’d have some years to do before he proved that) but your withering assessment of Brazils starting defensive midfielder is one you might regret when see where he’s playing in a few years compared to Doyle.

Also, Moutinho was an absolute monster at winning the ball back. Doyle is the opposite, and it’s an issue.

Not really a withering assessment, that's why I put him in my preferred starting Xl v Palace. He's good at what he does. Win the ball and pass it. Ruben Neves used to do similar. Not much point in discussing past players like him or Moutinho though is it? Not many, if any would get into the peak Nuno team. We have to face facts O'Neil has to utilise the players we've now got. They're not the same level.

 

[ROVERT47]

Me too. I think he looks frustrated with the way things are going (understandable really).

He’ll thrive next season when he’s playing under a decent Coach.

 

[Wilf Wolf]

Doyle’s problem is he is both slow and weak. I remember one instance against Arsenal when Rice just brushed him off and it looked like a schoolboy playing against men. Moutinho was an absolutely superb tackler and was also the best Wolves player I’ve ever seen at judging when to make a tackle and when to drop back. If he committed to the tackle he rarely lost out.

 

[sycophantia]

Don't think Doyle is anywhere near the best option from our current line up of CMs but he is an excellent back up for when we get injuries and suspensions and also when we need to make changes for game management.

 

[Wolftone]

Doyle’s problem is he is both slow and weak. I remember one instance against Arsenal when Rice just brushed him off and it looked like a schoolboy playing against men. Moutinho was an absolutely superb tackler and was also the best Wolves player I’ve ever seen at judging when to make a tackle and when to drop back. If he committed to the tackle he rarely lost out.

Well in any team, you need a blend. What Doyle supposedly lacks in those areas he makes up for with his passing and vision imo. Every player we have has a weakness of one kind or another, that's what we've got, it's why we are next to bottom of the league. If we had the players Arsenal have, we wouldn't be at the bottom of the table.
Recruitment has been woeful. We've got a bigger squad than we had but quality is lacking.
We've played ok in patches but individual errors have let us down and cost us.

 

[Wilf Wolf]

Well in any team, you need a blend. What Doyle supposedly lacks in those areas he makes up for with his passing and vision imo. Every player we have has a weakness of one kind or another, that's what we've got, it's why we are next to bottom of the league. If we had the players Arsenal have, we wouldn't be at the bottom of the table.
Recruitment has been woeful. We've got a bigger squad than we had but quality is lacking.
We've played ok in patches but individual errors have let us down and cost us.

The problem for Doyle is he likes to sit deep where he has time to play his passing game and has options ahead of him. If he’s going to play as one of our deepest midfielders he needs to be able to do the defensive bit as a priority and he can’t. If he’s played further forward the scope for his passing is more limited and we’ve got Cunha there as well.