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Ukraine

Walshes Wolves said:
For me, Ukraine is Europe's Iraq. Everyone has an ulterior motive and are in it for gain and the people of Ukraine pay the ultimate price.
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It's being sacrificed so that trump can further his relationship with Russia.

I'm not sure what this means for Europe but it does seem like the US are prioritising their relationship with Russia over their relationship with Europe, which just seems odd to me.
 
I can understand wanting a peaceful resolution but doing a complete 180 turn on Ukraine just seems a very uncomfortable and immoral thing to do.
Russia and America sorting their differences would usually be a good thing this however has real underlying dark side to it.
When Putin and Trump are out of office where do things stand then?
Similar to the Cold War Europe is left in the middle of 2 super powers and being divided itself.
 
For me it's more about isolationism than being pro Russia. America spends billions on the defence of Europe, millions don't understand why / care. Russia isn't invading them so it's not relevant. Saving that money to spend 'on our own' will be popular with a country which just elected him. It'll go on tax cuts for the rich, but that's another argument.
 
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AndyWolves said:
It's being sacrificed so that trump can further his relationship with Russia.

I'm not sure what this means for Europe but it does seem like the US are prioritising their relationship with Russia over their relationship with Europe, which just seems odd to me.
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Russia have already said Ukraine can join Europe. The UK, EU and US , supported the overthrowing of the Russian supporting Ukrainian President.
Many European and British politicians made it very obvious they wanted to stop Trump becoming President and some political parties directly interfered in the US elections. The problem is, Trump is now the President and is now taking his revenge.He is an idiot, but a powerful idiot and I worry about what the future beholds
I believe the big test will be with old soviet block countries, that are now in the EU. When they have elections and the people vote for a Russian supporting leader and the west interfere by saying the result doesn't stand, there could be very serious consequences. The likelihood of civil war in those countries has increased and the danger will be if the west intervenes. The Russian supporting people in those countries will look at Russia's success against Ukraine and this will be a very dangerous situation. Countries that are now in NATO, but with a Russian supporting President is a recipe for disaster.
 
Pretty much everything they've 'spent' on Ukraine was already sunk cost anyway surely? Stockpiled older equipment that was sitting in a desert doing nothing.
 
It's admirable that Donald Trump is going back to those traditional American values pioneered by the likes of Al Capone, running Foreign Policy and aid along the lines of protection rackets!

"Give us your mineral rights or you never know what might happen..."
 
Unilaterally invading another country is not just 'going too far'.

That's if we ignore them snaffling part of Crimea years before that. Which I'm fairly sure Johnson for one waved away as just one of those things.

They're not very good at hiding that they're in various ways in hock to Putin.
 
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