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Tomorrow's fans parliament

Can somebody bung a link or c+p the letter? I've never had much to do with MM so don't know just how bad they are.
 
Lincs_Wolf said:
Can somebody bung a link or c+p the letter? I've never had much to do with MM so don't know just how bad they are.
Click to expand...

 
A STATEMENT FROM SUPPORTERS ON MOLINEUX MIX WEBSITE (THE LARGEST UNOFFICIAL WOLVES WEBSITE) TO THE OWNER AND MANAGERS OF WOLVERHAMPTON WANDERERS FC.

Supporters are renowned for their fickleness. After a defeat everything is terrible and all club officials should be sacked. After a victory the manager is a tactical genius and the Board are not so bad after all.

In the light of the above we want to make it clear that the following is not some kind of knee-jerk response after a poor beginning to the season. It represents a cry of genuine concern as to where the club is going.

There has been an ongoing debate as to what direction the club is taking and why there has been so little success over so many years. The two recent successive relegations were a disaster and pretty shameful but there is no need to dwell on these. Mr. Jackett was appointed and a swift recovery was achieved back to what many of us still prefer to call the second division. Optimism was re-ignited.

Last season went pretty well and we just missed out on the top six. However all along there was a feeling that the club, not for the first time, had wasted the summer transfer window and not recruited well or with any ambition. The purchase of Afobe last January at last seemed to break this impression of poor planning and minimal investment and on the back of his goals the season panned out quite well although the overall impression was still of a wasted opportunity. Nevertheless it was appreciated by many that the 'bomb squad' wages had drained financial resources. That excuse has now almost completely vanished however.

The summer saw the loss of our best player Sako for nothing. The CEO indicated the club knew it had to replace him and that sufficient money would be invested. That promise was never kept. We landed up with Ojo a very promising 18 year old Liverpool reserve as a left wing option but clearly not a player who could be expected to fill the very big hole left by Sako's departure. So taking that alone the team was already substantially weaker.

Coady was brought in for a reported £2m - £1.6m more than he had been available for the previous summer. Wallace was added to the squad for a reported £275,000.


Le Fondre and Martinez were brought in on loan. More recently the sale of Stearman to Fulham was surprisingly announced "for football reasons". Puzzling for many of us since Batth was still out injured and the two centre back replacements were very young and inexperienced. The only back up was Iorfa.

It was hard to see how the sale of Stearman strengthened our promotion hopes. Clearly it weakened them. Meanwhile it seemed Van La Parra was to be sold too with Byrne from Swindon replacing him as a right winger. Van La Parra's move collapsed. This completed the transfer activity with the club failing at the last moment to find a replacement for Dicko.

So looked at overall the core of our quite successful team of last season had been torn away. Stearman, Dicko and Sako with Batth out through injury also. Ikeme dropped. None of that core of experienced players have been satisfactorily replaced with senior players. All replacements bar Le Fondre are young and inexperienced. And yet the club would claim presumably that it is serious about pushing for promotion. It just does not add up.

The club obviously emphasises the investment in the Academy and point to some of the encouraging youth products. However no one in their right mind would suggest that the club can rely almost solely on the Academy to provide a squad that can get us promoted, never mind established in the Premiership. Clearly there is a balance that has to be struck between genuine investment in external players that add value and the introduction of young players.

The majority of us feel that the club has got that balance wrong and that it will cost us badly. In our last season of parachute payments it was not unreasonable to expect the club to make at least three serious investments in quality players as a very minimum. One of them should have been Sako's replacement.

That has not happened. In addition it seems our wage structure is such that it is almost impossible to bring in better players even if a fee might be negotiated. The manager recently claimed he was not restricted to a £2m transfer cap for any player he wished to bring in. However, if that is true the struggles the club seem to have in getting good players to come to us must focus mainly on not being able to match market wage expectations. If there is no flexibility on that front then running around after better players is a waste of time surely. It would explain why the club tends to get outmuscled by others. A club of Wolves size and standing should surely be able and willing to compete for the best players available at Championship level.

The excuse that it is hard to recruit such players that are better than what we have is often trotted out by the club. It is beginning to wear very thin indeed when we look at the activities of our rivals both at home and abroad in strengthening their squads. Of course there is no guarantee that such investment will lead to promotion. But to lose your better players (either transferred or injured) and depend on 18 year olds is hardly a recipe for success either. In the case of someone like Sako the club has had an enormous amount of time to prepare for his departure. The injury to Dicko was predictable and yet no fourth striker was signed to ensure proper back up over the rigours of a long, hard season.
An injury to our two fit strikers now would immediately create a crisis, equally if one of our two young centre backs was laid low. If you look at our main rivals they have far stronger squads and have made some excellent signings this summer.

Many of us are more worried that we might get caught up at the wrong end of the table rather than be competing for promotion. That is ridiculous when you consider the progress in the last two years. And yet the feeling most of us get is that our owner is not willing to invest sufficient funds into the club to give us a fighting chance of promotion. We do not believe that a major spending spree like Derby's is required. But we do need perhaps £5m or so to be invested in the first team on perhaps a couple of players. That is not unreasonable when you consider the vast sums being bandied around even in the Championship. The Premiership is obviously literally in another financial league. But if the club doesn’t make a more serious go at strengthening that league will forever remain out of reach. The rewards of promotion are extraordinary nowadays and that is why we cannot understand the club's weak response this summer to meeting the obvious needs in the team.

Regrettably we can see a scenario developing where the club at best stagnates in the second division for many years. That will result in the loss of our best players. Perhaps Afobe as early as next January. Many of our brighter young talents the following season? The fact is that not only have we fallen way behind clubs of comparative and even smaller size like Swansea, West Brom, Stoke, Crystal Palace, Southampton etc. but are now in danger of falling behind the likes of Derby, Middlesbrough, Fulham and other similar clubs which are showing a far hungrier approach to promotion than our club. We repeat that we know spending lots of money on players doesn't guarantee anything. But sometimes serious money has to be spent on key positions to allow a team to take a step forward. The truth is that our current squad is not good enough for promotion. The club will of course deny this. If we are proved wrong we will of course be delighted to eat humble pie. But if we are right then what? No more parachute money; the sale of Afobe and our other better players to make the books balance. How can that be a recipe for success?

Frankly, many of us were amazed that more heads did not roll after two successive relegations. The buck has to stop somewhere when a club of Wolves’ potential achieves so little over such a long time. Three successive seasons in the Premiership should have acted as a springboard for greater things (although every one of those seasons was simply a desperate struggle for survival) and yet the club has collapsed into their default position of second division also rans. Is that good enough for the owner? How can that add up financially never mind in any other way? The depressing thing for many of us is that we can't see this pattern of failure, which should be honestly faced up to, changing as things stand. A half-baked stadium and a half-baked team do not inspire confidence. The Academy is excellent but without broader ambition the club will land up simply acting as a feeder club for more successful rivals like....West Brom.

We generally have faith in our current manager. Like most managers he has to say he is happy with what he has got. But our own feeling is that he is not getting the financial backing he needs. If that is not the case and substantial funds are available for fees and wages then our recruitment department under Mr. Thelwell needs to come under the microscope.

Overall our feeling is that the club is aiming too low. Yes it takes time to develop a youth policy and for that to have an impact. But proper investment in the first team is still necessary. Everything depends on what happens on the pitch. The club has underperformed for so many years and it is time to have a good look in the mirror. Are current policies leading to the creation of a club that will be able to establish itself in the Premiership over the next three or four years? We think not. In fact the danger is that supporter apathy will increase, crowd numbers will diminish and the financial picture seriously deteriorate. Who will then pick up the bills?

ADDENDUM: SOME EXTRACTS OF POSTS TAKEN FROM THE FORUM SPECIFICALLY RELATED TO THE STATEMENT;

· I’ve had enough, Morgan’s keeping his money and I am going to keep mine, my first game was 1967 season ticket holder 30 years I love this football club but I’m losing the enthusiasm with every passing week….I think there is a supporter backlash coming.

· As a season ticket holder for over 20 years what will they do to encourage me to renew next season as what I've witnessed with the complete and utter lack of ambition this last 6 months will mean 2 less season ticket holders next year as I won’t renew.

· Support is falling away and another bad season, which this looks like it could be, will be the final straw for many fans I believe, who are fed up with the 'jam tomorrow' message when our support is being taken for granted.


· How they can say they have invested to give us the best possible chance of promotion is a ridiculous statement when everyone can see we are far far weaker than last season.

· Recruitment has generally been poor the past 2 years. Afobe was an excellent purchase. ALF looks like a good loan signing, and a few need more time. The vast majority have looked like poor bargain bin signings done on the cheap... and it shows. We saw Brentford leapfrog us last year despite totally outclassing them a year before.

· What specifically was the ' Football reason' for letting Stearman leave, given the dangers of a defence which will make inexperienced mistakes and lose more points than necessary in this supposedly promotion campaign?

· He can stick his head in the sand......the vast majority at the match today feel exactly the same way as MolMix.....there were many quiet moments when I was singing on my own...

I know where you are coming from. But Mr. Moxey takes the view that a few hundred posters on football forums is not a representative amount compared to season tickets sold.

· My biggest grief is that there seems to be no communication by the club.
I would be happy if someone came out and said that we want promotion but we will do it the long way with producing young players and creating a great young and hungry team. At the moment there is no communication at all. They sell Stearman, call it 'football reasons' and we have to build the truth behind it by ourselves.

· It is the view of many who post on the Molineux Mix forum that the club is being sold short and not being given the professional attention needed to do it justice in returning it to a more prominent place in the English game, something the entire management team has stated they are working towards.

· I have been going to the Southbank since I was eight...I am now 56 that's just shy of 50 years...I have a home season ticket, an away season ticket....and I feel conned
Next season....I will not be going Early Bird
I will wait and see what the ambition is first.....nearly fifty years and this is how I feel..
 
I'm going to rip into that later when I'm back home. Point by point. Stay tuned.
 
Deutsch Wolf said:
Blame Brendan Rodgers and his lunatic substitutions for letting us back in the Swansea game.

TC was in charge for the 0-5 at Fulham, honestly the worst performance ever. I've seen us lose 0-5 at home to Barnsley, I've seen us lose at Barnet, I've seen Hoddle teams have no shots and no attacks. But that was the worst.
Click to expand...

It was live on Sky super Sunday too, I had just finished a bad shift at work and toddled off to the pub on my own to watch that abomination. Couldn't believe it. Left before finishing my last pint, it was that bad a game!
 
Paddingtonwolf said:
It really is a load of reactionary fucking bollocks.
Click to expand...

A few questions do need to be asked (the whole point of the fans parliament surely?) but the windmilling is a bit OTT. They're not the Oystons, no need to break out the bed sheets and felt tip pens just yet.
 
Lycan said:
A few questions do need to be asked (the whole point of the fans parliament surely?) but the windmilling is a bit OTT. They're not the Oystons, no need to break out the bed sheets and felt tip pens just yet.
Click to expand...

Don't assume they've worked out how to take the lids off the pens.

They have until Saturday. The clock is ticking.....
 
He has far more of a fringe than I do.
 
A STATEMENT FROM SUPPORTERS ON MOLINEUX MIX WEBSITE (THE LARGEST UNOFFICIAL WOLVES WEBSITE BIG FUCKING DEAL) TO THE OWNER AND MANAGERS OF WOLVERHAMPTON WANDERERS FC.

Supporters are renowned for their fickleness. After a defeat everything is terrible and all club officials should be sacked. After a victory the manager is a tactical genius and the Board are not so bad after all. WELL DONE ON SPOTTING WHY MOLINEUX MIX IS PILE OF GARBAGE AT THE BEST OF TIMES AND UNREADABLE AT ALL OTHERS

In the light of the above we want to make it clear that the following is not some kind of knee-jerk response after a poor beginning to the season. It represents a cry of genuine concern as to where the club is going. OH REALLY?

There has been an ongoing debate as to what direction the club is taking and why there has been so little success over so many years. The two recent successive relegations were a disaster and pretty shameful but there is no need to dwell on these. Mr. Jackett was appointed and a swift recovery was achieved back to what many of us still prefer to call the second division. Optimism was re-ignited. SO MANY YEARS. SO ABOUT FOUR AS WE WERE TOP FLIGHT BEFORE THEN. GLAD TO SEE THE OPTIMISM RETURN.

Last season went pretty well and we just missed out on the top six. YES However all along there was a feeling that the club, not for the first time, had wasted the summer transfer window and not recruited well or with any ambition. WAS THERE?The purchase of Afobe last January WHICH IS OUTSIDE THE SUMMER WINDOW TO WHICH YOU ARE TRYING TO REFER at last seemed to break this impression of poor planning and minimal investment £2M BY THE WAY - MIGHT WANT TO LOOK HOW MUCH SOLBAKKEN WAS GIVEN TO SPEND THE SUMMER WE WERE RELEGATED. AS A CLUE IT WAS ABOUT 7 BENIK AFOBESand on the back of his goals the season panned out quite well although the overall impression was still of a wasted opportunity REALLY? WE GOT RECORD POINTS TO NOT MAKE THE PLAYOFFS.. Nevertheless it was appreciated by many that the 'bomb squad' wages had drained financial resources. That excuse has now almost completely vanished however. THIS IS PROBABLY FAIR ENOUGH - A LOT OF THE WAGE BILL HAS BEEN REDUCED AND SHOULD CLEAR SOME BUDGET

The summer saw the loss of our best player Sako for nothing HARDLY A SHOCK - AND IF WE HAD SOLD HIM FOR £4M IN THE SUMMER, OR THE JANUARY BEFORE I AM SURE MOLINEUX MIX WOULD HAVE PRAISED THE BOARD FOR GETTING THE CASH The CEO indicated the club knew it had to replace him and that sufficient money would be invested. AGREED MOXEY SHOULD NEVER HAVER SAID THAT IT WAS DUMB That promise was never kept. We landed up with Ojo a very promising 18 year old Liverpool reserve as a left wing option but clearly not a player who could be expected to fill the very big hole left by Sako's departure MIGHT WANT TO CHECK LIVERPOOL OPINIONS ON OJO. So taking that alone the team was already substantially weaker.

Coady was brought in for a reported £2m - £1.6m more than he had been available for the previous summer.WHEN WE DIDN'T NEED HIM Wallace was added to the squad for a reported £275,000. GOOD BUSINESS


Le Fondre and Martinez were brought in on loan. GOOD BUSINESSMore recently the sale of Stearman to Fulham was surprisingly announced "for football reasons". Puzzling for many of us since Batth was still out injured and the two centre back replacements were very young and inexperienced. The only back up was Iorfa. STEARMAN WHO MOLINEUX MIX SPENT THE LAST EIGHT YEARS REFERRING TO AS A RICKETT A MATCH WAITING TO HAPPEN. PERSONALLY I WOULD HAVE HELD ON BUT WE HAVE GOT GOOD MONEY AND HAUSE AND EEL WITH BATTH NEED TO BE THE FUTURE

It was hard to see how the sale of Stearman strengthened our promotion hopes. Clearly it weakened them. WELL DONE MYSTIC MEG.Meanwhile it seemed Van La Parra was to be sold too with Byrne from Swindon replacing him as a right winger. Van La Parra's move collapsed. This completed the transfer activity with the club failing at the last moment to find a replacement for Dicko. WE BID MILLIONS FOR A DICKO REPLACEMENT LATE ON BECAUSE HIS INJURY OCCURRED WITH 48 HOURS OF THE WINDOW LEFT. VAN LA PARRA STAYED BECAUSE OF THAT INJURY. NOT PERFECT BUT PERFECTLY UNDERSTANDABLE.

So looked at overall the core of our quite successful team of last season had been torn away. Stearman, Dicko and Sako with Batth out through injury also. Ikeme dropped. None of that core of experienced players have been satisfactorily replaced with senior players. All replacements bar Le Fondre are young and inexperienced. And yet the club would claim presumably that it is serious about pushing for promotion. It just does not add up. WE HAVE SAID WE ARE GOING FOR ACADEMY AND YOUTH. OF COURSE IT ADDS UP.

The club obviously emphasises the investment in the Academy and point to some of the encouraging youth products. However no one in their right mind would suggest that the club can rely almost solely on the Academy to provide a squad that can get us promoted, never mind established in the Premiership. Clearly there is a balance that has to be struck between genuine investment in external players that add value and the introduction of young players. YES - BALANCE IS THE WAY. AGREED

The majority of us feel that the club has got that balance wrong and that it will cost us badly. In our last season of parachute payments it was not unreasonable to expect the club to make at least three serious investments in quality players as a very minimum. One of them should have been Sako's replacement. WE BOUGHT COADY, WE BOUGHT WALLACE, WE BOUGHT BYRNE. THREE INVESTMENTS. HOW SERIOUS? JOHNSON AND O'HARA SERIOUS?

That has not happened. In addition it seems our wage structure is such that it is almost impossible to bring in better players even if a fee might be negotiated. The manager recently claimed he was not restricted to a £2m transfer cap for any player he wished to bring in. However, if that is true the struggles the club seem to have in getting good players to come to us must focus mainly on not being able to match market wage expectations. If there is no flexibility on that front then running around after better players is a waste of time surely. It would explain why the club tends to get outmuscled by others. A club of Wolves size and standing should surely be able and willing to compete for the best players available at Championship level. YOU KNOW ABSOLUTELY NOTHING ABOUT THE CLUB'S WAGE STRUCTURE. HOWEVER, YOU HAVE DECIDED IT MUST BE THE REASON. WELL PLAYED ON THAT.

The excuse that it is hard to recruit such players that are better than what we have is often trotted out by the club. It is beginning to wear very thin indeed when we look at the activities of our rivals both at home and abroad in strengthening their squads. Of course there is no guarantee that such investment will lead to promotion. But to lose your better players (either transferred or injured) and depend on 18 year olds is hardly a recipe for success either. In the case of someone like Sako the club has had an enormous amount of time to prepare for his departure. The injury to Dicko was predictable and yet no fourth striker was signed to ensure proper back up over the rigours of a long, hard season. HOW THE HELL WAS DICKO'S INJURY PREDICTABLE? I MEAN SERIOUSLY LISTEN TO HOW STUPID THAT SOUNDS.
An injury to our two fit strikers now would immediately create a crisis, equally if one of our two young centre backs was laid low. If you look at our main rivals they have far stronger squads and have made some excellent signings this summer. HAVE THEY?

Many of us are more worried that we might get caught up at the wrong end of the table rather than be competing for promotion. That is ridiculous when you consider the progress in the last two years. And yet the feeling most of us get is that our owner is not willing to invest sufficient funds into the club to give us a fighting chance of promotion. We do not believe that a major spending spree like Derby's is required. But we do need perhaps £5m or so to be invested in the first team on perhaps a couple of players. That is not unreasonable when you consider the vast sums being bandied around even in the Championship. The Premiership is obviously literally in another financial league. But if the club doesn’t make a more serious go at strengthening that league will forever remain out of reach. The rewards of promotion are extraordinary nowadays and that is why we cannot understand the club's weak response this summer to meeting the obvious needs in the team. HONESTLY I DON'T EVEN KNOW WHERE TO BEGIN WITH THIS NONSENSE.

Regrettably we can see a scenario developing where the club at best stagnates in the second division for many years. That will result in the loss of our best players. Perhaps Afobe as early as next January. Many of our brighter young talents the following season? The fact is that not only have we fallen way behind clubs of comparative and even smaller size like Swansea, West Brom, Stoke, Crystal Palace, Southampton etc. but are now in danger of falling behind the likes of Derby, Middlesbrough, Fulham and other similar clubs which are showing a far hungrier approach to promotion than our club. We repeat that we know spending lots of money on players doesn't guarantee anything. But sometimes serious money has to be spent on key positions to allow a team to take a step forward. The truth is that our current squad is not good enough for promotion. The club will of course deny this. If we are proved wrong we will of course be delighted to eat humble pie. But if we are right then what? No more parachute money; the sale of Afobe and our other better players to make the books balance. How can that be a recipe for success? AGAIN UTTER BOLLOCKS FROM FIRST WORD TO LAST

Frankly, many of us were amazed that more heads did not roll after two successive relegations. The buck has to stop somewhere when a club of Wolves’ potential achieves so little over such a long time. Three successive seasons in the Premiership should have acted as a springboard for greater things (although every one of those seasons was simply a desperate struggle for survival) and yet the club has collapsed into their default position of second division also rans. Is that good enough for the owner? How can that add up financially never mind in any other way? The depressing thing for many of us is that we can't see this pattern of failure, which should be honestly faced up to, changing as things stand. A half-baked stadium and a half-baked team do not inspire confidence. The Academy is excellent but without broader ambition the club will land up simply acting as a feeder club for more successful rivals like....West Brom. THE LAST SENTENCE IS PATHETIC. WHEN DID WE LAST SELL A PLAYER TO THE ALBION.

We generally have faith in our current manager. Like most managers he has to say he is happy with what he has got. But our own feeling is that he is not getting the financial backing he needs. If that is not the case and substantial funds are available for fees and wages then our recruitment department under Mr. Thelwell needs to come under the microscope. AGAIN - PROOF?

Overall our feeling is that the club is aiming too low. Yes it takes time to develop a youth policy and for that to have an impact. But proper investment in the first team is still necessary. Everything depends on what happens on the pitch. The club has underperformed for so many years and it is time to have a good look in the mirror. Are current policies leading to the creation of a club that will be able to establish itself in the Premiership over the next three or four years? We think not. In fact the danger is that supporter apathy will increase, crowd numbers will diminish and the financial picture seriously deteriorate. Who will then pick up the bills? UNDER MORGAN WE SPENT MORE YEARS IN THE TOP FLIGHT THAN WE HAVE SINCE THE EARLY EIGHTIES. SUCH UNDERPERFORMANCE. FICKLE WAS MENTIONED IN PARA ONE. SO TRUE.

ADDENDUM: SOME EXTRACTS OF POSTS TAKEN FROM THE FORUM SPECIFICALLY RELATED TO THE STATEMENT;

· I’ve had enough, Morgan’s keeping his money and I am going to keep mine, my first game was 1967 season ticket holder 30 years I love this football club but I’m losing the enthusiasm with every passing week….I think there is a supporter backlash coming.

· As a season ticket holder for over 20 years what will they do to encourage me to renew next season as what I've witnessed with the complete and utter lack of ambition this last 6 months will mean 2 less season ticket holders next year as I won’t renew.

· Support is falling away and another bad season, which this looks like it could be, will be the final straw for many fans I believe, who are fed up with the 'jam tomorrow' message when our support is being taken for granted.


· How they can say they have invested to give us the best possible chance of promotion is a ridiculous statement when everyone can see we are far far weaker than last season.

· Recruitment has generally been poor the past 2 years. Afobe was an excellent purchase. ALF looks like a good loan signing, and a few need more time. The vast majority have looked like poor bargain bin signings done on the cheap... and it shows. We saw Brentford leapfrog us last year despite totally outclassing them a year before.

· What specifically was the ' Football reason' for letting Stearman leave, given the dangers of a defence which will make inexperienced mistakes and lose more points than necessary in this supposedly promotion campaign?

· He can stick his head in the sand......the vast majority at the match today feel exactly the same way as MolMix.....there were many quiet moments when I was singing on my own...

I know where you are coming from. But Mr. Moxey takes the view that a few hundred posters on football forums is not a representative amount compared to season tickets sold.

· My biggest grief is that there seems to be no communication by the club.
I would be happy if someone came out and said that we want promotion but we will do it the long way with producing young players and creating a great young and hungry team. At the moment there is no communication at all. They sell Stearman, call it 'football reasons' and we have to build the truth behind it by ourselves.

· It is the view of many who post on the Molineux Mix forum that the club is being sold short and not being given the professional attention needed to do it justice in returning it to a more prominent place in the English game, something the entire management team has stated they are working towards.

· I have been going to the Southbank since I was eight...I am now 56 that's just shy of 50 years...I have a home season ticket, an away season ticket....and I feel conned
Next season....I will not be going Early Bird
I will wait and see what the ambition is first.....nearly fifty years and this is how I feel..

AND THIS ADDENDUM IS A LOAD OF UTTER ME ME ME ME HORSESHIT
 
That letter is embarrassing, reality check required for the numpty that prepared this.
So many contradictions, guess work and false statements.
Problem is a lot will read this and start latching onto its OTT bollocks.
Doesn't help that certain local media outlet sees things in a very similar manor to this letter.
 
In my honest opinion there should be a point of order motion tomorrow. That letter shouldn't be read out. It will take too long. BUT - it is an open letter from a forum with a large readership and it should it be appended in full to the minutes of the meeting and form part of the record. It should be taken as read, and then the content should be debated. It doesn't need to be read out.
 
I disagree. Giving dangerous idiots the oxygen of publicity is a gas canister waiting to blow. They can swivel eye their own way to oblivion thank you very much, they don't represent me.
 
I look forward to seeing what happens when the Mix rep tries to start reading it.
 
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