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Israel-Palestine

Walshes Wolves said:
Obviously a crazy idea from Trump, but many people advocate a 2 state solution, but do the majority of Palestinians want that?
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Well, with Hamas, Hezbollah and Iran running Gaza through terror tactics, do the majority of palestinians actually get any semblance of choice.
 
Alan said:
Maybe it’s an optimistic opinion, but I’d guess they’d accept that at this point, if they felt they could trust it. But why would they?
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I just think that we created a problem, that is unsolvable in our lifetimes. I can have an opinion of how the problems started, but have no idea how it can be solved.
I think a 2 state solution is only viable, with a guarantee that there is complete security for Jewish people and it probably would be seen as a stepping stone, for the type of people that support Hamas, which is not a basis for reassuring Jewish people, for their safety and security.
 
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Frankly, the security of Israelis should not be the framing for any solution, given the disgusting delta in casualties between innocents on each side.

Israel also has nukes, so I think they’ll be okay.
 
pavlosmacwolf said:
Well, with Hamas, Hezbollah and Iran running Gaza through terror tactics, do the majority of palestinians actually get any semblance of choice.
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Well, Hamas are currently in year 19 of the five year term to which they were elected, so I wouldnt say so, no.
 
Alan said:
Frankly, the security of Israelis should not be the framing for any solution, given the disgusting delta in casualties between innocents on each side.

Israel also has nukes, so I think they’ll be okay.
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Nuclear weapons are famously useful as a deterrent against suicide bombers, yes.
 
visage said:
Nuclear weapons are famously useful as a deterrent against suicide bombers, yes.
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I’m not saying that the protection of Israeli “normies” isn’t important, but they are already the protected ones in the equation (relatively speaking). Framing peace talks around that shows the priorities globally haven’t actually changed regarding Palestinian lives.
 
Walshes Wolves said:
I just think that we created a problem, that is unsolvable in our lifetimes. I can have an opinion of how the problems started, but have no idea how it can be solved.
I think a 2 state solution is only viable, with a guarantee that there is complete security for Jewish people and it probably would be seen as a stepping stone, for the type of people that support Hamas, which is not a basis for reassuring Jewish people, for their safety and security.
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Hello Wolves mate. Maybe because this is a forum you have been brief.
I don't agree with the idea that 'we' created a problem. It started with the Balfour Declaration and the payoff for funding WW1.
I have zero issue with Jewish people having known many.
What about the safety and security of Palestinians in a small piece of their own land?
 
There were great strides being made towards Palestinian security prior to October 7th. Israel was normalising relations with many Arab states, and this would surely have led to eventual peaceful co-existance with the occupied territories.

The issue is that theres is one power in the ME that is implacably opposed to Israel, so via their proxies they instigated the murder of over 1000 Israeli citizens. They knew exactly how Israel would react. And so here we are today, with all that progress undone.

Iran and Likud are co-beneficiaries of the current situation, and neither of them are incentivised to fix it.
 
Can’t speak to the UK, but the US benefits massively from the continued conflict, as well.
 
Walshes Wolves said:
Then there won't be a 2 state solution. No Israeli Prime Minister, could sign a 2 state agreement, without guaranteed security, now and in the future for Jewish people.
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If the same standard is held for guaranteed security of the Palestinian people and state, sure.

Israel loves to “peacefully” force Palestinians off their land. That should be a vital concern.
 
The two-state solution never was one, really. Everything was predicated on the Palestinians being well-behaved enough for Israel to loosen the noose, but there was never any realistic way for that standard to be reached. The end result of the foundation of Israel as a specifically Jewish state with an ancient right to all of the land from the Jordan to the Med was always going to look something like this, even if the exact route taken was never exactly clear. Everything since 1948 has been leading inexorably towards this.

Ethnic nationalism, kids. Not even once.
 
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