Wolves 2-1 Arsenal: Verdict Thread

[Paul]

I got headbutted by a police horse the once, does that mean I could play with you gangster fans ???

 

[Wilf Wolf]

I got headbutted by a police horse the once, does that mean I could play with you gangster fans ???

Neigh!

 

[Kenny]

So Arsenal saying they will appeal the Luiz red card

 

[northfield wolf]

If the horse got concussion, yes.

 

[YoungWolf]

The best thing is how salty the entire Arsenal fanbase has been. I am having some great fun here

 

[Deleted Cyber]

So Arsenal saying they will appeal the Luiz red card

Don’t blame them. Worth a shot.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

So Arsenal saying they will appeal the Luiz red card

He was unfortunate but:

- Did he try to play the ball? No
- Did he foul Willian? Yes
- Was it an obvious goalscoring opportunity? Yes

So I don't fancy their chances.

Leno is just a moron, what on earth was he thinking.

 

[The Bear]

Arteta claiming he's watched it ten times and didn't see any contact.

So why did Luiz stumble and fall over then?

 

[MARKakaJIM]

The Semedo runs were good, but we can’t give the ball away like we did today. Adama and Podence were so wasteful, and then with no Donck in the team and Moutinho getting quite high up the pitch we were so open.

The 4-2-3-1 we played today is poles apart from the 3-4-3 we played at the weekend. Why are they so different, they don’t need to be and that’s why it looks “chaotic”. But if we didn’t the ball away so cheaply it wouldn’t be so much of a problem.


Kept pressing out of the back 4 on the edge of our area and Adama wasn’t doing the tracking back so just a gaping hole for them to play into and get in behind. He’d have been better just standing still maintaining shape forcing them wide and requiring them to do something to beat him/get a cross in.

It’s honestly basic FB play. “Don’t get sucked in” the classic Sunday league shout.

There was one opening in the first half where it showed the difference in mentality between the members of the backline.

Boly had got drawn out by someone in the middle and then it went across towards Arsenal's left and Semedo did exactly the same, stepped out towards the ball even though there was already a bloke on his shoulder looking to get in behind. They showed a replay that looked right across the line and you'd got Coady and Kilman holding the line with the other two miles ahead, completely taking themselves out of the game and leaving gaping holes to be played through. You can get away with it to an extent when it's the back three, the wingbacks are going to be in wider/more advanced positions if they do it so less immediate risk of being beaten and as long as Boly is the only centre half going that way it's usually fairly straight forward for Coady to cover across. In a back four they can't be that disjointed though, you can't get drawn in so easily when it leaves a gap to get straight through into the area behind you with no spare man to cover it off.

I think sometimes Coady makes it worse by being too far the opposite way though, he rarely looks to step up and engage unless he has no other choice so if he's dropping off, the way you'd expect him to in a back three, and your other centre half goes after the ball like a terrier in a back garden kick about then you're going to end up with massive gaps that are far too easy to play through.

 

[northfield wolf]

Fuck Luiz, it was payback time tonight.

 

[redvictor]

The clip i saw it was hard to see if he did or didn't, but to be fair WJ couldn't really dive the way he did. Luiz must have clipped his heel, however little it was.

 

[oslowolf]

1st double over Arsenal since 1978/79 season

if traore wants to leave I'll help him pack. hasn't seemed to learn a thing since we bought him.

He can create chances alone. That is why we have sign him. And he is good at it.

 

[darlowolf64]

The clip i saw it was hard to see if he did or didn't, but to be fair WJ couldn't really dive the way he did. Luiz must have clipped his heel, however little it was.

Clear contact by Luiz’s knee on Jose

 

[MARKakaJIM]

He was unfortunate but:

- Did he try to play the ball? No
- Did he foul Willian? Yes
- Was it an obvious goalscoring opportunity? Yes

So I don't fancy their chances.

Leno is just a moron, what on earth was he thinking.

By the letter of the law I don't think there can be any real argument about Luiz's red card, though I do think in this case he's a little harshly done by the wording of the double jeopardy get out.

I think the wording relates to an honest attempt to play the ball or something similar as the reasoning to withhold the red card, obviously with the intention of stopping people just tripping people up when they're clear through, but in a situation like this I don't think there was anything intentional or cynical at all from Luiz, just bad luck to make contact as their runs crossed. So whilst he's obviously not made any honest attempt to win the ball, he hasn't actually made any attempt to do anything untoward either in my opinion, which does seem a bit harsh.

The Leno is crackers though, granted his completely fucked it and not timed his jump to the run of the ball at all but don't compound that with a stupid handball, just hurl yourself into it and hope it doesn't drop back into Traore's path, throw a knee at it, try and fall onto the ball or something, whatever ungainly action you have to do to try and get some bodily contact and hope it's enough. Just don't blatantly handball it like an absolute moron.

 

[redvictor]

I got headbutted by a police horse the once, does that mean I could play with you gangster fans ???

Gangsters..lol Back in those days it was part and parcel of every match. Like pies and a pint, but more sharpened 10p's and half enders. We had laughs too. I remember Exeter City in the cup. It was cold and one of the guys stole a jacket and jeans off a washing line so he could stay warm. Stupid and pointless shit when you think back, but at the time we all laughed when he turned up with the stuff.

 

[darlowolf64]

He can create chances alone. That is why we have sign him. And he is good at it.

My quote

 

[redvictor]

By the letter of the law I don't think there can be any real argument about Luiz's red card, though I do think in this case he's a little harshly done by the wording of the double jeopardy get out.

I think the wording relates to an honest attempt to play the ball or something similar as the reasoning to withhold the red card, obviously with the intention of stopping people just tripping people up when they're clear through, but in a situation like this I don't think there was anything intentional or cynical at all from Luiz, just bad luck to make contact as their runs crossed. So whilst he's obviously not made any honest attempt to win the ball, he hasn't actually made any attempt to do anything untoward either in my opinion, which does seem a bit harsh.

The Leno is crackers though, granted his completely fucked it and not timed his jump to the run of the ball at all but don't compound that with a stupid handball, just hurl yourself into it and hope it doesn't drop back into Traore's path, throw a knee at it, try and fall onto the ball or something, whatever ungainly action you have to do to try and get some bodily contact and hope it's enough. Just don't blatantly handball it like an absolute moron.

Arteta on the Leno red. " You stupid fucker"..

 

[oslowolf]

Arsenal B though really. Loads of injuries. Look at the state of their bench tonight.

They had a Real Madrid player there.

 

[PuntsWolf]

There was one opening in the first half where it showed the difference in mentality between the members of the backline.

Boly had got drawn out by someone in the middle and then it went across towards Arsenal's left and Semedo did exactly the same, stepped out towards the ball even though there was already a bloke on his shoulder looking to get in behind. They showed a replay that looked right across the line and you'd got Coady and Kilman holding the line with the other two miles ahead, completely taking themselves out of the game and leaving gaping holes to be played through. You can get away with it to an extent when it's the back three, the wingbacks are going to be in wider/more advanced positions if they do it so less immediate risk of being beaten and as long as Boly is the only centre half going that way it's usually fairly straight forward for Coady to cover across. In a back four they can't be that disjointed though, you can't get drawn in so easily when it leaves a gap to get straight through into the area behind you with no spare man to cover it off.

I think sometimes Coady makes it worse by being too far the opposite way though, he rarely looks to step up and engage unless he has no other choice so if he's dropping off, the way you'd expect him to in a back three, and your other centre half goes after the ball like a terrier in a back garden kick about then you're going to end up with massive gaps that are far too easy to play through.

Spot on.

This is fundamentals from a defensive point of view. It’s what your taught when you first start playing 11 a side from someone’s Dad.

We can say “they aren’t used to playing in a back 4” but all of those players should know basic positional play in a 4. All of them (bar Coady, but he’s a clever bloke, and apparently was a CB at youth level) have played tons of games as CBs in senior football.

 

[MARKakaJIM]

Spot on.

This is fundamentals from a defensive point of view. It’s what your taught when you first start playing 11 a side from someone’s Dad.

We can say “they aren’t used to playing in a back 4” but all of those players should know basic positional play in a 4. All of them (bar Coady, but he’s a clever bloke, and apparently was a CB at youth level) have played tons of games as CBs in senior football.

It's a bit odd in a sense that Coady is the one with the most negative mentality in those situations, given than he's played a fair bit of senior football as a central midfield you'd expect it would've been more difficult to shift the mentality where he can put himself about a bit more and take more risk to win the ball knowing there is another line of defence behind him. I know he's much better rehearsed in that defensive role over the last few years but still seems strange that he's the least likely, when surrounded by people who have only ever played as defenders for the most part, to make the mistake of being too keen to try and steal the ball, leaving himself over exposed and out of position.

They need to balance it out sooner rather than later though if they want to be more assertive in games going forwards, was much easier to assess with the old low block as it was nearly always a case of dropping off, holding your line and keeping yourself between ball and goal. That doesn't work if you're trying to play higher up the pitch, you just end up stretching the pitch to the advantage of your opponent with huge gaps between the lines to be exploited, which we've seen happen already in some games this season. They need to be confident at times in pushing up as a unit and playing for offsides. Though it's a lot easier to have the confidence in doing that if you've got either or both of i) some pace in the backline to recover if it goes wrong ii) a keeper who's sharp enough off his line to pick off any overhit passes in behind, neither of which Wolves really have at the moment.