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Climate Change Debate

I always read this thread and I am very impressed with the knowledge people have. I just wondered though if anyone had read that the Arctic sea ice has been increasing for the last couple of years.
 
FrankMunro-371 said:
I always read this thread and I am very impressed with the knowledge people have. I just wondered though if anyone had read that the Arctic sea ice has been increasing for the last couple of years.
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The variability from year to year of sea ice makes this a bit of a red herring, the trend over the past few decades has been remarkably negative.
 
FrankMunro-371 said:
I always read this thread and I am very impressed with the knowledge people have. I just wondered though if anyone had read that the Arctic sea ice has been increasing for the last couple of years.
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Yup. It has. But one or two winters that are colder than normal don't refute the huge swathes of evidence that the world as a whole is warming.
 
It's clawed back a few years of loss, but long term it's on the way down still.
 
Johnny75 said:
You might be privvy but I'll bet you have had absolutely no say in how the innovation came about. I can't imagine any forward thinking company would. The way you come across on here means your conservative narrow minded approach doesn't let things happen. It's a dismissive type of posting which says if it does not work when it arrives at you then it is dismissed.

It is what makes me doubt you are in PD at all. And certainly nowhere near innovation as your dismissal of prototypes and your lack of understanding of the difference between iteration and revisions show. I would bet you're actually a QE and have been booted from the innovation team a long time ago. It would explain your dismissive posting on any new technologies and why you think others can't develop new technologies where you can't see how they will work.
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So you disagree with my view? You have absolutely no evidence that my professional competence is questionable. I expect an apology.
Come back to me when you can claim to move data over 100m of copper at 12Gbit/s. At the same time can you make that useful, can you keep the power management and deal with the thermal management? I've not even mentioned what I can do with that in terms of intellectual property value add.
On top of that there are global regulatorary requirements.
 
The Bear said:
It's clawed back a few years of loss, but long term it's on the way down still.
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The arctic polar record has only been reliablely logged since 1979. There is nothing as yet to show that there is some variation outside that which is naturally occuring. The North West Passage has opened on occasion over the last two centuries, hence the name.
Meanwhile in the Antarctic sea ice has increased, the West Antarctic Peninsular warming up most likely due to geo thermal activity.
Settled my arse.
 
So Long Architect said:
http://www.theguardian.com/environm...now-top-british-institutions-tell-governments

A letter to governments signed by various scientific bodies.

"The scientific evidence is now overwhelming that the climate is warming and that human activity is largely responsible for this change through emissions of greenhouse gases."

“While the threats posed by climate change are far-reaching, the ways in which we tackle them can be a source of great opportunity,” it states. “Capturing this potential quickly and effectively will drive economic progress. There are also significant additional benefits available, including food, energy and water security, air quality [and] health improvements.”

The signatories: Academy of Medical Sciences, Academy of Social Sciences, British Academy, British Ecological Society, Challenger Society for Marine Science, Geological Society, Institution of Civil Engineers, Institute of Physics, Institution of Chemical Engineers, Institution of Environmental Sciences, Learned Society of Wales, London Mathematical Society, Royal Astronomical Society, Royal Economic Society, Royal Geographical Society, Royal Meteorological Society, Royal Society, Royal Society of Arts, Royal Society of Biology, Royal Society of Chemistry, Royal Society of Edinburgh, Society for General Microbiology, Wellcome Trust, Zoological Society of London
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Hardly a comprehensive list and I suspect that the membership of some of those institutions might beg to differ. The Royal Society has certainly had questioning from it's membership.
 
Visage said:
Yup. It has. But one or two winters that are colder than normal don't refute the huge swathes of evidence that the world as a whole is warming.
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There are a few trading on the El Nino which is typically followed by a La Nina. It will be interesting to see where we are after a full cycle of ENSO with the PDO and the Atlantic turning negative.
 
HAzelGroveWolf said:
So you disagree with my view? You have absolutely no evidence that my professional competence is questionable. I expect an apology.
Come back to me when you can claim to move data over 100m of copper at 12Gbit/s. At the same time can you make that useful, can you keep the power management and deal with the thermal management? I've not even mentioned what I can do with that in terms of intellectual property value add.
On top of that there are global regulatorary requirements.
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And then you go and prove my point. I think this is why you are dismissive of new tech, you just can't think past it and have to use others work as your yardstick (somebody else's IP). It's pretty easy to work on products when you already know what is there, that's just 'me too' engineering.

Have you actually asked yourself 'how' renewables can be made more efficient because that's a true engineers disposition. Your negative (or dogmatic) Your dismissal of other tech is sad as you are all over the place in your argument and not once have you mentioned how or why current limitations can be overcome.
 
HAzelGroveWolf said:
Is that PV or thermal conversion? Either way it is a small contribution especially as the capacity is rather more than the real contribution.
Take a look here:
http://www.gridwatch.templar.co.uk/
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useful link but completely irrelevant to my post. still, you should be commended for being consistent on something.

doesn't say when the various plant goes offline though.

I like this on nuclear..."since the cost of fuel is insignificant, it pays them to sell at any price they can get" which to me translates as "which meant in 2011 some people reckoned building new nuclear was the cheapest form of electricity going as old plant required zero subsidy, forgetting of course the really really expensive build cost that in fact makes nuclear really expensive. oh dear, fucking idiots"
 
Johnny75 said:
And then you go and prove my point. I think this is why you are dismissive of new tech, you just can't think past it and have to use others work as your yardstick (somebody else's IP). It's pretty easy to work on products when you already know what is there, that's just 'me too' engineering.

Have you actually asked yourself 'how' renewables can be made more efficient because that's a true engineers disposition. Your negative (or dogmatic) Your dismissal of other tech is sad as you are all over the place in your argument and not once have you mentioned how or why current limitations can be overcome.
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I think you missed the point that we have technology that adds value that people wish to purchase. School boy physics tells me that there is a variation in wind and solar energy in a daily and variable cycle, there is a physical limit on the recoverable energy simply because the available energy density is low. Show me something that can achieve on a practical high load grid.
 
nimrod said:
useful link but completely irrelevant to my post. still, you should be commended for being consistent on something.

doesn't say when the various plant goes offline though.

I like this on nuclear..."since the cost of fuel is insignificant, it pays them to sell at any price they can get" which to me translates as "which meant in 2011 some people reckoned building new nuclear was the cheapest form of electricity going as old plant required zero subsidy, forgetting of course the really really expensive build cost that in fact makes nuclear really expensive. oh dear, fucking idiots"
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I think you know my opinion on failure to invest in R&D on nuclear power generation
 
HAzelGroveWolf said:
I think you missed the point that we have technology that adds value that people wish to purchase. School boy physics tells me that there is a variation in wind and solar energy in a daily and variable cycle, there is a physical limit on the recoverable energy simply because the available energy density is low. Show me something that can achieve on a practical high load grid.
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I didn't miss any point, you've gone and just answered something else entirely but this is nothing new. I'm not going to repeat myself and i think not answering my point is pretty embarrasing for a so called product development engineer.

As to your last sentence, I have no idea and that's the beauty of innovation, it will arrive when you and I least expect it and may be a complete step change to a technology, in upgrade to the grid, a storage facility for energy (ask Jolemai) in transport or simply a gearing system for a wind/ tidal turbine. The point is YOU don't know and I think you're finding this hard to accept.
 
Johnny75 said:
I didn't miss any point, you've gone and just answered something else entirely but this is nothing new. I'm not going to repeat myself and i think not answering my point is pretty embarrasing for a so called product development engineer.

As to your last sentence, I have no idea and that's the beauty of innovation, it will arrive when you and I least expect it and may be a complete step change to a technology, in upgrade to the grid, a storage facility for energy (ask Jolemai) in transport or simply a gearing system for a wind/ tidal turbine. The point is YOU don't know and I think you're finding this hard to accept.
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Hey, I do new technology, I love it when someone pulls the rabbit out of the hat.
You cannot however make policy for infrastructure today based on blue sky research that *may* lead to something in the future. The electrical power for meaningful purposes necessitates a load/source balanced AC system easily achieved with conventional thermal and to a point hydro power stations. Wind and solar necessitate inverters prior to practical application to the grid and often a lossy connection to the grid.
The AC technique is required for up and down conversion within the grid.
 
You can when the old sources are killing the planet.
 
HAzelGroveWolf said:
I think you know my opinion on failure to invest in R&D on nuclear power generation
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Would your arguments for investing in R&D on nuclear power not apply to investing in R&D in renewables? I.E. it's only through investment in R&D that renewables can become cost effective/cheap/scaleable?
 
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