2024 General Election Thread

[leedswolf]

Who commissioned that piece of work?
Who carried out the research?
What questions were asked of each party and on what issues to place the dots?
How is authoritarian defined and measured against?
Same for left, centre. ,and right?
What evidence is used to back up the dot positions?

There clearly is a case for the left feeling out in the cold with Starmer pushing Labour more central but that sort of half-arsed (if I am being kind) effort does nobody any favours

The Political Compass

The Political Compass: a 2-dimensional typology of political opinions

www.politicalcompass.org

 

[leedswolf]

Any answers to my questions about this research ?

The Political Compass

The Political Compass: a 2-dimensional typology of political opinions

www.politicalcompass.org

 

[leedswolf]

Grim

 

[Kenny]

Just a standard campaign post..



Oh, should mention he is a Tory MP

 

[AndyWolves]

Surely that has to breach some kind of regulations?

 

[Tredman]

it’s against the law. Not that anything will be done.

 

[Tyrannosaurus Dan]

He has a majority of under 600. Hopefully voters tell him to get fucked.

 

[Templeton Peck]

Any answers to my questions about this research ?

Where should Labour be do you think?

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

Centre at worst. It’s a matter of perspective but that graph massively undersells how right wing the conservatives are to make some faux point.

 

[Dire Wolf]

There's absolutely no way this Labour Party is centrist. If you are judging things based on how far to the right the Tories have lurched, and how far right Reform and the other lunatic fringes are, then they are slightly more centre. But based on policies this iteration of Labour is right of centre.

 

[sycophantia]

There's absolutely no way this Labour Party is centrist. If you are judging things based on how far to the right the Tories have lurched, and how far right Reform and the other lunatic fringes are, then they are slightly more centre. But based on policies this iteration of Labour is right of centre.

It's very subjective though isn't it?
Most voters will see themselves as centrist so to Mr/Mrs average voter Labour will be seen as slightly left of centre, Tory slightly right of centre.
I'm not sure the current Tories are that far right, they'd all like to be but know the country as a whole won't go for that.
Thatchers Tory party was quite a bit further right imo.

 

[Tony Towner]

There's absolutely no way this Labour Party is centrist. If you are judging things based on how far to the right the Tories have lurched, and how far right Reform and the other lunatic fringes are, then they are slightly more centre. But based on policies this iteration of Labour is right of centre.

I don't disagree from a historical perspective, but doesn't the centre move over time, though? For example, what would be seen as the centre in America has always been right of where we'd have seen it in the UK. Bernie Sanders is seen as borderline communist over there, whereas against our traditional benchmarks, he'd be seen as a social democrat. Their 'liberal' Democrats are conservative and really soft Tories by comparison.

I'd say by traditional measurements Blair was centre, but if you narrow that down to 79 onwards he'd be on the left and Starmer as far as we know then becomes a centrist.

 

[Tony Towner]

I'm not sure the current Tories are that far right, they'd all like to be but know the country as a whole won't go for that.
Thatchers Tory party was quite a bit further right imo.

I agree re Sunak, but the dogma of a lot of the prominent Tories of the last 5 years Badenoch, Braverman, Truss, Johnson depending on which way the wind blows, is right of the Thatcher administration. That can't be enacted in the same way as there's nothing left to sell or close down. Her politics were driven by a deep belief that what she was doing was correct, (the fucking witch), this lot it's populism and dogwhistle. Lineker was correct when he said some of the language is comparable with 30s Germany.

 

[AndyWolves]

It's all academic anyway, the current system means we only have the choice of two so people only need to pick what they think is the best / least worst option including tactical voting implications.

 

[sycophantia]

I agree re Sunak, but the dogma of a lot of the prominent Tories of the last 5 years Badenoch, Braverman, Truss, Johnson depending on which way the wind blows, is right of the Thatcher administration. That can't be enacted in the same way as there's nothing left to sell or close down. Her politics were driven by a deep belief that what she was doing was correct, (the fucking witch), this lot it's populism and dogwhistle. Lineker was correct when he said some of the language is comparable with 30s Germany.

That's true enough but those you've mentioned have proven they're virtually un electable. As with Corbyn style left politics, most of the country doesn't like extremes.

 

[lemonjelly]

We had a recent discussion on here where it seemed there was consensus regarding the perceived Muslim vote.
I'd argue the same applies to tories/labour etc, in that they too aren't as homogeneous as the discussion suggests. Sure there are borderline far right/ populist tories at the forefront atm, and many brexiteers/euro sceptics. But there are (were?) Tories not in that mold.
Similarly not every labour member is a corbynite/ momentum member etc.
Trends happen over time, & labels get attached to simplify the debate which miss the complexities.

 

[The Saturday Boy]

That's true enough but those you've mentioned have proven they're virtually un electable. As with Corbyn style left politics, most of the country doesn't like extremes.

Most of the country doesn’t like whoever is elected.

 

[Templeton Peck]

Centre at worst. It’s a matter of perspective but that graph massively undersells how right wing the conservatives are to make some faux point.

Labour are nowhere near the centre unfortunately. They've been centre right since about 1987 apart from under Corbyn. Austerity is right wing economics. Thatcherism is right wing economics. If you support much of the current status quo then you're right wing. There's a fag paper between them in policy terms which is reflected in the graph.

 

[Tredman]

That’s a very depressing outlook.

 

[Johnny75]

That’s a very depressing outlook.

When you're so far left everything looks right.