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2015 Cricket World Cup Australia/ New Zealand

This is one of lowest depths along with losing to Ireland and the Netherlands, reality is we're so far behind in white ball cricket it's untrue.
We rarely break 300 when batting and think posting 270 is a good total, we can't bowl at the death and can't bowl Yorkers or full deliveries.
The best players in one day cricket generally get good practice in the IPL and some in the big bash none of ours do.
The cricket we play went out of fashion 10 years ago.
 
Tend to agree, while we continue to prefer the staus quo,( i:e the five day game), the rest of the world is moving on and leaving us behind.
 
Simple would be to bin tours in early spring to allow our best one day players to play in the IPL at least, between the end of the World Cup and start of the ashes we have to tour the West Indies for one day games and a test series, then play two test at home against New Zealand plus a one day series.
Seems a lot of cricket there that could be binned off in the April time and playing New Zealand at home seems pointless, if players needs practice prior to the ashes make them play 4 day county cricket.
 
Depends whether you think test cricket is king. Losing tests to allow our players to play corrupt toy cricket in India is not the way to go
 
Tend to agree, while we continue to prefer the staus quo,( i:e the five day game), the rest of the world is moving on and leaving us behind.
We play a similar amount of test cricket as the Aussies. The difference is because they are in the Southern Hemisphere their calendar allows them to play in the IPL. I'm not sure how many of our players would get picked up in the auction even if they were made available anyway. Hales for instance didn't get picked up this time, Bopara and Morgan are in as squad fillers who will barely play. Buttler probably would get selected, but that would be about it, Moeen wouldn't be picked due to his background.

I hate the idea of one day franchises, but for the good of the national team perhaps an 8 team T20 league with 4 international players similar to the Big Bash may be the way forwards. The difference is in Australia that involves increasing the number of teams from State cricket whereas here we would more more than halving and all State players get to play in the tournament whilst only around a third of County players will. Therefore I don't see it happening.
 
Depends whether you think test cricket is king. Losing tests to allow our players to play corrupt toy cricket in India is not the way to go

And that's the kind of 90's thinking that permeates through the ECB. A complete change of thinking is needed and we must realize that all 3 forms now have parity.
 
There'll always be interest in the Ashes both here and in Australia but as was seen by the visit of India last year there's not a lot of appetite left for the 5 day game amongst them.

The irony is i was in Australia when Australia played New Zealand in their inaugural twenty/twenty game, they were both taking the piss out of it and the general consensus was that it would never catch on.

The beast that was invented in this Country has well and truly fucked us up.
 
And that's the kind of 90's thinking that permeates through the ECB. A complete change of thinking is needed and we must realize that all 3 forms now have parity.

They don't, unless you are the BCCI
 
The fact is that the rest of the world views white ball cricket just much an equal as red ball cricket, I know most of us traditionalist won't like it but it's fact and we have to move with the times.
We have to find a way of accommodating the one day forms just as much as test cricket.
IMO the T/20 bash we have is crap and of poor quality compared to the IPL and Big Bash and drags on far to long.
But the ECB and Counties will never agree to having 8-10 team franchise based at all the test arena.
The prehistoric stand point of the ECB will always hold England back.
 
The problem is the scheduling of the IPL which causes maximum disruption to English cricket. A big 2 fingers from the BCCI. But that is done.

Simple fact is we won't be improving the players for the Ashes in English conditions by letting them have a highly paid thrash on Indian dust-bowls. Equally, binning 10 50-over games (or however many it is) against West Indies and New Zealand in order to play the other form of the game isn't going to improve our 50 over success rate.

First things first though - get rid of that abject failure Moores, admit appointing Morgan was an appalling decision and reverse it. Get Root as one-day captain. Put Taylor back where he belongs at three. Tell the bowlers that short-pitched bowling as an only weapon went out of fashion when Curtley Ambrose retired and get them watching video of Wasim Akram and Waqar Younis.
 
I think a lot skills and shots we see in the 50 over game have come from players who have had experienced 20 over cricket. ie Mcullum, Warner and Finch.
It's all about taking the attack to the bowler straight off, where as we go into survival mode early in an innings which is why struggle to make 300 regulary.
 
They don't, unless you are a blinkered member of the ECB

Fixed for you.

It is time we accept that the other forms of the game are seen as equals around the world and a blinkered la,la,la,la, I can't hear you approach solves nothing. I agree with you on Moores, tactics and Morgan and that change can only come from the top. Fraser's insistence that Morgan is the best ODI captain available to England shows we have a paucity of ability and player identification at the top level. Time for the old brass to shuffle off.
 
I think a complete re-build is definitely needed and a clean out of a lot of the buffoons could only do good. Going back to Moores was a huge backward step. Binning Cook because of abject form and then parachuting in the only player in worse form was frankly ridiculous.

I am not sure that necessarily playing more t20 than the players get domestically in the counties is the answer. Making the overall quality of the games better will be key. And that is difficult to do when the better players are kept away from their counties and cricket outside the England set up for most of the summer by their central contracts. That is a thorny issue that I don't know how we solve. Our t20 competition serves for getting good overseas players in nick against weak county attacks. Not sure what benefit that has for England at all.
 
I'd agree with all of that Paddy, we need to make our T20 competition better and our One Day competition better. If that is at the expense of having divisions like baseball where the players play for defined periods with a knockout system at the end then that may work better than the old fashioned cup competitions or the mess that is our T20.

Of course much of this comes down to coaching and that needs work as well. I agree we can only do that with a new broom.
 
Bit late on everything as I'm only just watching highlights now. Absolute disgusting performance. Ignore the batting, that was poor, but there was some good bowling in there some players a tad unlucky. But our bowling... Literally WTF.

We weren't even blowing short. It was back of a length, hit me trash. When there's only two out the circle, you literally can't get out to that if you flash hard at it. So don't bowl it. Then we bowl some more hit me bullshit. Just slot half volleys which any player is going to hit (again especially as there is no one outside the circle down the ground).

Embarrassing
 
Finn's figures! Wondering what must be in worse shape after that. Finn's confidence or the ball!
 
The batting was poor, the bowling would have graced a sunday village team, and the body language of the players said it all. So much then for the new start. KP gone, Cook gone, but we are no better. Unless there is a big improvement then Scotland might just spring a surprise.
 
The losses to Australia and New Zealand were the 12th and 13th times in their past 19 one-day internationals that England have been bowled out – a run that stretches back to the start of the Sri Lanka series last May. All 13 matches ended in defeat, while a score above 300 has been achieved just once during that time.


How damning is that?
 
How damning is that?

I think it says it all and shows where the biggest problem is. While our bowlers do not always bowl as they should, the sad fact is that they rarely have the opportunity to attack the batsmen. Trying to defend sub standard totals is extremely difficult, yet our bowlers are having to try to do so on a regular basis.
 
Half the time the bowlers have been so poor that the batsman have to throw the bat at it to try and get to a massive total, and we get skittled.
 
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