Keir Starmer at it again..

[leedswolf]

Whose land? Tax avoidance and the broken economics of British farming

Noise in the billionaire press about inheritance tax changes hides a basic fact: the non-farming rich own too much land

yorkshirebylines.co.uk

 

[Wellen Wolf]

Whose land? Tax avoidance and the broken economics of British farming

Noise in the billionaire press about inheritance tax changes hides a basic fact: the non-farming rich own too much land

yorkshirebylines.co.uk

That's a really helpful account as it is very clear and uses lots of real world examples and data. Thank you.

 

[Del Woppio]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1864241987484045582

How the actual fuck can you go on the radio to talk about something and not know how much it will cost/save/make ffs? I know they all do it, all the time, but fucks sake if any of us went into a meeting so ill prepared we'd get mullered. It's Nick Ferrari, you know exactly what he's going to do, get your numbers straight or just no show. Embarrassing.

 

[Kenny]

They seem to want avoid giving figures for anything to avoid being twatted further down the line

"You said it would cost £1bn but it cost £4bn"

"You said you would get immigration numbers down to below 100,000 but it's 101,000...you failed"

 

[Del Woppio]

Surely it's better optics to have been wrong on a costing, than say you've agreed on a project without costing it at all though. Even a wide ballpark would be acceptable if it's something novel like renationalisation

 

[Elephant Pyjamas]

They seem to want avoid giving figures for anything to avoid being twatted further down the line

"You said it would cost £1bn but it cost £4bn"

"You said you would get immigration numbers down to below 100,000 but it's 101,000...you failed"

Why can't they give figures?

It's not difficult.

 

[Tredman]

Why can't they give figures?

It's not difficult.

It is very difficult though, these are private operating companies within a labyrinthine privatised structure with all the difference parts of the railways operated (and owned) by different companies.

I don't know railways that well but the thought of renationalising the (much less complex) industries I work in would be an absolute nightmare in terms of understanding the layers of ownership.

 

[Elephant Pyjamas]

It is very difficult though, these are private operating companies within a labyrinthine privatised structure with all the difference parts of the railways operated (and owned) by different companies.

I don't know railways that well but the thought of renationalising the (much less complex) industries I work in would be an absolute nightmare in terms of understanding the layers of ownership.

I agree in this particular instance, but I work in the construction industry and as we all know projects can and are costed accurately (with some exceptions)

Labour just hiding and not committing on any level is cowardly.

 

[Tredman]

I agree in this particular instance, but I work in the construction industry and as we all know projects can and are costed accurately (with some exceptions)

Labour just hiding and not committing on any level is cowardly.

Those exceptions are usually pretty massive though and exactly the ones our media will use to bash the government over the head.

 

[Elephant Pyjamas]

Those exceptions are usually pretty massive though and exactly the ones our media will use to bash the government over the head.

Fair.

 

[sycophantia]

I'm a bit of a simpleton but in my head I have the initial costs of HS2 compared to whats been spent so far. I realise they're completely different entities but maybe the govt are wary because of this?

 

[MARKakaJIM]

I agree in this particular instance, but I work in the construction industry and as we all know projects can and are costed accurately (with some exceptions)

Labour just hiding and not committing on any level is cowardly.

Apples and oranges.

You know the different pricing mechanisms you'd use at different stages and the varying accuracy you get from them. This is equivalent of Stage 1 design at best isn't it? It's not like you can even be as accurate as benchmarking £/m2 because you don't really know the scope to any extent.

Then you've got the difference in the market that you're not buying products/services where there's some level of competition and a desire to sell. They're looking to takeover an entire company who might not even have any wish to cede control of their enterprise. Who knows what that could cost?

 

[Elephant Pyjamas]

Shouldn't really be even talking about it until it's at Stage 4 really....

 

[MARKakaJIM]

Shouldn't really be even talking about it until it's at Stage 4 really....

Then it starts getting expensive with you BSRIA boys wanting your specialists involved

 

[Wellen Wolf]

It is very difficult though, these are private operating companies within a labyrinthine privatised structure with all the difference parts of the railways operated (and owned) by different companies.

I don't know railways that well but the thought of renationalising the (much less complex) industries I work in would be an absolute nightmare in terms of understanding the layers of ownership.

Plus the tories will have deliberately over complicated legislation or agreed vague points with loopholes whatever the privatisation programme. I work in education and the situation regarding land and business ownership, board and employee legal rights and responsibilities, charities, religious schools, etc, etc is absolutely and deliberately shambolic ie free market. I guess that railways, freeports, health, etc are equally so.

 

[nimrod]

Apples and oranges.

You know the different pricing mechanisms you'd use at different stages and the varying accuracy you get from them. This is equivalent of Stage 1 design at best isn't it? It's not like you can even be as accurate as benchmarking £/m2 because you don't really know the scope to any extent.

Then you've got the difference in the market that you're not buying products/services where there's some level of competition and a desire to sell. They're looking to takeover an entire company who might not even have any wish to cede control of their enterprise. Who knows what that could cost?

yep, and given you're potentially taking away someone's future revenue/benefits there's a substantial element of negotiation as how that should be calculated and even who should do the calculation (eg an independent) nevermind an actual settlement or otherwise. if you publicly low ball your "estimate" to strategically lower the other parties expectations I doubt the likes of dick ferrari would appreciate that when it ends up higher.

 

[jlo]

The problem goes further than just the topic. It's the waffle and vagueness that puts people off mainstream politics and pushes them to the extremes (more often the right than the left, hence Farage's popularity)

 

[Del Woppio]

The problem goes further than just the topic. It's the waffle and vagueness that puts people off mainstream politics and pushes them to the extremes (more often the right than the left, hence Farage's popularity)

Yep. The whole 'media speak' bullshit of just plopping noncommital word salad out in every interview is precisely what's led to millions people switching off from the mainstream and saying 'they're all the same'.

 

[Wolftone]

Why don't they say something (that ought to cost four billion) will cost six billion, then bring it in at five billion and take the credit for bringing it in under estimate .
Thereby saving 'the taxpayer' money whilst actually costing them money for something they never had a clue or a say about.
Who gives a shit anyway?

 

[The Saturday Boy]

Renationalising the railways costs nothing as it will just be the current contracts expiring. Great British Railways will cost but before the election Labour were saying that GBR would save money £1.5bn annually after 5 years. It was Louise Haigh who said this. She has probably found another black hole.