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[SLB]

Why would he come?

Well...money.

 

[Tony Towner]

As recently as last month there was a fairly wide consensus that Lage was the main problem, that he was holding the players back. The lack of uptick since his departure has seen a lot of other names dragged into the blame ring. Slowly the whole thing seems to be slowly unravelling, both in the performance of the relationship and the way it's being perceived by the fan base. The blame is slowly climbing the ladder, first Lage now Sellers, Shi getting in on the act too, it goes higher than all of them.

Mendes has often been brushed under the carpet whilst the going was good, I know you dissented more than other at times but I think even you'll admit to times you were content to go along with it when it bought advantages. This is his concept as much, if not more so, as it is Fosun's. If they had caught the football bug they would've looked to move away from him and done more their own way as time went by, if they were looking a pure investment a couple of years after promotion they should've sold with the increased value Mendes' connections had helped create. They've been played, he sold them a vision of some bold new way of owning and operating a football club but all it ended up with was another chequebook under his control, he'll be laughing all the way to the bank.

Might go and take a look back at the introduction of SLB to the forum as see where opinions were on the Mendes front way back when. Maybe even do a little scatter graph to see who was behind/ahead of the curve.

I don't need to do any research to know what my opinion of Mendes has been for the last 3 years ta.

He was very useful in the Championship and establishing us in the Prem, since then he went to a hindrance and now to an active drag. SLB got the shit he did for coming on and gloating that our club is fucked, hardly going to get a warm welcome for that is he? Just like the troll he is he's popped up again as it unravels.

Mendes is only part of the problem as was Lage, which if you'd like to check I also have said. The number 1 problem is the ownership and more particularly Shi. I don't think there's a plot from Mendes to sell us overpriced shit and still believe the theory that Fosun have a stake in his agency is a reason why that shouldn't happen - although he does take a fortune out of deals. I do think the lack of knowledge at senior levels means we fall back on him because they are incapable of doing it themselves and the vision changed post Covid from aspiration to staying on the PL gravy train - a strategy that at some point ends 1 way. What I and others were wrong about and didn't foresee was Fosun dismantling the structure around them and essentially leaving everything to a combination of Shi and Mendes.

I don't for instance think Nunes is a bad player, even though he looks like one, he's been mismanaged from the moment he got here, has lost confidence and without any history with the club, doesn't want to be here, that's on the way he's been treated. In an ideal world I'd love him to roll his sleeves up, kick a few people and show he cares, but we weren't signing that type of player and it's not 1985. His pedigree says he should have been a good signing, it's factors other than Mendes bleeding us dry that mean he hasn't been

 

[Lupollet]

I don't need to do any research to know what my opinion of Mendes has been for the last 3 years ta.

He was very useful in the Championship and establishing us in the Prem, since then he went to a hindrance and now to an active drag. SLB got the shit he did for coming on and gloating that our club is fucked, hardly going to get a warm welcome for that is he? Just like the troll he is he's popped up again as it unravels.

Mendes is only part of the problem as was Lage, which if you'd like to check I also have said. The number 1 problem is the ownership and more particularly Shi. I don't think there's a plot from Mendes to sell us overpriced shit and still believe the theory that Fosun have a stake in his agency is a reason why that shouldn't happen - although he does take a fortune out of deals. I do think the lack of knowledge at senior levels means we fall back on him because they are incapable of doing it themselves and the vision changed post Covid from aspiration to staying on the PL gravy train - a strategy that at some point ends 1 way. What I and others were wrong about and didn't foresee was Fosun dismantling the structure around them and essentially leaving everything to a combination of Shi and Mendes.

I don't for instance think Nunes is a bad player, even though he looks like one, he's been mismanaged from the moment he got here, has lost confidence and without any history with the club, doesn't want to be here, that's on the way he's been treated. In an ideal world I'd love him to roll his sleeves up, kick a few people and show he cares, but we weren't signing that type of player and it's not 1985. His pedigree says he should have been a good signing, it's factors other than Mendes bleeding us dry that mean he hasn't been

On the plus side, we are now average at e-sports and make over £4 a month from wolves music.

 

[1986]

I mentioned late last week that as a team threatened with relegation we were becoming less and less attractive to prospective Managers , mainly because we have no scoring power up front , almost zero on that front , and that will be very hard to change .
After yesterday the situation has becoming even more stark .

Assuming we are still actively looking - who will take us now ?

As a club - if we are desperate to stay in the PL - as we should be , then money has to be made available in January to a new Manager , either loans or outright purchase .
The notion that we refused this to Nuno and Beale, as was suggested , simply has to change , as it will in an evolving situation .

Nuno might still come - he's clearly our best bet given his knowledge .

 

[AndyWolves]

I'm not sure it's Mendes that's the problem as such, it's the way we've run the football side of the club that's been the issue - the relationship with Mendes is a symptom of that.

If we didn't have Mendes I don't think we would be in a better position. To be better, we need better football decision makers who would be able to leverage what Mendes can give us in a better way.

 

[Lupollet]

I mentioned late last week that as a team threatened with relegation we were becoming less and less attractive to prospective Managers , mainly because we have no scoring power up front , almost zero on that front , and that will be very hard to change .
After yesterday the situation has becoming even more stark .

Assuming we are still actively looking - who will take us now ?

As a club - if we are desperate to stay in the PL - as we should be , then money has to be made available in January to a new Manager , either loans or outright purchase .
The notion that we refused this to Nuno and Beale, as was suggested , simply has to change , as it will in an evolving situation .

Nuno might still come - he's clearly our best bet given his knowledge .

Villa can get Amorim for £10m: https://www.msn.com/en-gb/sport/foo...ease-clause-reduced-by-20-million/ar-AA13iyqK
That’s about half a hwang!

We then say there are no outstanding candidates?

Lets will muddle on with a coach who is outside the top 1000 coaches in the world ‘into 2023’.

Here’s why:

 

[Adrian Peckham Monk]

I'm not sure it's Mendes that's the problem as such, it's the way we've run the football side of the club that's been the issue - the relationship with Mendes is a symptom of that.

If we didn't have Mendes I don't think we would be in a better position. To be better, we need better football decision makers who would be able to leverage what Mendes can give us in a better way.

I agree. We would be in a far worse position without Mendes.

It seems to be forgotten that it is Fosun that have a stake in Gestifute, not the other way around. Someone making decisions at Wolves is responsible for any Mendes-related imbalance, and is the person blame should be directed at, not Mendes, who is an agent not our Director of Football.

 

[Lupollet]

I agree. We would be in a far worse position without Mendes.

It seems to be forgotten that it is Fosun that have a stake in Gestifute, not the other way around. Someone making decisions at Wolves is responsible for any Mendes-related imbalance, and is the person blame should be directed at, not Mendes, who is an agent not our Director of Football.

From the athletic today:

Sellars did not decide on any of Wolves’ summer recruits, although he and his scouting team championed the virtues of Nathan Collins and Boubacar Traore.

The arrivals — Goncalo Guedes, Matheus Nunes and Sasa Kalajdzic — were proposed by influential agent Jorge Mendes with only a confirmatory check by the staff at Compton Park.

If true.(which it almost certainly is), then sellars is a middle manager and a front for mendes.

This is all on Jeff.

 

[SLB]

I agree. We would be in a far worse position without Mendes.

It seems to be forgotten that it is Fosun that have a stake in Gestifute, not the other way around. Someone making decisions at Wolves is responsible for any Mendes-related imbalance, and is the person blame should be directed at, not Mendes, who is an agent not our Director of Football.

Well... That is the main problem. Mendes does become Director of Football on his network clubs. Depending on the level of influence, which tends to grow bigger and bigger as more and more transfers are made and more and more comissions are paid, Mendes starts to call all the shots.

From transfers to managers and yes, i dare to say it, even starting elevens.

 

[MARKakaJIM]

I don't need to do any research to know what my opinion of Mendes has been for the last 3 years ta.

He was very useful in the Championship and establishing us in the Prem, since then he went to a hindrance and now to an active drag. SLB got the shit he did for coming on and gloating that our club is fucked, hardly going to get a warm welcome for that is he? Just like the troll he is he's popped up again as it unravels.

Mendes is only part of the problem as was Lage, which if you'd like to check I also have said. The number 1 problem is the ownership and more particularly Shi. I don't think there's a plot from Mendes to sell us overpriced shit and still believe the theory that Fosun have a stake in his agency is a reason why that shouldn't happen - although he does take a fortune out of deals. I do think the lack of knowledge at senior levels means we fall back on him because they are incapable of doing it themselves and the vision changed post Covid from aspiration to staying on the PL gravy train - a strategy that at some point ends 1 way. What I and others were wrong about and didn't foresee was Fosun dismantling the structure around them and essentially leaving everything to a combination of Shi and Mendes.

I don't for instance think Nunes is a bad player, even though he looks like one, he's been mismanaged from the moment he got here, has lost confidence and without any history with the club, doesn't want to be here, that's on the way he's been treated. In an ideal world I'd love him to roll his sleeves up, kick a few people and show he cares, but we weren't signing that type of player and it's not 1985. His pedigree says he should have been a good signing, it's factors other than Mendes bleeding us dry that mean he hasn't been

I thought we were maybe all going back to look at our initial thoughts seen as I was nudged in that direction. Guess we don't all need to check how right or wrong we were then.

I don't think Fosun or Shi have dismantled anything, people have left the business of their own accord and they just haven't been adequately replaced. Whether that's because they just don't know how or are so invested in Mendes' football advice that they don't think it matters.

Again that Mendes relationship goes above Shi, that's all the way to the top of Fosun, Shi has no background in sport to act on his own knowledge outside of that. For all we know he's sending his concerns back up the food chain and being told that Gestifute is the Fosun link to football so stick with that, we don't know whether he's got the authority to move away from it and bring in better people at board level even if he wants to.

I don't think there's any conspiracy around Mendes, he's doing no different with Wolves than he had with a bunch of other clubs before but he's just got closer to ties here. At the outset Wolves were bottom of the pecking order of his clubs so they were going to be very unfortunate to get a dud, now they're in the most competitive league of any of them and it's more difficult to find the upgrades. Mendes moving around whoever is convenient/profitable for him isn't the targeted recruitment you need at this level. What was once a fairly symbiotic relationship, although always self centred on Mendes' behalf, is now very one sided.

I think the Nuno era is as much good fortune as anything else. The first roll of the Fosun/Gestifute dice was toss, half the players flopped and the managers were rubbish. Under Nuno there was a squad and a coach that were on the same page and everything went great for a while but then they found it difficult to evolve. Then we got another roll of the dice and it's more like what we saw the first time round, players coming in aren't really fitting the profile required to solve the problems in the squad and the management situation has become a farce.

Fosun have backed the wrong horse.

 

[SLB]

I thought we were maybe all going back to look at our initial thoughts seen as I was nudged in that direction. Guess we don't all need to check how right or wrong we were then.

I don't think Fosun or Shi have dismantled anything, people have left the business of their own accord and they just haven't been adequately replaced. Whether that's because they just don't know how or are so invested in Mendes' football advice that they don't think it matters.

Again that Mendes relationship goes above Shi, that's all the way to the top of Fosun, Shi has no background in sport to act on his own knowledge outside of that. For all we know he's sending his concerns back up the food chain and being told that Gestifute is the Fosun link to football so stick with that, we don't know whether he's got the authority to move away from it and bring in better people at board level even if he wants to.

I don't think there's any conspiracy around Mendes, he's doing no different with Wolves than he had with a bunch of other clubs before but he's just got closer to ties here. At the outset Wolves were bottom of the pecking order of his clubs so they were going to be very unfortunate to get a dud, now they're in the most competitive league of any of them and it's more difficult to find the upgrades. Mendes moving around whoever is convenient/profitable for him isn't the targeted recruitment you need at this level. What was once a fairly symbiotic relationship, although always self centred on Mendes' behalf, is now very one sided.

I think the Nuno era is as much good fortune as anything else. The first roll of the Fosun/Gestifute dice was toss, half the players flopped and the managers were rubbish. Under Nuno there was a squad and a coach that were on the same page and everything went great for a while but then they found it difficult to evolve. Then we got another roll of the dice and it's more like what we saw the first time round, players coming in aren't really fitting the profile required to solve the problems in the squad and the management situation has become a farce.

Fosun have backed the wrong horse.

It never was. It never will be.

On the long term , every single club suffers the costs of the Mendes effect.

The examples are so many.

 

[MARKakaJIM]

From the athletic today:

Sellars did not decide on any of Wolves’ summer recruits, although he and his scouting team championed the virtues of Nathan Collins and Boubacar Traore.

The arrivals — Goncalo Guedes, Matheus Nunes and Sasa Kalajdzic — were proposed by influential agent Jorge Mendes with only a confirmatory check by the staff at Compton Park.

If true.(which it almost certainly is), then sellars is a middle manager and a front for mendes.

This is all on Jeff.

The Mendes link is well above Shi's pay grade.

 

[Tony Towner]

I don't think Fosun or Shi have dismantled anything, people have left the business of their own accord and they just haven't been adequately replaced

Christ that's naive

 

[prawnking]

So what do we think is the plan then? Is there one? Has it changed since yesterday?

You'd presume we won't just let Davis lose the remaining games before the World Cup?

 

[Johnny75]

So what do we think is the plan then? Is there one? Has it changed since yesterday?

You'd presume we won't just let Davis lose the remaining games before the World Cup?

Shi is going to let that happen.

But he should be getting a DoF in this week instead of being shit at his job.

 

[Tony Towner]

So what do we think is the plan then? Is there one? Has it changed since yesterday?

You'd presume we won't just let Davis lose the remaining games before the World Cup?

I wouldn't be surprised if Nuno is in by the weekend. I doubt they saw the flack that came yesterday on the horizon and will look for cover. SA league is on a break until after the WC now apparently. The only hesitancy I have in saying that is that Keen says there are members in the dressing room actively against it and more disharmony won't improve things, so I guess it depends who and how anti

 

[Johnny75]

Christ that's naive

I thought it was a very good comedy piece, made me belly laugh.

 

[Johnny75]

I wouldn't be surprised if Nuno is in by the weekend. I doubt they saw the flack that came yesterday on the horizon and will look for cover. SA league is on a break until after the WC now apparently. The only hesitancy I have in saying that is that Keen says there are members in the dressing room actively against it and more disharmony won't improve things, so I guess it depends who and how anti

If that is the case we can’t get Nuno back.

We need everybody pulling in the same direction. If Svensson still wanted the job I’d go and get him now. Somewhat controversially I’d go and get Rangnick to be DoF too.

I find it bizarre that Fosun will spend millions on tat but not on the most important role at the club.

 

[MARKakaJIM]

Christ that's naive

Dalrymple and Thelwell both found work pretty quickly didn't they, ie before they actually left Wolves. That aligns itself with it being their decision to leave rather than being turfed out, or maybe they're just super in demand and walk into high level jobs at the drop of a hat.

I don't see the malicious intent from Fosun that others do, particularly in regard to Shi, they're incompetent more than sinister. Their football club ownership model revolves entirely around Mendes and Gestifute, he got them into football, they don't go down any other route because they don't know any other way.

 

[prawnking]

Shi is going to let that happen.

But he should be getting a DoF in this week instead of being shit at his job.

I agree, but do clubs often change their senior team and direction so radically at this point in a season?

I'd be very surprised if Shi reacts to yesterday by getting rid of Sellars or reigniting the manager search tbh. Both would be massive u-turns and admission of judgement failure on his behalf?

They fucked up the manager search on its own, I can't see them even attempting to recruit for two senior positions simultaneously, let alone successfully