2015 Cricket World Cup Australia/ New Zealand

[Trips]

I don't believe he has the appetite to commit to the county grind which is what he'd need to do to earn his place back - he wouldn't just walk back in having played nothing but T20 cricket (and mostly badly) in 18 months. Moreover I don't think there is room for him in the Test team anyway. Trott might get back in as a makeshift opener for a couple of years purely because we don't have many other candidates and there has been an ongoing vacancy there in effect ever since Strauss retired. Bell bats 4 and Root bats 5 so where is KP meant to be going?

Would he get in the ODI team - yeah, probably. Although he was largely dirt in ODIs for years before he flounced off. But he isn't going to be around in 2019 so really, what is the point.

Not strictly true, averaged over 40 in ODI's across his career. Compares well against Bell (37), Morgan (36), Root (40 exactly), Strauss (35), Cook (36), Collingwood (35). Trott is the only English player with a higher average in ODI's than KP. Also, only Trescothick with more hundreds than KP yet only averaged 37 himself.

Pietersen would need to prove himself in county cricket, and with Surrey being in Division 2 he could easily blast a load of runs at the start of the year against some of the bowling down there. Depends on how serious he is about playing for England again.

The problem with Graves' comments have now ramped up the pressure on Englands batsmen. Following the World Cup we go to WI, before NZ come here and then Ashes this summer. If KP does go and score county runs, anyone failing in either the test or ODI sides will face massive pressure from pundits and public to get KP back in the side

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

He is in the IPL for the start of the county season though, and is also signed up for the Caribbean bash, so is going to find it hard to get county time without sacrificing some moolah. His choice, and it will be interesting to see what he does.

His 40.37 average is a little front loaded I think. The last three years he hasn't been getting near that when fit. And that is the other problem. His knee is pretty shot and I think T20 is probably the only future he has.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

http://www.51allout.co.uk/2012-06-05-pietersen-pieters-out/

He was toss for ages in ODIs.

 

[Trips]

The knee seemed to hold up pretty well during Big Bash. Think he could still offer something to ODI and T20 team but test team has pretty settled batting line-up and am pretty confident in that line-up (except for an opener that KP isn't the man for)

In regards to ODI and T20, is he better than players in the side in the middle order? A definitive yes for me. It will be down to how serious KP is, he'll need to give up IPL and Carribean League. Got a feeling he will give them up and have a go at getting back in.

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

As Dan said above he isn't giving up a huge amount of money by his standards to bin off the IPL. He was picked up on the minimum which I think is £100k.

Down to him to show application in the county game then. Well, firstly, to sign with a county as his contract with Surrey is done. To get recognition he really needs to be in the first division and he is going to prefer staying near London than rocking up in Durham or Taunton.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

I just don't see an end game to putting him back in the ODI team. Is he really still going to be playing at a high level in four years - especially given the graph I put up above showing he was at best, hit and miss in his prime? If not then I see no point.

Root, Buttler and Taylor could be our 4-5-6 for years. Buttler is too low at seven, I want him facing more deliveries.

 

[Trips]

That's a very misleading graph Deutsch, the lowest spikes are one-off games, not really series. All stats like that can be tweaked to prove a point.

His year-on-year average reads

2004 - 104
2005 - 65.33
2006 - 43.71
2007 - 42.33
2008 - 43.86
2009 - 18.85
2010 - 17
2011 - 31.72
2012 - 93.66
2013 - 28.44

Going off these stats he had way more good years than poor ones, saying he was toss for ages is off the mark, and for me averaging over 40 in over 100 ODI's suggest he was good for us more often than he was poor.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

That still says four of his last five years were not very good

 

[Trips]

Ok - point taken.

FWIW, I don't personally want to see him back in the side. Much prefer to go with the side I listed previously with a 3-7 line-up of Taylor-Root-Ali-Stokes-Buttler in the 50 over format. My worry is the media circus that will whip up if he does get some county runs early, and the pressure that could create for the batsmen in both test and ODI sides going into an Ashes summer.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

The media know he creates column inches - always has, even before he played for England - and so they will write about him. We have to trust the incumbent players to be strong enough to ignore it.

For me - I'm leaving Stokes out for now, because the idea of him is better than the reality at the moment, though if he ever gets his act together he'll definitely go in - I'd be looking:

Test:

Cook
Trott
Ballance
Bell
Root
Moeen
Buttler

ODI:

Hales
Roy
Bell
Root
Buttler
Taylor
Moeen

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

I would have Taylor a bit higher in the ODI. Has shown he can be pretty explosive. But that leaves us with the familiar problem of the brutal Buttler getting about forty balls if we are lucky just like now.

Conundrum...

 

[Trips]

They just need to be more flexible with the batting line-up. Other sides will move explosive players up the order if they've made a good start, or when in power-play will move players up for that. We have this reluctance to change the order at all.

Easy in hindsight, but I would of sent Buttler in when Morgan got out against Sri Lanka. We were about 160-4 after about 30ish overs. Perfect time for Buttler to go in and have 20 overs to attack. By having him at 5 he could be coming in after about 10 overs. Yes we need him facing more balls, but we also need him around from overs 35 onward during the fielding restrictions. The key is being flexible enough when we have batted well at the start of an innings to say sit down Morgan, Taylor etc... Buttler needs to go in now. We seem to have a reluctance to change from the plan though.

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

And I lay the blame for that totally with Moores. Intransigent stubborn coach.

 

[Kenny]

Then I blame the chumps that employed Moores again

 

[Donegal Wolf]

Getting a right fucking hammering today, will really fuck up our run rate unless we can salvage something.

 

[FrankMunro-371]

I think that Ireland tried pushing the run rate along, but they lost too many wickets early on.

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

They had no choice chasing such a massive target. Their best bet now is to hang in there for the full fifty overs if possible and try and limit the damage to their net run rate. Windies and Pakistan will be cheering every Irish wicket.

 

[FrankMunro-371]

They had no choice chasing such a massive target. Their best bet now is to hang in there for the full fifty overs if possible and try and limit the damage to their net run rate. Windies and Pakistan will be cheering every Irish wicket.

Agreed Paddy. Though Balbirnie has just been dismissed. A shame as he was batting very well. Ireland will do well to bat through for 50 overs now. Not too much batting left to come.

 

[FrankMunro-371]

Another massive win for South Africa. They have so many top class batsmen that they could take some stopping.

 

[Donegal Wolf]

Result not a surprise but the size of defeat makes things more difficult for us. Big game Saturday against Zimbabwe which is not a gimme either.