Liverpool (H) 16/9: Build-Up & Match Thread

[Alan]

Compared to the rest of the team who have all been amazing?

There aren't really any players who should feel undroppable at the moment.

 

[Tony Towner]

Equally they should feel like they are picked on merit /production

 

[Alan]

He got 2 assists in the last 25 minutes.

Fantastic! How'd those goals work out for us?

I've not seen enough from him in open play that makes me think he's actively making us a better side at the moment, despite what most think he is capable of. That's pretty much the long and short of it.

 

[Alan]

Equally they should feel like they are picked on merit /production

As above, merit and production are not always the same thing.

I don't think any of Neto's assists have been the sorts of play that no one else in our squad could manage.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

But you think Hwang - wide left in a midfield four - would be better in open play?!

I've got to hear this.

 

[Tony Towner]

2 of his 3 assists came from open play

 

[Elephant Pyjamas]

Fantastic! How'd those goals work out for us?

So the goals/assists don't count?

Even if you are only counting point wining assists, his assist in the prior game against Everton won us 3 points, and his ball in against United should have won us a point - if it wasn't for corruption/incompetence.

 

[Tony Towner]

I don't think any of Neto's assists have been the sorts of play that no one else in our squad could manage.

I'm out because this is just tripping, but ask yourself who else is delivering balls like the one for Sasa or Cunha and if they are capable of it, why aren't they doing it? Why has he more in 2 games than anyone else managed last year. The leading one whom was Moutinho he isn't here.

 

[Elephant Pyjamas]

Years of Adama getting (rightly) criticised for a lack of end product, and here is Neto providing end product but it being dismissed anyway.

 

[Johnny75]

As well as Neto getting dropped I can't believe people are dropping a Brazilian international for Doyle who is a good Championship level player.

Completely batshit.

 

[Lycan]

But you think Hwang - wide left in a midfield four - would be better in open play?!

I've got to hear this.

I think they're all going to struggle to create from open play if the lack of off the ball movement and interchanging of forward positions is any indicator of how O'Neil wants his teams to play.

Neto probably the most likely as he's the only one with good delivery or capable of creating something from nothing.

 

[Tony Towner]

He's been different increments of poor in all the league games except Utd, I don't think Doyle will prove to the player some think he will, but something needs freshening up, whether that's putting an extra man in there or replacing Gomes.

 

[Alan]

But you think Hwang - wide left in a midfield four - would be better in open play?!

I've got to hear this.

There's not that much between them at the moment in my mind. Neto has a few assists, Hwang has a couple of goals, most of which have amounted to nothing in the grand scheme of things. Hwang makes better runs off the ball, Neto makes better runs with it. If you don't want Hwang, that's fair enough I guess, but I'd rather him than Enso at the moment and I'm not sold on Sarabia out wide at this level.

Benching Neto would be more about making it clear he needs to be more consistent, we don't need any more mercurial shit in this team and certainly not from Pedro. He has to accept that and improve.

So the goals/assists don't count?

Not to our points haul they don't.

I'm out because this is just tripping, but ask yourself who else is delivering balls like the one for Sasa or Cunha and if they are capable of it, why aren't they doing it? Why has he more in 2 games than anyone else managed last year. The leading one whom was Moutinho he isn't here.

2 of Neto's assists come as we're throwing bodies forward very late in the match. One meant something, another didn't. What we need and should be expecting of Pedro is making an impact like that from standard patterns of play, during our practiced buildups and during counters. Even against Palace he still slows things down too much when he's receiving a pass; he checks back as much as anyone despite the fact that he's almost assuredly our best player at breaking an individual pressure with a dribble. But he doesn't. Why not?

A handful of assists when chasing a game don't suddenly change the fact that Pedro has been just as much a part of our scoring woes as anyone, and until we start getting that production from him in moments that really matter more consistently, he should be held accountable the same as anyone.

I've just realized that this makes Pedro my new Ruben. 6/10 innit.

 

[AndyWolves]

I find this odd.

And in the next breath you'll advocate for Hwang, i don't mean to dig you out, but it's all a bit odd.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

There's not that much between them at the moment in my mind. Neto has a few assists, Hwang has a couple of goals, most of which have amounted to nothing in the grand scheme of things. Hwang makes better runs off the ball, Neto makes better runs with it. If you don't want Hwang, that's fair enough I guess, but I'd rather him than Enso at the moment and I'm not sold on Sarabia out wide at this level.

Hwang's goals have both come off set pieces. He offers less than nothing in general play.

As for Doyle/Gomes (neither of whom have played for Brazil ) I'd just freshen it up in there, I'm not massively fussed either way. Joao is the better footballer of course but he hasn't been great so far.

 

[Alan]

Hwang's goals have both come off set pieces. He offers less than nothing in general play.

As for Doyle/Gomes (neither of whom have played for Brazil ) I'd just freshen it up in there, I'm not massively fussed either way. Joao is the better footballer of course but he hasn't been great so far.

As I say, not much between them. Pretty much every goal we've managed this season has some level of asterisk on it when comes to actual quality.

I disagree that Hwang offers "less than nothing", but you certainly can't use him as on outlet ball in the same way as Neto.

 

[Johnny75]

Oi you over there, none of that flair and mercurial shit.

We want you to be a bang average hard runner.

Got no time for that fancy Dan garbage'

Alladyce, Sam: How I would play with Madrid whilst drinking pints of gravy. 2001

 

[Alan]

One thing we all hopefully can agree on is that, be it Pedro, Hwang, whoever; our wide players would be helped massively by some actual center forward play. Which Fab has not really been providing.

 

[Johnny75]

Hwang's goals have both come off set pieces. He offers less than nothing in general play.

As for Doyle/Gomes (neither of whom have played for Brazil ) I'd just freshen it up in there, I'm not massively fussed either way. Joao is the better footballer of course but he hasn't been great so far.

Trust me to miss out the word future.

All of this is moot as we have Gary O'AlexNeil in charge anyway.

 

[Johnny75]

One thing we all hopefully can agree on is that, be it Pedro, Hwang, whoever; our wide players would be helped massively by some actual center forward play. Which Fab has not really been providing.

A style of play would be nice.