REFERENDUM RESULTS AND DISCUSSION THREAD

[FrankMunro-371]

But I wasn't celebrating Paddy, just pointing out that the predicted Armageddon has not happened.

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

I wasn't saying you were having a party, so apologies if that is how the post seemed! What I was saying was we are moving a little quickly in ASSUMING armageddon may not happen. Make sense?

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

Donald Trump hasn't led the United States into a major diplomatic or military dispute yet, doesn't mean it isn't likely to happen.

Much of the 'armageddon' was predicated on Gideon threatening an Emergency Budget like the amazing Chancellor he was, of course it never came to pass because his boss quit and then he got sacked. We also have the Bank of England to thank for propping the economy up.

 

[Penk Wolf]

But I wasn't celebrating Paddy, just pointing out that the predicted Armageddon has not happened.

Truck hire companies are finding the pinch which tells you there is a lot of confidence out there as companies are buying rather than hiring.

Scania UK have sold more trucks than any other country.

Volvo construction usually have a quiet January and February, that hasn't happened this year.

All signs are very positive, but I guess they still would have been if remain had won.

I assume most of what we export is stuff that can't be bought locally, that won't change over night and if it can then it will be the same with what we import.

I really don't think the economy will crash when we eventually leave.

 

[Del Woppio]

Back in the real world, the predicted Armageddon of voting to leave has not materialised.

Can you name one positive thing that's happened since (and because of) the vote?

 

[Trips]

http://news.sky.com/story/it-will-t...u-migrant-jobs-says-brexit-secretary-10777345

David Davis backing up what has been said on here recently - "Years & Years until British people can fill low-skilled roles"

 

[Deleted Cyber]

Can you name one positive thing that's happened since (and because of) the vote?

Cameron quit
Farage Quit
Gideon Sacked
Boris shafted and not pm
Lots of very smug politicians who thought remain was a shoe in left with serious egg on their face.

In all seriousness we keep saying this, but we dont know what we dont know and as no one has ever left the EU before we will be breaking new ground. It is for this reason I believe there should be a Purdah or similar around brexit. Comments by Junckers et al really are not helpful at all given how tense the subject is among the 16.5 remain voters who cant believe they lost or the 17 million leave voters who still cant believe they won. A little sensitivity and let the negotiations happen would be good both for the UK and the EU.

 

[Deleted Cyber]

http://news.sky.com/story/it-will-t...u-migrant-jobs-says-brexit-secretary-10777345

David Davis backing up what has been said on here recently - "Years & Years until British people can fill low-skilled roles"

Which is actually what most forward thinking leave voters have said all along but its a lot easier to be portrayed by some as saying "we hate all immigrants" and" british jobs for British people" when the reality is quite the opposite. London would be at a standstill without migrant labour. Proper controls on the freedom of movement seems to be what the vast majority want to see here and to ensure, however minimal, that benefit fraud and any other piss taking that gets media tongues wagging and programme makers salivating is eradicated.

 

[Johnny75]

Cameron quit
Farage Quit
Gideon Sacked
Boris shafted and not pm
Lots of very smug politicians who thought remain was a shoe in left with serious egg on their face.

In all seriousness we keep saying this, but we dont know what we dont know and as no one has ever left the EU before we will be breaking new ground. It is for this reason I believe there should be a Purdah or similar around brexit. Comments by Junckers et al really are not helpful at all given how tense the subject is among the 16.5 remain voters who cant believe they lost or the 17 million leave voters who still cant believe they won. A little sensitivity and let the negotiations happen would be good both for the UK and the EU.

So nothing then.

 

[visage]

Cameron quit
Farage Quit
Gideon Sacked
Boris shafted and not pm
Lots of very smug politicians who thought remain was a shoe in left with serious egg on their face.

In all seriousness we keep saying this, but we dont know what we dont know and as no one has ever left the EU before we will be breaking new ground. It is for this reason I believe there should be a Purdah or similar around brexit. Comments by Junckers et al really are not helpful at all given how tense the subject is among the 16.5 remain voters who cant believe they lost or the 17 million leave voters who still cant believe they won. A little sensitivity and let the negotiations happen would be good both for the UK and the EU.

Do you think there should be a binding second vote once negotiations are complete and we know exactly what we're getting?

 

[Deleted Cyber]

Do you think there should be a binding second vote once negotiations are complete and we know exactly what we're getting?

No. We have voted leave so leave we must or it makes a mockery of the whole process to date, shabby as it is. In hindsight that would have been a better tabled referendum. At least you would have known the facts from both sides.

 

[Deleted Cyber]

So nothing then.

I think many would see those as positive even if my tongue was in my cheek

 

[Johnny75]

I think many would see those as positive even if my tongue was in my cheek

It's a balance isn't it? Armageddon hasn't happened and neither has anything good so neither side can say the vote was wrong absolutely until we actually exit in 2 years.

All this crowing from Leavers is wearing thin and pissing people off. The ignorant should shut the fuck up if they can't give us a plan.

 

[So Long Architect]

Would the purdah idea extend to not referring to Brexit as a "liberation" and a temporary suspension of "jokes" about having beaten the Germans twice already?

 

[visage]

No. We have voted leave so leave we must or it makes a mockery of the whole process to date, shabby as it is. In hindsight that would have been a better tabled referendum. At least you would have known the facts from both sides.

Even if the deal we end up with is significantly different to what was suggested?

Surely if people voted for X but get Y then the vote cannot be seen as endorsement?

 

[ProgWolf]

As we are Leaving the EU, it would nice to hear from people who voted to Remain, particularly our MP's, on how they will now help to get the best possible deal for the UK. I think there are many remain voters that struggle with this, as they are being asked to facilitate or help to bring about something that they don't want. Instead many of them prefer to telling Leave voters that they have made a big mistake. Even if that's true, that horse has bolted now. If they have nothing constructive to offer, then what else CAN they offer ?

 

[Tony Towner]

Which is actually what most forward thinking leave voters have said all along but its a lot easier to be portrayed by some as saying "we hate all immigrants" and" british jobs for British people" when the reality is quite the opposite. London would be at a standstill without migrant labour. Proper controls on the freedom of movement seems to be what the vast majority want to see here and to ensure, however minimal, that benefit fraud and any other piss taking that gets media tongues wagging and programme makers salivating is eradicated.

I think that's a fair comment, I'd say the flaw is how many of those that voted leave would fall into your "most forward thinking" category, I'd suggest a minority and that's not what the majority voted for.

 

[Johnny75]

As we are Leaving the EU, it would nice to hear from people who voted to Remain, particularly our MP's, on how they will now help to get the best possible deal for the UK. I think there are many remain voters that struggle with this, as they are being asked to facilitate or help to bring about something that they don't want. Instead many of them prefer to telling Leave voters that they have made a big mistake. Even if that's true, that horse has bolted now. If they have nothing constructive to offer, then what else CAN they offer ?

The onus is on the Leave camp to give us a plan we can discuss.

So don't pass the buck.

 

[So Long Architect]

As we are Leaving the EU, it would nice to hear from people who voted to Remain, particularly our MP's, on how they will now help to get the best possible deal for the UK. I think there are many remain voters that struggle with this, as they are being asked to facilitate or help to bring about something that they don't want. Instead many of them prefer to telling Leave voters that they have made a big mistake. Even if that's true, that horse has bolted now. If they have nothing constructive to offer, then what else CAN they offer ?

I would imagine most Remain voters would like to see our relationship change with the EU as little as possible, as they didn't think there was much wrong with it in the first place and that this would produce the best long-term outcome for the UK. It seems unrealistic to expect them to become cheerleaders for a process they think is fundamentally a mistake.

 

[The Saturday Boy]

As we are Leaving the EU, it would nice to hear from people who voted to Remain, particularly our MP's, on how they will now help to get the best possible deal for the UK. I think there are many remain voters that struggle with this, as they are being asked to facilitate or help to bring about something that they don't want. Instead many of them prefer to telling Leave voters that they have made a big mistake. Even if that's true, that horse has bolted now. If they have nothing constructive to offer, then what else CAN they offer ?

The government has said they won't be giving a running commentary on negotiations, even to MPs, so the vast majority aren't going to be in a position to help or facilitate anything. As Johnny says, it's a bit rich for someone who voted leave to cast aspersions on those who voted remain given that the leave camp's plan and vision was little more than milk and honey during the campaign and since then they gave admitted that the honey isn't going to happen and the milk is powdered.

Most committed leave voters are very wary of a second referendum despite the fact that at the end of the negotiations we will know exactly what we are getting. A second referendum would be more democratic than the first given it would have a known outcome. For the life of me I can't work out why the leave side are so against democracy.