Cycling Thread

[Johnny75]

Well, back to racing with the 2013 route announced.

Pyrenees are a bit meh from what I can see with only one summit finish and a day of further mountains with a descent finish (don't know the Cols yet so hard to judge that)

Really pleased to see Mont Ventoux return before a brutal last week in the Alps. The two ascents of Alpe D'Huez are there (but as part of a reasonably short stage). Then a stage from Bourg D'Oisans to Le Grand Bornand which will feature plenty of climbing. Nasty mountain time trial, before a final day of climbs around Annecy which features two new climbs that look like bastards.

Still a Paris finish. Versailles to Champs Elysses on the last day.

Doesn't really suit Wiggins, but until I see the full details of the mountain stages it will be hard to judge for sure.

I don't know enough about the teams make up but does it suit Frome or Hagan more than Wiggins and would he play second fiddle?

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

Looks like a Froome race to me. Really suits Contador and Andy Schleck.

Rumour that Wiggins might make the Giro his target for 2013, but I just looked at the route of that and that is evil in places (2 x Passo Gau, 1 x Stelvio, plus a trip into to France to climb the Mont Cenis, Telegraph and finish on the summit of the Galibier). Can't see it suiting Brad either.

 

[t3ch]

i'm just glad someone had the balls to take this case all the way in spite the intimidation tactics. the sad thing is how long he was allowed to get away with this.

Give me a break. Cycling is a shit sport that is wholly participated in by cheaters. You're glad someone had the balls to take this case? And for what purpose? This entire situation was nothing more than a witchhunt which served no purpose other than getting back at a guy who is notoriously disliked in the sport. And I don't even like or care about this guy! If they replaced the winner in his years with someone clean they'd have to go so far down the list of participants that one of the guys handing out water would be crowned champion.

I wonder how those who used him as an inspiration in their own health battles will feel now. Let down I would imagine.

Yeah, seriously. All he did was beat cancer and win the tour de France for years. Totally uninspired. I really don't understand people with your logic.

 

[Wombat del combate]

Wow, that's some utter shit you're spouting there.

 

[t3ch]

Feel the love!

 

[nimrod]

Give me a break. Cycling is a $#@! sport that is wholly participated in by cheaters. You're glad someone had the balls to take this case? And for what purpose? This entire situation was nothing more than a witchhunt which served no purpose other than getting back at a guy who is notoriously disliked in the sport. And I don't even like or care about this guy! If they replaced the winner in his years with someone clean they'd have to go so far down the list of participants that one of the guys handing out water would be crowned champion.

at least you've changed your tune from "where's the evidence" - keep the back pedaling going, mate. he bullied people out of the sport and I'm glad the case was pursued - it wasn't a victimless crime. read up on it.

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

Look. Fuck armstrong and the drug-laden ship he rolled in on. Cycling moves on. The new route is out and fans can start looking forward to the grand tours in 2013 and forgetting 1999-2005.

 

[t3ch]

at least you've changed your tune from "where's the evidence" - keep the back pedaling going, mate. he bullied people out of the sport and I'm glad the case was pursued - it wasn't a victimless crime. read up on it.

I change my tune according to what has actually happened. Or did you have first hand evidence that the rest of us didn't have back when I posted that? Evidence is out now. Or is evidence something that isn't allowed to change someones opinion?

Honestly I give so little of a shit about this guy that it pisses me off that I can't get away from hearing about it. I'm not going to argue anymore about it, but anyone who thinks he's the only guilty party in the sport is wrong.

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

Look at the whole thread mate. We all know Virenque, Ulrich, Riis, Contador, Landis, Hamilton, Fignon, Pantani and so on were dirty as well. Indeed, going back many years, Tom Simpson died because he was dirty, Ancquetil admitted being on shit all the time. Delgado failed a test and somehow got away with it, and there have been suspicions about Roche for a long time (sadly)

Of recent tour winners (say last thirty years) the only clean riders look to be Lemond (yay America!!!), Sastriere, Wiggins, Andy Schleck, Big Mig Indurain (although his support of Armstrong is making me waver there sadly) and that is about it. I hope Hinault was. I hope Poulidor was going back earlier. And Merckx. We know pretty much that Zoetemelk was dodgy as fuck.

Cycling was fucking filthy for a damn long time. Now, the Armstrong years look like the ultimate institutionalised doping and the sport has to move on. It is his control of the team and the peloton that is disturbing. Now that black mark is gone, I hope the sport can move on.

 

[t3ch]

I don't need to read the whole thread to know that Lance is a shithead.

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

So true, just wanted to know we weren't all picking on the Texan, as it were.

 

[nimrod]

I change my tune according to what has actually happened. Or did you have first hand evidence that the rest of us didn't have back when I posted that? Evidence is out now. Or is evidence something that isn't allowed to change someones opinion?

Honestly I give so little of a $#@! about this guy that it pisses me off that I can't get away from hearing about it. I'm not going to argue anymore about it, but anyone who thinks he's the only guilty party in the sport is wrong.

the evidence has been there for years, it's just that some people ignored it and some not surprisingly didn't want to believe it's true. it was there before this thread even started and has been referred to on previous threads. check out the people he went after before saying it's a waste of time. this had to happen as it should to any other guilty party.

 

[Knockout Ned]

the evidence has been there for years, it's just that some people ignored it and some not surprisingly didn't want to believe it's true..

I'm reading the reasoned decision, a lot of what is written is nothing new.

 

[Donegal Wolf]

Still not covering itself in glory and a whistleblowers get called scumbags. Seems there is only one scumbag and he looks as bad as Sepp Blatter.

http://www.theprovince.com/news/Head+cycling+body+calls+Armstrong+whistleblowers+scumbags/7430016/story.html

Nope worse then Sepp (not often you can type that), Sepp never got thrown out of an olympics, for riding in South Africa under a false name to beat the boycott.
Comes across as a horrible individual (never seen or heard a positive peace about him), cycling got what they deserved when appointing him to top of the UCI.
Likes his lawsuits against people who speak out against the UCI, Lemond & Landis in the past, his one against Kimmage which is particularly vindicitive as he is suing the journalist personally and not the publication (L'Equipe I think) as generally happens, and would have been a team-mate/collegue of Kimmage in the late 70's early 80's.

 

[Donegal Wolf]

Yeah, seriously. All he did was beat cancer and win the tour de France for years. Totally uninspired. I really don't understand people with your logic.

He has fucked up dodgeball as well, will never be able to watch that film in the same light again!

 

[t3ch]

So true, just wanted to know we weren't all picking on the Texan, as it were.

Are you talking about me or Lance? ; )

the evidence has been there for years, it's just that some people ignored it and some not surprisingly didn't want to believe it's true. it was there before this thread even started and has been referred to on previous threads. check out the people he went after before saying it's a waste of time. this had to happen as it should to any other guilty party.

Evidence has been there for years on many people. I still think this entire thing is a witchhunt in regards to the doping. Are there other aspects to the case? Well, sure, but that doesn't mean that Lance hasn't been specifically and repeatedly targeted throughout the years even when coming up innocent every time (dopers are always ahead of the tests). I just don't see the point. Is it happening to other guilty parties, or is the sport going to continue as-is, just without Lance?

He has fucked up dodgeball as well, will never be able to watch that film in the same light again!

Unforgivable!

 

[Johnny75]

Evidence has been there for years on many people. I still think this entire thing is a witchhunt in regards to the doping. Are there other aspects to the case? Well, sure, but that doesn't mean that Lance hasn't been specifically and repeatedly targeted throughout the years even when coming up innocent every time (dopers are always ahead of the tests). I just don't see the point. Is it happening to other guilty parties, or is the sport going to continue as-is, just without Lance?

You mean like Marion Jones, Balco and Barry Bonds, all victims of witch hunts? Flo-Jo and Lewis never got caught but the rumours were there and they were never chased as much. It needs the Canseco's, and Hamilton's of the world to expose the cheats and whilst all the publicity is on Lance it is what he and the others achieved that puts them there to be scrutinised. And when they all deny doping it makes them all look silly and untrustworthy along with the sport they're in. Rather than be anti-american it does seem as though the american athletes that get caught cry foul, or 'it wasn't me' and the press buy it because 'those dirty accusers can't possibly be right about our heroes' whereas the others are vilified instantly and treated as guilty before the B sample comes back. You've even got some american journalists with the view that doping in baseball can't be proved to be a performance advantage. Utter stupidity in the face of science.

I agree with Paddy, cycling needs to move on and if it had any real balls it would expunge all drugs cheats results going as far back as it can.

 

[t3ch]

Not sure that I can fault them for denying it, of course anyone being accused of breaking the rules would deny it or shift blame. Some obviously go farther than others. Have cheaters from other nations instantly said, "yeah I cheated, I'll just let myself out thanks"?

You're certainly right in that some get it harder than others. It's GOT to be hugely prevalent in the NFL but you never hear anything about it. I mean it just has to. They're very good at keeping it under wrap, apparently. But then you get baseball and cycling and OMG HOW COULD THEY??? Look at someone like A-rod who was a huge deal over steroids for a few weeks and had a huge live press conference, etc. but I don't feel like his reputation has taken a huge hit. Bond's really got it bad because he broke Hank Aaron's HR record. That just isn't right, man. Rubs a lot of people, myself included, the wrong way. It's unfortunate because even before steroids he was a very good player and could've stood on his own merit.

To be honest I wouldn't even care if drugs were legalized in sports just to get over all this BS anyway. Players and coaches are always going to look for an advantage, you may as well just let everyone make use of them and be done with it.

 

[t3ch]

 

[Donegal Wolf]

So UCI setting up an independant inquiry for what happened in cycling 98-05 (as if there was never any cheating before or after!), troublle with their inquiries in the past is that the appointed panel have been friends of the UCI, be interesting to see who does it this time.

Lawsuit against Kimmage for demafation of the UCI has been suspended (so dropped), would have been a good battle as he is said he had a jumbo jet full of people prepared to testify about dome of the UCI's goings on, not just with regards to Lance.