The 2015/2016 Summer Improvement Thread

[Deleted Cyber]

What the hell has that got to do with it?

I am sorry. I was talking about experience at the highest level being of value earlier in the thread hence my squad inexperience point. I thought you had seen that. That is why I made the comment. He is not experienced at the highest level. Hennesey in 2008 was. Hahnemann was

 

[Alan]

I wonder how many first team players (read: players legitimately in contention for minutes) we've sold compared to other Championship teams over the past two or three years. My guess is that we're doing pretty damn good in comparison.

 

[Jolemai]

They shouldn't have sold Stearman with DB still injured. They had over a year to replace Sako. While other teams who want to get promoted are spending millions on experienced proven players, we are scraping div 1, to see if we can buy someone cheap, who becomes worth his weight in gold.
Of course I am happy, we are using our young players, but at the moment, it stinks that we are doing things on the cheap and showing no ambition. That to me, is taking Wolves fans for a ride.

Cheers for the reply. Supposedly Baath will be back in the squad for our next game. As for Sako, whilst it could be down to a failure of our recruiting team, could it not simply be that there is no one suitable (and by suitable I mean affordable) at the present time? Who do you feel we should have realistically gone for? Similarly, who of these experience players costing millions (that we may or may not have) should we have gone for that would make that much a difference?

Apparently, Wolves try to "live within their means". Just because we're attempting to do exist without entering debt or be bankrolled like many other clubs, it doesn't mean we are being taken for a ride.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

I am sorry. I was talking about experience at the highest level being of value earlier in the thread hence my squad inexperience point. I thought you had seen that. That is why I made the comment. He is not experienced at the highest level. Hennesey in 2008 was. Hahnemann was

In 2008 - I brought the comparison up originally as surely that is the best place to look, at the start of the season when we won this league, and when we had a similar or even slightly lower average age to what we have now regarding our first XI - Hennessey had a loan spell at Stockport, one season in the Championship and a handful of Welsh caps behind him. Hahnemann wasn't here. Ikeme was our back up keeper although he hadn't started a single league game for us at the time.

 

[Deleted Cyber]

Hennesey - International
Ebanks Blake - Man Utd
Craddock - Sunderland and Stoke premier
Foley- U21 international
Stearman U21 international
Keogh- full international

I am not fight picking but that squad did have more experience of playing at a higher level than our current sqaud. Especially true if you take Edwards out of it as he is still a Wales player! The point re Hahnemman was to show the progress the following year. This is why I dont have Cyberman on the back of my shirt!

 

[PuntsWolf]

Hennesey - International
Ebanks Blake - Man Utd
Craddock - Sunderland and Stoke premier
Foley- U21 international
Stearman U21 international
Keogh- full international

I am not fight picking but that squad did have more experience of playing at a higher level than our current sqaud. Especially true if you take Edwards out of it as he is still a Wales player! The point re Hahnemman was to show the progress the following year. This is why I dont have Cyberman on the back of my shirt!

I don't want to get involved or pick sides, but if I was on your side I'd still laugh at that as evidence of experience.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

Ebanks-Blake - Man Utd :icon_lol:

I'll have Afobe and Martinez from this year's team from Arsenal then and Coady from Liverpool. Iorfa and Hause might be U21 internationals in a week's time, Ikeme might be a full international, they're all in the squads. That would be a very strange way to measure experience though.

 

[Deleted Cyber]

I don't want to get involved or pick sides, but if I was on your side I'd still laugh at that as evidence of experience.

I agree with you and yet its more than we have now!

 

[The Saturday Boy]

Ikeme - international
Ojo - Liverpool
Afobe - Arsenal and U21 international
ALF - Reading Premier League
Edwards - full international
Iorfa - U21 international

 

[Deleted Cyber]

Ebanks-Blake - Man Utd :icon_lol:

I'll have Afobe and Martinez from this year's team from Arsenal then and Coady from Liverpool. Iorfa and Hause might be U21 internationals in a week's time, Ikeme might be a full international, they're all in the squads. That would be a very strange way to measure experience though.

Ok man utd tenious but he bid play in Belgium about 10 games for Antwerp. We will see I bet you £50 we dont win the league this year. You up for it DW?

 

[PuntsWolf]

McDonald - PL
Coady - Liverpool

It's s fun game this, Cyber is having a mare.

 

[Lord Knows]

The key question I ask is was Conor Coady worth using the vast majority of the transfer budget or should Wolves have spread the cash in more directions.

 

[MARKakaJIM]

I don't think Wolves have really got this whole 'living within their means' thing quite right at the moment.

If you're accepting that the chairman isn't going to bankroll the club, fair enough that's his choice, then you've got to be pretty shrewd with what money you have got, I'm not sure that's the case at Wolves as often as it should be.

Swansea and Southampton often get held up as the poster boys for this sort of strategy, rightly so in my opinion, but you look at how their squad management differs to that at Wolves, the recruitment philosophy is pretty similar, trying to unearth a few gems for reasonable money but their approach to outgoing transfers seems completely different. Wolves seem to have it set in their mind that they must hold onto their prized assets at all costs, as seen with Sako being allowed to run his contract down to leave on a free whilst having a last roll of the promotion dice, the other two however seem much more open minded to players leaving, even if they'd rather they stayed. They entrust their recruitment team to source adequate replacements for those sales which opens up an extra stream of revenue, replacing that which other clubs may get from their chairman/owner.

It could have been a romantic football story for Wolves to have got promoted under Sako power last season, to have him finally get to the Premier League with Wolves after enduring some shit years but ultimately it wasn't to be and now Wolves are left without that talent and the funds to replace him. Perhaps they would've been better served taking the £5m or so they could've perhaps got for him last summer and spent that on a couple of other players, you're going to piss a few fans off to begin with but if you get the replacements right then they'll soon forget about Bakary whoever the fuck. Without accepting that some sales will be neccessary for the good of the team/squad/club overall then you're consigning yourselves to continually scrapping around the bargain bin and hoping you cobble enough raw talent together at the same time to jump a division and hopefully be in a position to increase your revenue that way.

It'd be great to see Wolves emulate what Swansea and Southampton have achieved, a seemingly endless supply of talent coming in with enough of them begrudgingly sold off to keep the finances the right side of zero, I don't think they've got the right people in charge to make that happen at the moment though.

 

[Deleted Cyber]

I tend agree to an extent. Generally, over the long term, clubs that spend are the ones that get promoted.

What this window has shown us is that Morgan has no intention of spending. At the start of the window, we were in a great position to push on and we've done nothing to look like we intended to. Yes, sometimes big money signings don't work, but shows ambition from the owner.

When you look at some of the other clubs have done during the window then it gives us an idea where we will be in the next 5 years or so.

Quite disappointed.

Have to agree with this. Sorry I didnt post it earlier

 

[PuntsWolf]

Ok man utd tenious but he bid play in Belgium about 10 games for Antwerp. We will see I bet you £50 we dont win the league this year. You up for it DW?

For one you'd have to give decent odds for this to be even worth it, not exactly an evens bet even if we'd spent 20m like Derby.

And your argument for saying we won't win the league is poor. It's like saying Ferrari won't win the championship as they have the wrong sponsor, ignoring all the other confounding factors.

 

[Deleted Cyber]

McDonald - PL
Coady - Liverpool

It's s fun game this, Cyber is having a mare.

you want a £50 bet too? We wont win the league because we arent good enough and dont have enough quality yet. It may come. There is potential but it could and should have been so much so so much better from a club with 25k every week. Thats twice Bournemouths gate. Please feel free to throw it back and I will happily eat humble pie but given our pretty ordinary start to the season we have not built on the first 5 months of 2015 particularly well. I want us to be a premier league club competing yet balancing the books. I think we are a bit thrifty having been bitten before. If our transfer budget really was 2-3 million then we may as well pack up and resign ourselves to a lifetime of Championship mediocrity and I can stop my deluded dreams of premier league stability.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

Ok man utd tenious but he bid play in Belgium about 10 games for Antwerp. We will see I bet you £50 we dont win the league this year. You up for it DW?

I don't think we'll win the league or even finish in the top two. My only point here was that arguments about experience (or a lack of) don't hold when you look at what got us promoted under Mick. The average age, general profile of the squad in terms of games played/previous clubs, scope of transfer dealings was really not very different to what we've done this year.

 

[Penk Wolf]

I don't think Wolves have really got this whole 'living within their means' thing quite right at the moment.

If you're accepting that the chairman isn't going to bankroll the club, fair enough that's his choice, then you've got to be pretty shrewd with what money you have got, I'm not sure that's the case at Wolves as often as it should be.

Swansea and Southampton often get held up as the poster boys for this sort of strategy, rightly so in my opinion, but you look at how their squad management differs to that at Wolves, the recruitment philosophy is pretty similar, trying to unearth a few gems for reasonable money but their approach to outgoing transfers seems completely different. Wolves seem to have it set in their mind that they must hold onto their prized assets at all costs, as seen with Sako being allowed to run his contract down to leave on a free whilst having a last roll of the promotion dice, the other two however seem much more open minded to players leaving, even if they'd rather they stayed. They entrust their recruitment team to source adequate replacements for those sales which opens up an extra stream of revenue, replacing that which other clubs may get from their chairman/owner.

It could have been a romantic football story for Wolves to have got promoted under Sako power last season, to have him finally get to the Premier League with Wolves after enduring some shit years but ultimately it wasn't to be and now Wolves are left without that talent and the funds to replace him. Perhaps they would've been better served taking the £5m or so they could've perhaps got for him last summer and spent that on a couple of other players, you're going to piss a few fans off to begin with but if you get the replacements right then they'll soon forget about Bakary whoever the fuck. Without accepting that some sales will be neccessary for the good of the team/squad/club overall then you're consigning yourselves to continually scrapping around the bargain bin and hoping you cobble enough raw talent together at the same time to jump a division and hopefully be in a position to increase your revenue that way.

It'd be great to see Wolves emulate what Swansea and Southampton have achieved, a seemingly endless supply of talent coming in with enough of them begrudgingly sold off to keep the finances the right side of zero, I don't think they've got the right people in charge to make that happen at the moment though.

Maybe wages are the issue. If you sold Sako for £5m and brought in two players on £2.5m then you'll probably doubling your wages.

Same with Afobe. If you sold him for £15m and brought in 5 players, your wage bill will probably go up 5x.

 

[Parkins left foot]

First day properly back at work & manic all day so didn't have time to even look at what was going on (even if I had the inclination - which I didn't) & glad that I wasn't able to.

Stearman going is not such a big deal & it has always been clear that we were not going to start throwing out massive transfer fees on anyone, so why anyone is surprised when we don't is beyond me.

The search for a striker has only come due to Nouha's injury, which tbh could have equally occurred in the Bolton match after the window closed. We would then have been looking at loans which is what we are likely to do now, so no change then. VLP staying is neither here or there as wouldn't expect him to feature that much unless we are desperate (he has flattered to deceive since arriving).

Will we get promoted with this squad - probably not, but you could say that about every other team in the Championship (though clearly 3 teams will finally make it). Spending big doesn't guarantee it, nor does buying experience as this division is a lottery at the best of times.

Keeping Afobe was important & we have done that. Now just to get him refocused & kick on

 

[slink]

Knew i shouldn't have read this thread, i'm off to buy some rope. I really don't think it's been that bad a window at all but then i was never under the impression that we would replace Sako because i didn't think we could and i'm more than happy with Hause and EEL playing centre back as i think they are good enough and will only get better, particularly Hause. More than pleased with the midfield signings of Coady and Wallace who both add something and Byrne and Ojo give us pace and end product when they get into positions. Ojo has looked promising on that front so far.

Would i rather we spent a little bit more money, yes of course i would but i want that to be on the right players and i'm definitely glad we haven't spent some of the money other teams have because i don't think they have spent wisely. We do need another forward now for me and it looks like that will be on loan but ALF, Afobe and Bright are enough for the time being. Maybe we should be looking at buying a new striker come January because who knows how Dicko will come back.